What will Bengals do re: DE in the draft

[TKUHL]

1st Thomas/Barnett
2nd Howard/Njoku
3rd Mixon/Kamara
4th OL/Douglas CB

If the players in the first are gone I can see them flipping the first and second. Maybe a trade back but it takes two to tango.

[*SHRacerX*]

(03-20-2017, 11:35 AM)fredtoast Wrote:  That is a great bargain for a player who is still as productive as MJ

A great bargain would be MJ paying the Bengals, and it somehow returned cap space to the Bengals.  MJ is not a great bargain because a lack of a pass rush from the RDE position in a 4-3 defense that stubbornly rarely blitzes for pressure has a negative effect on the performance of the entire defense.  

The bottom line is that when the opposition has gone maximum protection, the Bengals have no answer.  I never see MJ double-teamed but he rarely gets any pressure despite tremendous opportunities.

I don't think the three DEs the Bengals truly covet (Garrett, Thomas, and Barnett) will still be there at #9, so I could see the Bengals going WR in Rd 1, and then getting a more speed-rushing option to partner with MJ on passing downs. 

We know the Bengals rarely if ever terminate contracts early anyways, so I don't see MJ going anywhere.  Pairing him with a speed rusher, instead of a clone (Clarke) makes more sense.  

[*SHRacerX*]

(03-20-2017, 05:03 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Hope the Bengals don't try to turn Hardison into a DE/DT hybrid.  He needs to get bigger and stronger and concentrate 100% on DT.

With now what amounts to two years of not playing football, I have all but forgotten this guy.  If he produces at all, I will be shocked.  

[SunsetBengal]

(03-20-2017, 08:21 PM)SHRacerX Wrote: A great bargain would be MJ paying the Bengals, and it somehow returned cap space to the Bengals.  MJ is not a great bargain because a lack of a pass rush from the RDE position in a 4-3 defense that stubbornly rarely blitzes for pressure has a negative effect on the performance of the entire defense.  

The bottom line is that when the opposition has gone maximum protection, the Bengals have no answer.  I never see MJ double-teamed but he rarely gets any pressure despite tremendous opportunities.

I don't think the three DEs the Bengals truly covet (Garrett, Thomas, and Barnett) will still be there at #9, so I could see the Bengals going WR in Rd 1, and then getting a more speed-rushing option to partner with MJ on passing downs. 

We know the Bengals rarely if ever terminate contracts early anyways, so I don't see MJ going anywhere.  Pairing him with a speed rusher, instead of a clone (Clarke) makes more sense.  

Have you not noticed the effectiveness of Clarke's bulrush, and how when he gets the jump, he makes a straight line move to the play? 

[*SHRacerX*]

(03-20-2017, 08:24 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Have you not noticed the effectiveness of Clarke's bulrush, and how when he gets the jump, he makes a straight line move to the play? 

I don't mean that as a shot against Clarke.  I like him, but he will be the role of DE that kicks inside.  I still can't understand why he got so little snaps in relation to MJ.  Ditto Hunt.  As down as I was on Hunt, the few snaps he got I thought he did well.  Clarke could be a valuable piece if he doesn't get frustrated with his lack of playing time.  

That being said, he is more like MJ with better strength than an outside speed option.  

[Murdock2420]

With the Bengals biggest needs being on the O-line and the D-line (I would still say they need a LB but with Minter, Vigil and Burfict they'll probably pass) I honestly think the Bengals will trade out of the 9th pick. Be a team that wants a specific QB or Mike Williams or...etc, etc, I just get the feeling the team will move down. I'd love for them to take Foster, especially with Minter on a 1 year deal, but I doubt they'll pull the trigger on him.

[*SHRacerX*]

(03-20-2017, 10:18 PM)Murdock2420 Wrote: With the Bengals biggest needs being on the O-line and the D-line (I would still say they need a LB but with Minter, Vigil and Burfict they'll probably pass) I honestly think the Bengals will trade out of the 9th pick. Be a team that wants a specific QB or Mike Williams or...etc, etc, I just get the feeling the team will move down. I'd love for them to take Foster, especially with Minter on a 1 year deal, but I doubt they'll pull the trigger on him.

I'm the minority that has zero interest in Foster.  I agree, however, that if Garrett, Thomas, and Barnett are all gone at 9, they may trade down and get an additional second rounder and still get a guy like Ross.  I might just be willing to take him at 9 if Corey Davis goes earlier.  I am not a fan of Williams as our WR.  We need speed outside to open up the underneath. 

