How about AJ McCarron

[BigSeph]

(01-11-2016, 06:41 PM)muskiesfan Wrote: Honestly, I don't think McCarron looked that good the first 3 quarters. The game was tough to watch, but you have to give the kid some credit for that fourth quarter. He got lucky on that floater to Green that gave us the lead, but he looked in control. He was making good decisions and helped bring us back. McCarron stepped up when he was needed most. There's no real debate about that.

Now if he and the rest of the offense were more effective the first 3 quarters, that would've been ideal.

This is reasonable.  I agree except he got "lucky" on that "floater" to AJ.  He explained why he threw it high and early after the game.  And I'm a "fanboy."

And the first 3 quarters would have been a little more palatable if they had called a personal foul on the Gio hit and the Bengals had the ball 1st down at the Steelers' 11 yard line.  But for the most part, McCarron couldn't handle what was being thrown at him by the Steelers defense in those first 3 quarters.

[Brownshoe]

(01-11-2016, 06:43 PM)McC Wrote: Bullshit.  You left that about ten posts ago.   You are, frankly, off the beam on this.

Sorry you don't have common sense then.

[Essex Johnson]

(01-11-2016, 06:37 PM)BigSeph Wrote: He did better in his 1st playoff game (his 4th overall start) than Andy Dalton has ever done in any of his playoff games.

Would you say Dalton has ever had a "decent" playoff game or do you need your head examined?  

So what is your point really.. are you trying to say AJM is a better QB than Dalton ?? I am not getting your point really . 


My point is pretty simple.. AJM did a serviceable job as Daltons replacement but he is what he is.. the backup.. Dalton is a superior QB.. could AJM develop to Dalton;s level maybe.. will he with the Bengals.. probably not.


So let me ask you a simple question:   Do you believe Andy Dalton is a better QB right not to lead the Bengals  or would you want AJM to lead the Bengals next year ?  Yes or No is all im asking for.. not what ifs, what could be etc.

[XenoMorph]

(01-11-2016, 06:46 PM)tlotharw Wrote: Neither was Roethlisberger.


Dalton's postseason quarterback ratings

2014 63.4
2013 67.0
2012 44.7
2011 51.4

Avg.  57.8

McCarron's postseason quarterback rating

68.3 in lousy weather conditions

And the Star Power available to him is the best we ever put on the field on both sides of the ball..

Gotta think our QB having an MVP type season has a better game with all weapons GO

[Brownshoe]

(01-11-2016, 06:44 PM)BengalChris Wrote: McCarron's press conference tells it all. Kid has a good future in the NFL.

http://www.bengals.com/media-lounge/videos/McCarron_Postgame_News_Conference/4b466266-7d37-4ca0-a774-c13aff472ebc

Seems like a guy who only can give excuses. What person wants a QB to act like that? "it rained when we had the ball and it stopped when we had the ball" i guess it never rained in an NFL game.

[McC]

(01-11-2016, 06:47 PM)XenoMorph Wrote: And the Star Power available to him is the best we ever put on the field on both sides of the ball..

Gotta think our QB having an MVP type season has a better game with all weapons GO

He probably would have, if he hadn't stupid-ed himself to the sidelines.

[McC]

(01-11-2016, 06:48 PM)Brownshoe Wrote: Seems like a guy who only can give excuses. What person wants a QB to act like that? "it rained when we had the ball and it stopped when we had the ball" i guess it never rained in an NFL game.

And this is what you call common sense?  Gotcha.

[muskiesfan]

(01-11-2016, 06:47 PM)BigSeph Wrote: This is reasonable.  I agree except he got "lucky" on that "floater" to AJ.  He explained why he threw it high and early after the game.  And I'm a "fanboy."

And the first 3 quarters would have been a little more palatable if they had called a personal foul on the Gio hit and the Bengals had the ball 1st down at the Steelers' 11 yard line.  But for the most part, McCarron couldn't handle what was being thrown at him by the Steelers defense in those first 3 quarters.

Maybe you are a fan boy. I thought those were the guys who were not reasonable, but the homers of the homers. By all accounts, people would probably say I'm a Dalton fan boy, but I try to be pretty objective about him.

There are a lot of things that can be said about the first 3 quarters. It wasn't all McCarron's fault. That's why I said him and the entire offense. I'm not trying to tear the guy down even though you keep responding like I am.

I'm not going to continue to argue the floater. That was not a good deep ball.

