Where is Ross?

[*ochocincos*]

(05-30-2019, 10:17 AM)Catmandude123 Wrote: I am in the camp that doesn't use the number nine overall pick for wr3. You use the pick for a future # 1 wr. Unless he really excels this year I would label him as a bona-fide bust. 

While I really liked (and still like) Ross, I too thought it was weird to spend such a high pick on a WR3.
However, at the time, the Bengals had Zampese as their OC, and Zampese liked the more vertical passing game, so it made sense to get a player like Ross who has the speed to go deep and also was a big RZ threat.
Also, Boyd hadn't yet emerged and the thought might have been that Ross was going to be the WR2 once LaFell was gone.

I ultimately wanted OJ Howard over Ross though because I thought Howard was going to be elite and Eifert was continually dinged up and entering the last year of his contract. Would the team be better with Howard and then draft Parris Campbell in Rd 2 this year over Ross + Sample?

[THE PISTONS]

I remember Lapham talking at the time about how the Bengals needed speed on offense. That's why they took Ross.

I think they thought he'd come in and be a #2 WR and eventually a #1.

[Catmandude123]

(05-30-2019, 10:39 AM)ochocincos Wrote: While I really liked (and still like) Ross, I too thought it was weird to spend such a high pick on a WR3.
However, at the time, the Bengals had Zampese as their OC, and Zampese liked the more vertical passing game, so it made sense to get a player like Ross who has the speed to go deep and also was a big RZ threat.
Also, Boyd hadn't yet emerged and the thought might have been that Ross was going to be the WR2 once LaFell was gone.

I ultimately wanted OJ Howard over Ross though because I thought Howard was going to be elite and Eifert was continually dinged up and entering the last year of his contract. Would the team be better with Howard and then draft Parris Campbell in Rd 2 this year over Ross + Sample?

Too many things need to improve for him not to be a total bust. Can he stay healthy, can he improve his route running, can build trust with Andy? These questions should already be answered by the third season but even with AJ and Boyd excelling and drawing double coverage it still remains to be seen if the light will come on. The offensive game plan may improve his stock but if not this may be his last year in Cincy. 

[*Nately120*]

(05-30-2019, 10:49 AM)THE PISTONS Wrote: I remember Lapham talking at the time about how the Bengals needed speed on offense. That's why they took Ross.

I think they thought he'd come in and be a #2 WR and eventually a #1.

Part of me thinks it all depends on what he does this year, but part of me thinks he could also be the de-facto #2 WR next year when we can't keep both AJ and Boyd, regardless of how he plays in 2019.  The main thing I will be looking for is if Dalton finally starts to trust him.

[*ochocincos*]

(05-30-2019, 11:04 AM)Catmandude123 Wrote: Too many things need to improve for him not to be a total bust. Can he stay healthy, can he improve his route running, can build trust with Andy? These questions should already be answered by the third season but even with AJ and Boyd excelling and drawing double coverage it still remains to be seen if the light will come on. The offensive game plan may improve his stock but if not this may be his last year in Cincy. 

I think this is a make-or-break year for Ross too. I'd really like to see 600-800 yards out of him this year along with 5+ TDs. I think he can get there too if used properly (not always sending him deep). We'll see.

[*Nately120*]

(05-30-2019, 11:14 AM)ochocincos Wrote: I think this is a make-or-break year for Ross too. I'd really like to see 600-800 yards out of him this year along with 5+ TDs. I think he can get there too if used properly (not always sending him deep). We'll see.

I hope he does well, but I don't think anything short of him being on the bench all year is going to break him.  I can see us 365 days from now talking about how excited we are to see what he can finally do now that he's been elevated to the #2 WR role, unless this year is a total disaster for him.

I haven't studied the cap situation, but who else could be our WR#2 going into 2020?  I'm not convinced Boyd would refuse all outside offers to stay here, if that's his option.