I would be really excited to slide to, say 13, get an additional second rounder to use on a Center like Elflein and get a burner like Ross.  

[Murdock2420]

(03-20-2017, 11:32 PM)SHRacerX Wrote: I'm the minority that has zero interest in Foster.  I agree, however, that if Garrett, Thomas, and Barnett are all gone at 9, they may trade down and get an additional second rounder and still get a guy like Ross.  I might just be willing to take him at 9 if Corey Davis goes earlier.  I am not a fan of Williams as our WR.  We need speed outside to open up the underneath. 

I would be really excited to slide to, say 13, get an additional second rounder to use on a Center like Elflein and get a burner like Ross.  

As long as they don't draft a project, I'm pretty much okay with anyone they would pick. I'm not a fan of Taco Charlton and I've seen him linked a few times, it would just be nice for the team to draft a guy that was solid, with no giant red flags or people scratching their heads. A pick that truly is, BPA who can make an impact, not sit a year rehabbing.

[*SHRacerX*]

(03-21-2017, 12:36 AM)Murdock2420 Wrote: As long as they don't draft a project, I'm pretty much okay with anyone they would pick. I'm not a fan of Taco Charlton and I've seen him linked a few times, it would just be nice for the team to draft a guy that was solid, with no giant red flags or people scratching their heads. A pick that truly is, BPA who can make an impact, not sit a year rehabbing.

With you 100%.  This player must be an impact player THIS YEAR.  And I would bet that if it were Ross or Davis, that player could be a huge impact.  I like Charlton, but far from love him.  I see him as another Will Clarke without a couple years of NFL strength training on him.   Third rounder to me.   

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(03-20-2017, 11:32 PM)SHRacerX Wrote: I'm the minority that has zero interest in Foster.  I agree, however, that if Garrett, Thomas, and Barnett are all gone at 9, they may trade down and get an additional second rounder and still get a guy like Ross.  I might just be willing to take him at 9 if Corey Davis goes earlier.  I am not a fan of Williams as our WR.  We need speed outside to open up the underneath. 

I would be really excited to slide to, say 13, get an additional second rounder to use on a Center like Elflein and get a burner like Ross.  

That would be frickin' awesome IMHO.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(03-20-2017, 05:03 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Hope the Bengals don't try to turn Hardison into a DE/DT hybrid.  He needs to get bigger and stronger and concentrate 100% on DT.

Well if that is the plan we better take 2 Ends in this draft.

[Hoofhearted]

(03-20-2017, 10:18 PM)Murdock2420 Wrote: With the Bengals biggest needs being on the O-line and the D-line (I would still say they need a LB but with Minter, Vigil and Burfict they'll probably pass) I honestly think the Bengals will trade out of the 9th pick. Be a team that wants a specific QB or Mike Williams or...etc, etc, I just get the feeling the team will move down. I'd love for them to take Foster, especially with Minter on a 1 year deal, but I doubt they'll pull the trigger on him.

Nor should they. A pass rushing DE - which we can use in our Nickel package (which we're in most of the time)  - would be twice as valuable than taking a ILB. 

[wolfkaosaun]

There's been a ton of talk about the Bengals taking a DE. They obviously want one and need one. But with MJ still around, you wonder who they take.

Taco has to develop a little more but he has all the qualities and measrueables the Bengals like. Some playing time will help him.

Solomon Thomas is someone a ton of Bengals fans really like, but will he be there?

Others, including myself, view Barnett as a tremendous football player and think he can produce in the NFL as well.

I personally think they'll think highly of Taco. He fits a ton of things they like.

I would prefer them to go after Barnett, but that's just my own personal opinion.

Also it wouldn't surprise me if they drafted Harris or Walker in the 2nd round if they pass on DE early.

[Derrick]

(03-21-2017, 12:36 AM)Murdock2420 Wrote: As long as they don't draft a project, I'm pretty much okay with anyone they would pick. I'm not a fan of Taco Charlton and I've seen him linked a few times, it would just be nice for the team to draft a guy that was solid, with no giant red flags or people scratching their heads. A pick that truly is, BPA who can make an impact, not sit a year rehabbing.

Yes!!! I am done with their "project" drafts. These coaches can NOT coach up these projects and takes time and effort away from coaching the top guys to play at a high level... PRIORITIES!

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(03-21-2017, 06:55 PM)wolfkaosaun Wrote: There's been a ton of talk about the Bengals taking a DE. They obviously want one and need one. But with MJ still around, you wonder who they take.

