DC/OL wish list

[jj22]

Reports out that Wink has entered the chat. Eb may be out.

I'll never get out my head what Burrow did to his defense. 

Maybe they are putting pressure on Eb.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(Yesterday, 02:18 PM)jj22 Wrote: Reports out that Wink has entered the chat. Eb may be out.

I'll never get out my head what Burrow did to his defense. 

Maybe they are putting pressure on Eb.

Yeah, that is my hope. I know Wink has done some good things with the Ravens but the way Burrow tore him up in that one game with 
all those great players sticks in my head as well. EB or Golden are the two guys I want that have been mentioned.

[007BengalsFan]

(Yesterday, 02:58 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Yeah, that is my hope. I know Wink has done some good things with the Ravens but the way Burrow tore him up in that one game with 
all those great players sticks in my head as well. EB or Golden are the two guys I want that have been mentioned.

Martindale like Saleh had a defense loaded with talent so its hard to tell how good he is when you have so much talent to work with.  Martindale leaves Baltimore but yet Baltimore still has one of the best defenses in the NFL even without Wink.  Martindale goes to the Giants and the Giants have the #18 ranked defense his first year then falls to #26 his second year.  Im not sold on Martindale but this sounds exactly like something the Brown family would do.  Bring in the Dayton guy because he is local even when there are better options out there.

[Nepa]

Bengals got an early head start on finding a DC with the firing of Lou way back on January 6, as soon as the season ended. But the longer this goes on, the more the competition there likely will be for a top DC, with teams hiring new head coaches and with the firing of DCs. I hope the front office is aggressive and outbids any competitors.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(Yesterday, 04:20 PM)007BengalsFan Wrote: Martindale like Saleh had a defense loaded with talent so its hard to tell how good he is when you have so much talent to work with.  Martindale leaves Baltimore but yet Baltimore still has one of the best defenses in the NFL even without Wink.  Martindale goes to the Giants and the Giants have the #18 ranked defense his first year then falls to #26 his second year.  Im not sold on Martindale but this sounds exactly like something the Brown family would do.  Bring in the Dayton guy because he is local even when there are better options out there.

That is what scares me 007. Having that much talent can skew things in a guy's favor. McDonald was actually the DC of the Ravens I 
thought was really good after Wink left. He is the one that gave Burrow fits at times anyways. Wink also had a lot of talent with the 
Wolverines the last couple of years.

At least Eberflus didn't have near as much talent on the Bears. Golden is still a question because it is college but regardless it is a ton 
of success and he has ties with Zac and the Bengals. 

(Yesterday, 04:21 PM)Nepa Wrote: Bengals got an early head start on finding a DC with the firing of Lou way back on January 6, as soon as the season ended. But the longer this goes on, the more the competition there likely will be for a top DC, with teams hiring new head coaches and with the firing of DCs. I hope the front office is aggressive and outbids any competitors.

Yes, sure would give the fans a major sign that the team has turned the corner if they actually outbid for a top DC.

[kevin]

(Yesterday, 12:29 PM)TecmoBengals Wrote: I've never given much attention as to how long the hiring timeline works for an NFL coordinator. A few thoughts posed as questions:

- Are interviews still ongoing?
- Is it possible ownership won't pay the salary a leading candidate is expecting? Will we see a Mike Brown is cheap narrative emerge?
- Is it possible Zac wants to interview a coach who is still actively coaching for a playoff team?

I'm a fan, so naturally I can't wait to see who Zac hired 

Bengals have interviewed Patrick Graham and DeMarcus Covington, both of Patriots backgrounds.  So Bengals quickly thought in terms of a Patriots type defense as over the last few years. 

I do not know who else Bengals have interviewed. I would guess they can't talk to Golden until after Notre Dame plays Ohio State, nor would Golden want to.  He's probably focuses on Winning Championship, and I wouldn't want him if he wasn't.   Now why would Golden leave Notre Dame ?   I can see for a head coach job, but not for the same job he has now only with Bengals.  Notre Dame is a Top Job.  This is why I doubt the Notre Dame or Oregon D Coordinators are leaving good jobs to come here.
  
So I think it comes down to who is looking for a job.  We know the fired Bears head coach who turned around awful  Colts defense in a few months.  Bengals are not offering a head coaching job.  It's a defensive coordinator job.  I do not think defensive coordinators already on NFL teams or top Colleges are going to leave a good thing to come to Cincinnati to do same job, not a promotion.   So which coaches are now out of a job OR are D coaches but D Coordinator would be a Level Up. I'll again mention Bengals interviewed Patrick Graham for D Coordinator, but Jaguars interviewed him for Head Coach, which is a better job.  

This isn't about Mike Brown being cheap either.  Coach Taylor said he fired these coaches.  Here is the problem. Bengals drafted some D players early, and Lou refused to play them.  Now that is fine if the Defense is good, but the Defense was awful.  That left Lou not playing top pick draft choices on bad terms with Taylor, Duke Tobin up to Mike Brown.  Lou not playing the players upper management gave Lou, put Lou on the hot seat when the Defense Lou was playing didn't produce....This is true of any job. If your bosses tell you to do something, and you do the complete opposite, you better be right, or you lose your job.  
 