[*ochocincos*]

(05-30-2019, 11:18 AM)Nately120 Wrote: I hope he does well, but I don't think anything short of him being on the bench all year is going to break him.  I can see us 365 days from now talking about how excited we are to see what he can finally do now that he's been elevated to the #2 WR role, unless this year is a total disaster for him.

I haven't studied the cap situation, but who else could be our WR#2 going into 2020?  I'm not convinced Boyd would refuse all outside offers to stay here, if that's his option.

Bengals have been very willing to go outside to bring in a veteran WR2 (up to a certain cost), and I suspect they would do the same if Boyd were to leave and Ross didn't do enough to give confidence after this year.

Here's a list of FA WRs next year - https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/free-agents/2020/all/wide-receiver/[url=https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/free-agents/2020/all/wide-receiver/][/url]

[depthchart]

(05-30-2019, 11:18 AM)Nately120 Wrote: I hope he does well, but I don't think anything short of him being on the bench all year is going to break him.  I can see us 365 days from now talking about how excited we are to see what he can finally do now that he's been elevated to the #2 WR role, unless this year is a total disaster for him.

I haven't studied the cap situation, but who else could be our WR#2 going into 2020?  I'm not convinced Boyd would refuse all outside offers to stay here, if that's his option.

I am concerned that Ross will do just enough and stay healthy just enough in 2019 that the Bengals will think they can let Tyler Boyd leave after this upcoming season.

Then in 2020, Ross regresses or can't stay healthy & Boyd is gone.

I personally would not plan for Ross to be my #1 or #2 long term because I doubt his ability to stay healthy for a 16 game season plus Playoff games in one season.

I would sign Boyd and Draft stiff competition for Ross in the 2020 Draft.

[*Nately120*]

(05-30-2019, 11:39 AM)ochocincos Wrote: Bengals have been very willing to go outside to bring in a veteran WR2 (up to a certain cost), and I suspect they would do the same if Boyd were to leave and Ross didn't do enough to give confidence after this year.

Here's a list of FA WRs next year - https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/free-agents/2020/all/wide-receiver/[url=https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/free-agents/2020/all/wide-receiver/][/url]

Oh man, if the Bengals bring in another ho-hum vet to play in front of Ross....lordy loo, that would lead to some kvetching. 

[NKURyan]

(05-30-2019, 11:39 AM)depthchart Wrote: I am concerned that Ross will do just enough and stay healthy just enough in 2019 that the Bengals will think they can let Tyler Boyd leave after this upcoming season.

Then in 2020, Ross regresses or can't stay healthy & Boyd is gone.

I personally would not plan for Ross to be my #1 or #2 long term because I doubt his ability to stay healthy for a 16 game season plus Playoff games in one season.

I would sign Boyd and Draft stiff competition for Ross in the 2020 Draft.

I'm thinking we get a Boyd/Green signing just like we did Dunlap/Atkins last year. Not sure it gets that far.

[*ochocincos*]

(05-30-2019, 11:41 AM)Nately120 Wrote: Oh man, if the Bengals bring in another ho-hum vet to play in front of Ross....lordy loo, that would lead to some kvetching. 

If Boyd were to leave, I wonder if Robby Anderson would command too much money to come to Cincinnati. I think he'd be a good WR2.

[XenoMorph]

the fact that Ross wasn't involed is why I posted this in around the nfl a while ago lol

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(05-29-2019, 02:39 PM)Nately120 Wrote: Meh, if he doesn't perform this year who do we blame?  Dalton?

Depends if Dalton is underthrowing him all the time, if not no one would be to blame but Ross.

There was a game last year where Ross could of had 3 TD's in one game instead of just 1 cause Dalton was underthrowing him.

(05-29-2019, 03:00 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: That's probably one of the hardest things to do in sports. I guess experience helps. Knowing where to go. Confidence?

I don't know. It's hard.