[Brownshoe]

(01-11-2016, 06:50 PM)McC Wrote: And this is what you call common sense?  Gotcha.

Yeah. Easily. When someone is acting like McCarron is that not making excuses?

[BengalChris]

(01-11-2016, 06:37 PM)BigSeph Wrote: He did better in his 1st playoff game (his 4th overall start) than Andy Dalton has ever done in any of his playoff games.

Would you say Dalton has ever had a "decent" playoff game or do you need your head examined?  

You are going to get a rehash of all the excuses now from no talent to the defense really lost the game to can't stop the run to AJ Green isn't elite to injuries to we weren't favored to win those games, etc, etc. It's insulting to one's intelligence.

[Bengalholic]

(01-11-2016, 06:22 PM)Brownshoe Wrote: If you think McCarron did decent in that playoff game you might want to go to a doctor. There has to be something wrong with anyones brain who thinks that.

In fairness, AJ is the only Bengals QB in the 7 Lewis era playoff games to actually have a late game lead. Whatever you think of him, it's not like any Bengals QB has lit up in the playoffs in recent years...including Palmer, Kitna and Dalton. 

I've also noticed a weird trend since Andy went down. Some of the people that were hardcore Andy fans...who used to chastise anyone who offered criticism of Andy and would always tell others to 'support their QB'...are now the same ones doing some serious criticizing of AJ, bordering on the irrational. What happened to supporting the QB? Does that only apply when it's 'your guy'?

I've always been an Andy supporter, although my confidence in him has been up and down at times. He had an outstanding year, and it was awesome to see. When he went down, I thought AJ stepped up and performed admirably for a guy seeing his first NFL action. I just don't get some of the over the top criticism and negativity towards him.

[muskiesfan]

(01-11-2016, 06:51 PM)BengalChris Wrote: You are going to get a rehash of all the excuses now from no talent to the defense really lost the game to can't stop the run to AJ Green isn't elite to injuries to we weren't favored to win those games, etc, etc. It's insulting to one's intelligence.

For all the shit Dalton takes, his elite receiver gets away with a ton. I love Green, hands down my favorite player on the team. However, he hasn't stepped up in the playoffs either and that can't all be put on Dalton. That's not an excuse and that's not trying to boost Dalton. That's simply saying our elite player needs to step up and be elite when it counts as well.

[BengalChris]

(01-11-2016, 06:53 PM)Bengalholic Wrote: In fairness, AJ is the only Bengals QB in the 7 Lewis era playoff games to actually have a late game lead. Whatever you think of him, it's not like any Bengals QB has lit up in the playoffs in recent years...including Palmer, Kitna and Dalton. 

I've also noticed a weird trend since Andy went down. Some of the people that were hardcore Andy fans...who used to chastise anyone who offered criticism of Andy and would always tell others to 'support their QB'...are now the same one's doing some serious criticizing of AJ, bordering on the irrational. What happened to supporting the QB? Does that only apply when it's 'you're guy'?

I've always been an Andy supporter, although my confidence in him has been up and down at times. He had an outstanding year, and it was awesome to see. When he went down, I thought AJ steeped up and performed admirably for a guy seeing his first NFL action. I just don't get some of the over the top criticism and negativity towards him.

TY

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

(01-11-2016, 06:43 PM)XenoMorph Wrote: Dalton has never had all his toys on the field for a playoff game...   The 1 he did they were mostly rookies  We blew the SD game between the turnovers and the defensive flop...

I will say...  Guethers D shows up in the playoffs.

I'll agree with the guy who said it did once out of the two times, but I will also add... look at what the Vikings did. They held the "unstoppable" Seahawks to 10 points, with SIGNIFICANTLY less talent than the Bengals have on D.

Apparently Zimmer's D shows up too once he's free of the influence of Lewis.

[McC]

(01-11-2016, 06:51 PM)Brownshoe Wrote: Yeah. Easily. When someone is acting like McCarron is that not making excuses?

You never heard a player make excuses?  You never heard a Bengal make excuses?  You never heard Andy make excuses?

What you call common sense, I call irrational obsessive nonsense.  Let's just agree to disagree.

To me, common sense say that, if a guy stands up to a bad situation and, even if he's played lousy for three quarters, finds a way to gut it out in the end, it is no crime to give him a tiny bit of credit.  You, on the other hand, don't.