I don't see Golden leaving Notre Dame to do the same job in Cincy.  Nor do I see the Oregon D Coordinator coming to Cincy.  Nor do I see NFL D Coordinators leaving their jobs to come to Cincy. ....I can see the Bears fired head coach needing a job and coming to Cincy.  I can see maybe Zimmer out of work coming back.  Either a coach just now out of work, OR a D coach that D Coordinator would be a promotion.  Do not rule out some D Coach already on The Bengals getting promoted from within. 
 
I think on Bengals side of interview.  We had a D Coordinator who refused to play our top draft picks.  If we hire you, we will insist you get our top draft picks on the field. Otherwise it defeats the draft and what the franchise is doing.  Now if Lou had a great defense, but he didn't, and so him not playing our top draft picks became hard to accept. 

[*jason*]

(Yesterday, 05:12 PM)kevin Wrote: Bengals have interviewed Patrick Graham and DeMarcus Covington, both of Patriots backgrounds.  So Bengals quickly thought in terms of a Patriots type defense as over the last few years. 

I do not know who else Bengals have interviewed. I would guess they can't talk to Golden until after Notre Dame plays Ohio State, nor would Golden want to.  He's probably focuses on Winning Championship, and I wouldn't want him if he wasn't.   Now why would Golden leave Notre Dame ?   I can see for a head coach job, but not for the same job he has now only with Bengals.  Notre Dame is a Top Job.  This is why I doubt the Notre Dame or Oregon D Coordinators are leaving good jobs to come here.
  
So I think it comes down to who is looking for a job.  We know the fired Bears head coach who turned around awful  Colts defense in a few months.  Bengals are not offering a head coaching job.  It's a defensive coordinator job.  I do not think defensive coordinators already on NFL teams or top Colleges are going to leave a good thing to come to Cincinnati to do same job, not a promotion.   So which coaches are now out of a job OR are D coaches but D Coordinator would be a Level Up. 
I'll again mention Bengals interviewed Patrick Graham for D Coordinator, but Jaguars interviewed him for Head Coach, which is a better job.  

This isn't about Mike Brown being cheap either.  Coach Taylor said he fired these coaches.  Here is the problem. Bengals drafted some D players early, and Lou refused to play them.  Now that is fine if the Defense is good, but the Defense was awful.  That left Lou not playing top pick draft choices on bad terms with Taylor, Duke Tobin up to Mike Brown.  Lou not playing the players upper management gave Lou, put Lou on the hot seat whe the Defense Lou was playing didn't produce. 
 
I don't see Golden leaving Notre Dame to do the same job in Cincy.  Nor do I see the Oregon D Coordinator coming to Cincy.  Nor do I see NFL D Coordinators leaving their jobs to come to Cincy. ....I can see the Bears fired head coach needing a job and coming to Cincy.  I can see maybe Zimmer out of work coming back.  Either a coach just now out of work, OR a D coach that D Coordinator would be a promotion.  Do not rule out some D Coach already on The Bengals getting promoted from within. 
 
I think on Bengals side of interview.  We had a D Coordinator who refused to play our top draft picks.  If we hire you, we will insist you get our top draft picks on the field. Otherwise it defeats the draft and what the franchise is doing.  Now if Lou had a great defense, but he didn't, and so him not playing our top draft picks became hard to accept. 

Those top picks will get on the field more if they suck less when they ARE on the field. Lou got fired for giving up 400-500 yards in games, missed tackles, and poor results year after year. A less complacent organization would've gotten rid of him years ago.

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

(Yesterday, 02:18 PM)jj22 Wrote: Reports out that Wink has entered the chat. Eb may be out.

I'll never get out my head what Burrow did to his defense. 

Maybe they are putting pressure on Eb.

(Yesterday, 02:58 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Yeah, that is my hope. I know Wink has done some good things with the Ravens but the way Burrow tore him up in that one game with 
all those great players sticks in my head as well. EB or Golden are the two guys I want that have been mentioned.

Just hoping this isn't Part 2 of all the choices turning us down until we're at like choice #6 or whatever.

[kevin]

(Yesterday, 05:18 PM)jason Wrote: Those top picks will get on the field more if they suck less when they ARE on the field. Lou got fired for giving up 400-500 yards in games, missed tackles, and poor results year after year. A less complacent organization would've gotten rid of him years ago.

As you say, Lou's D was awful, so that leads to Coach Taylor, Duke Tobin up to Mike Brown asking why the heck their top picks are on the bench when Lou's D is so awful.  

Again, Lou not doing what his bosses wanted, then he better have a good D, and he didn't.  You go against what the bosses want, you better be right.  Lou wasn't, and he got fired.  With Lou's D so awful, he had little excuse why he wasn't playing the players Taylor, Tobin up to Mike Brown went out and got him.  Lou had some top picks on the bench, and as you said, Lou's D was pretty bad to be leaving top picks on the bench that his bosses brought in. 