Taco has to develop a little more but he has all the qualities and measrueables the Bengals like. Some playing time will help him.

Solomon Thomas is someone a ton of Bengals fans really like, but will he be there?

Others, including myself, view Barnett as a tremendous football player and think he can produce in the NFL as well.

I personally think they'll think highly of Taco. He fits a ton of things they like.

I would prefer them to go after Barnett, but that's just my own personal opinion.

Also it wouldn't surprise me if they drafted Harris or Walker in the 2nd round if they pass on DE early.

Nice post Wolf, i completely agree about Barnett and pretty much everything else about the Ends.

You are the scout that has gave me the best analysis after all lol.

The more i think about it i would love it if we traded down if Barnett is not there, grabbed Taco or John Ross,
maybe get another 2nd or 3rd from trading down and got Elflein or Walker.

John Ross, Walker/Harris and John Toth sure would make my day with the first 3 picks...

Or of course Taco, Elflein and Reynolds/Juju.

But would be happy with a versatile RB sprinkled in there like Mixon or if for some reason McCaffrey fell to 2.

[Hammerstripes]

(03-20-2017, 07:30 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Would be huge mistake to pass on Malik Hooker at 9.  He is the consensus #4 or #5 overall talent in this draft.  He is one of those players at his position, that only comes along once every 5-10 years.  Not because of his overwhelming speed, size or hitting ability, but his intelligence as a football player and knack for being in perfect position to make a play on the ball. This is a guy that within his second year in the league, gives your defense a new identity.

If he's still on the board at 9, that means that a few teams definitely reached for need, over best on the board.

Or teams don't view him as being a top 5 talent.

[wolfkaosaun]

(03-21-2017, 07:41 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Nice post Wolf, i completely agree about Barnett and pretty much everything else about the Ends.

You are the scout that has gave me the best analysis after lol.

The more i think about it i would love it if we traded down if Barnett is not there, grabbed Taco or John Ross,
maybe get another 2nd or 3rd from trading down and got Elflein or Walker.

John Ross, Walker/Harris and John Toth sure would make my day with the first 3 picks...

Or of course Taco, Elflein and Reynolds/Juju.

But would be happy with a versatile RB sprinkled in there like Mixon or if for some reason McCaffrey fell to 2.

This year is a deep draft for the Bengals when it comes to their needs. They need a pass rusher, and they can get an overall guy early. If not, there's pass rushers as it goes down the line. There's some REALLY good wide receivers, including speedy ones that the Bengals coveted last year. Running back seems to be something they are interested in. However, I'm afraid they'll make the draft pick and Hill be the 1-2 punch, meanwhile Gio fits the offense better. And there's some really good quality centers in all honesty.

Barnett is my #1 guy I want for the Bengals.

It goes
1: Derek Barnett
2A: John Ross
2B: Corey Davis
3: Solomon Thomas
4: Christian MCCaffrey
5: Mike Williams
6: Taco Charlton

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(03-21-2017, 07:52 PM)wolfkaosaun Wrote: This year is a deep draft for the Bengals when it comes to their needs. They need a pass rusher, and they can get an overall guy early. If not, there's pass rushers as it goes down the line. There's some REALLY good wide receivers, including speedy ones that the Bengals coveted last year. Running back seems to be something they are interested in. However, I'm afraid they'll make the draft pick and Hill be the 1-2 punch, meanwhile Gio fits the offense better. And there's some really good quality centers in all honesty.

Barnett is my #1 guy I want for the Bengals.

It goes
1: Derek Barnett
2A: John Ross
2B: Corey Davis
3: Solomon Thomas
4: Christian MCCaffrey
5: Mike Williams
6: Taco Charlton

I like your list, but i seriously hope they are not having Hill in the thought process and it makes sense that they
wouldn't after extending Gio and Hill having the year he just had. Dalvin Cook and Fournette are in there to me
after all that has happened at the RB position, we cannot forget a RB at 9, could happen if the pass rushers are
gone. I would be fine with Dalvin Cook/Fournette and Walker/Harris/Elflein in the 2nd, more than fine.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(03-21-2017, 07:44 PM)Hammerstripes Wrote: Or teams don't view him as being a top 5 talent.

Malik Hooker?

He has been mentioned as a top 3 talent many times and has been compared to Ed Reed.

An Ed Reed on our team would help us immensely and if he is there at 9 i am for it.

So many options at 9, i just don't want us to reach for need there.

[HarleyDog]

1-3 would be the best decision but won't happen because we don't do the best things.