[BigSeph]

(01-11-2016, 06:47 PM)Essex Johnson Wrote: So what is your point really.. are you trying to say AJM is a better QB than Dalton ?? I am not getting your point really . 


My point is pretty simple.. AJM did a serviceable job as Daltons replacement but he is what he is.. the backup.. Dalton is a superior QB.. could AJM develop to Dalton;s level maybe.. will he with the Bengals.. probably not.


So let me ask you a simple question:   Do you believe Andy Dalton is a better QB right not to lead the Bengals  or would you want AJM to lead the Bengals next year ?  Yes or No is all im asking for.. not what ifs, what could be etc.

My point is that McCarron had a gutsy performance and played well in the 4th quarter.

That's all.

Some people can't bring themselves to admit the obvious, instead bashing his 4th quarter and downplaying everything he did (he only got down the field due to PI, his TD to AJ was a "floater", defense gave them great field position that's only reason they put up points, etc).

Dalton is absolutely a superior QB right now.  He should be.  He's had 4 years to work on it.

Could AJM develop?  After watching the last 4+ games, I'd say he absolutely will develop and will be a successful starting QB in the NFL for many years.  Look at the QB rating.  Look at the way the team barely lost vs. Denver and Pittsburgh.  There is a lot of promise and potential there.  That doesn't mean I want to see AJ starting for the Bengals and Andy shipped off or benched.  That doesn't mean I hate Andy.  It means I can see the progress and potential in AJM and he has grown quickly with experience.

Andy Dalton right now is a better QB to lead the Bengals.

If I said he wasn't, would it change your opinion on AJM?  Just give the guy some credit.  He deserves it.

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

(01-11-2016, 06:46 PM)tlotharw Wrote: Neither was Roethlisberger.


Dalton's postseason quarterback ratings

2014 63.4
2013 67.0
2012 44.7
2011 51.4

Avg.  57.8

McCarron's postseason quarterback rating

68.3 in lousy weather conditions

Against the 30th ranked pass defense, with a defense behind him playing great, and a running game actually somewhat working, and more offensive weapons than Dalton has ever had in a playoff game.

[McC]

(01-11-2016, 06:59 PM)BigSeph Wrote: My point is that McCarron had a gutsy performance and played well in the 4th quarter.

That's all.

Some people can't bring themselves to admit the obvious, instead bashing his 4th quarter and downplaying everything he did (he only got down the field due to PI, his TD to AJ was a "floater", defense gave them great field position that's only reason they put up points, etc).

Dalton is absolutely a superior QB right now.  He should be.  He's had 4 years to work on it.

Could AJM develop?  After watching the last 4+ games, I'd say he absolutely will develop and will be a successful starting QB in the NFL for many years.  Look at the QB rating.  Look at the way the team barely lost vs. Denver and Pittsburgh.  There is a lot of promise and potential there.  That doesn't mean I want to see AJ starting for the Bengals and Andy shipped off or benched.  That doesn't mean I hate Andy.  It means I can see the progress and potential in AJM and he has grown quickly with experience.

Andy Dalton right now is a better QB to lead the Bengals.

If I said he wasn't, would it change your opinion on AJM?  Just give the guy some credit.  He deserves it.

He stood up in the face of an absolute shit storm and was still standing at the end.  That alone is more than a lot of guys who had played five games would do.  

[BigSeph]

(01-11-2016, 07:01 PM)McC Wrote: He stood up in the face of an absolute shit storm and was still standing at the end.  That alone is more than a lot of guys who had played five games would do.  

No doubt about it.  I said in another thread that teams with QBs like Jameis, Carr, Bortles, etc would be thrilled with that type of performance in a QB's first playoff game and 4th NFL start.

Apparently that's not good enough to merit a "gutty performance, good 4th" comment from some on this board who spend their time and energy trying to tear the guy down.

[Rhinocero23]

(01-11-2016, 07:06 PM)BigSeph Wrote: No doubt about it.  I said in another thread that teams with QBs like Jameis, Carr, Bortles, etc would be thrilled with that type of performance in a QB's first playoff game and 4th NFL start.

Apparently that's not good enough to merit a "gutty performance, good 4th" comment from some on this board who spend their time and energy trying to tear the guy down.

That's called fear of the starting QB being pressured for his job. Most would say handling pressure is not been a strength of his. Admitting that there is a viable starter if he should falters would be turning up the heat in the pressure cooker. Can't do that!