When you draft a D Player in 1st or 2nd round, you are not thinking of a guy for Special Teams.  The bosses are thinking Starter early in the Draft.  Lou and The Franchise were not on the same page.  The problem is Lou's defense was too awful not to be on the same page with head coach and front office. 

[SunsetBengal]

(Yesterday, 05:12 PM)kevin Wrote:  
This isn't about Mike Brown being cheap either.  Coach Taylor said he fired these coaches.  Here is the problem. Bengals drafted some D players early, and Lou refused to play them.  Now that is fine if the Defense is good, but the Defense was awful.  That left Lou not playing top pick draft choices on bad terms with Taylor, Duke Tobin up to Mike Brown.  Lou not playing the players upper management gave Lou, put Lou on the hot seat when the Defense Lou was playing didn't produce....This is true of any job. If your bosses tell you to do something, and you do the complete opposite, you better be right, or you lose your job.  
 

I'm not so sure that was the problem as much as a few of those early picks were just bad choices. You're probably right about a possible disconnect between Lou and the player personnel/scouting department, that is likely because they kept giving him square pegs to put into round holes.

I'm not defending Lou by saying that, I've always thought that he was a little too laid back. I base my theory on the lack of tackling execution, as any good coach would have stopped that from the get go.

[Luvnit2]

(Yesterday, 02:18 PM)jj22 Wrote: Reports out that Wink has entered the chat. Eb may be out.

I'll never get out my head what Burrow did to his defense. 

Maybe they are putting pressure on Eb.

Bengals FO is tight lipped. Could you provide who is reporting EB may be out? Are they credible or a click baiter?

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(Yesterday, 05:24 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Just hoping this isn't Part 2 of all the choices turning us down until we're at like choice #6 or whatever.

Yeah, also hope we are offering decent money as that would most likely be the reason for it.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(Yesterday, 05:39 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: Bengals FO is tight lipped. Could you provide who is reporting EB may be out? Are they credible or a click baiter?

Good questions.

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

(Yesterday, 06:09 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Yeah, also hope we are offering decent money as that would most likely be the reason for it.

Possibly. Or it could be that they believe that Zac Taylor is on the hotseat before the season even starts and he's just one more bad season away from being fired. So they don't want to move here for potentially just 1 year before having to be on the job hunt again. That's potentially 3 different schools for their kids in less than a calendar year.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(Yesterday, 06:36 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Possibly. Or it could be that they believe that Zac Taylor is on the hotseat before the season even starts and he's just one more bad season away from being fired. So they don't want to move here for potentially just 1 year before having to be on the job hunt again. That's potentially 3 different schools for their kids in less than a calendar year.

Definitely could be another reason, but if that is the case and we start 0-3 again we could fire Zac and give the new DC his job and 
see what he does. Might be the perfect job to get a shot at HC again if you are a guy like Eberflus.

[wanga]

(Yesterday, 06:36 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Possibly. Or it could be that they believe that Zac Taylor is on the hotseat before the season even starts and he's just one more bad season away from being fired. So they don't want to move here for potentially just 1 year before having to be on the job hunt again. That's potentially 3 different schools for their kids in less than a calendar year.

Or an astute DC might move here with the hope of winning a promotion to, or back to, a HC position for the following season or so.  

[wanga]

You’d think with the timing of it all there’s got to be someone still involved in their season. Surely the only viable reason for the delay.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(Yesterday, 06:52 PM)wanga Wrote: You’d think with the timing of it all there’s got to be someone still involved in their season. Surely the only viable reason for the delay.

Would be smart to keep all options open anyways even if I like Eberflus who is available right now.

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

(Yesterday, 06:51 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Definitely could be another reason, but if that is the case and we start 0-3 again we could fire Zac and give the new DC his job and 
see what he does. Might be the perfect job to get a shot at HC again if you are a guy like Eberflus.

I am on board with Eberflus as DC. I am not on board with Eberflus as HC. 

I'm actually not sure there's really many guys available I would want as DC that I would also be okay with being my HC. For instance Martindale is another name mentioned and I wouldn't want him as HC, and obviously not the two guys we interviewed first. Al Golden was a college HC back in 2010 and was .500 while going 0-3 in bowl games and has never been above a LB Coach in the NFL.

Besides I don't like the idea of preemptively poisoning the well by either making it known, inferring, or even not denying that the DC I hire could be HC this year or next. Doesn't seem like a healthy way to have him respect and work under Zac's leadership, like replacing a broken chair leg with a half-broken chair leg, you're kind of setting the chair up to just break again, so you either need to fully fix it or just get a new chair. Being half-in on a HC is how you get that weird unhealthy McCarthy/Cowboys situation that has finally ended after seemingly being on the chopping block for 4 straight years.

[Ctfan73]

According to this, Martindale is not under consideration:

https://www.si.com/nfl/bengals/news/report-bengals-not-interested-in-don-wink-martindale-for-vacant-defensive-coordinator-job-01jhkdtepxjt