Players grow in their 3rd season all the time. AB didn't have as many TD's as Ross in his first couple of years and AB wasn't as dinged up going into and in his rookie season while being in the HC's dog house. This and how fans continually talk about Ross being a bust and wanting him cut make me defend him.

I think some people are a little crazy on here with their Ross hate. If he doesn't perform this season when he now has an offensive coach and with Dalton having more time? I will stop defending him if he doesn't produce.

His yardage last season was very disappointing even with the 7 TD's.

(05-29-2019, 06:14 PM)NKURyan Wrote: I think the OC can help him out here. Design a few plays playing to the guy's strengths and try to start building him up.

Off the top of my head I think I can count the amount of times they tried throwing him a screen pass on one hand. That just seems like a no brainer to me.

Precisely, have to use him right and all the weapons. This has always been a weakness around here.

(05-29-2019, 11:08 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Just stop. No team is going to cut a top 10 pick with his kind of potential who HAS shown he can be useful (7 TD in 13 games). It’s not like we have a bunch of studs at WR behind him either.

Yeah, sure would be extremely stupid to cut a player like Ross. One thing i said before him even being drafted by us is that he will open up the Offense just by being on the field and this is a very underrated trait that not many players have.

(05-30-2019, 09:38 AM)impactplaya Wrote: its amazing how many wanted Ross traded out of Cincy or just cut
this season.
7 TDs is 7 TDs no matter how you want to slice it.
give him a chance with a OC that can actually attach his name
to a successful offense i.e the Rams.

Spot on Impactplaya, quite amazing.

(05-30-2019, 10:02 AM)oldschoolomen Wrote: Usain Bolt doesn't race jamokes on the side for kicks. Ross has proven his speed, he needs to prove himself as the number 9 overall pick. It's a relief that Ross isn't participating, not a point to be worried about.

Yes sir.

[Bengalfan4life27c]

(05-30-2019, 12:26 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Depends if Dalton is underthrowing him all the time, if not no one would be to blame but Ross.

There was a game last year where Ross could of had 3 TD's in one game instead of just 1 cause Dalton was underthrowing him.

the game your referring too we must not have watched the same game. 1 was slightly underthrown still catchable . 2nd one hit him right on his fingertips a good 5 yds in front of everybody a perfect pass completely on Ross.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

Maybe we are thinking of a different game. In the game i was talking about Dalton badly underthrown Ross twice, one of which resulted into an ugly interception. I just think Dalton needs to get used to Ross's speed, obviously he was not used to it last season especially early.

But yeah Ross definately needs to work on the juggs machine. His hands have not been up to par.

[*Nately120*]

(05-30-2019, 12:26 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Depends if Dalton is underthrowing him all the time, if not no one would be to blame but Ross.

There was a game last year where Ross could of had 3 TD's in one game instead of just 1 cause Dalton was underthrowing him.

I'm not saying Dalton is untouchable, but we are getting close to saying a top 10 WR pick needs the right HC, the right OC, and a top 5 QB in order to put up more than 300 yards in a season.  

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(05-30-2019, 01:54 PM)Nately120 Wrote: I'm not saying Dalton is untouchable, but we are getting close to saying a top 10 WR pick needs the right HC, the right OC, and a top 5 QB in order to put up more than 300 yards in a season.  

Ross needs to stop dropping the ball too and running the wrong routes. I made no excuses for Ross last year when he was quitting on routes, there is no excuse for this nor for dropping passes. Ross's yardage was extremely disappointing last season no question.

[*Nately120*]

(05-30-2019, 01:57 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Ross needs to stop dropping the ball too and running the wrong routes. I made no excuses for Ross last year when he was quitting on routes, there is no excuse for this nor for dropping passes. Ross's yardage was extremely disappointing last season no question.

Fair enough.  I can only deduce that him being inordinately effective in the red zone indicates Dalton isn't very confident in Ross' ability to handle the ball within the actual field of play. I will say from an entertainment standpoint I do love John Ross. Every time the ball is headed his way it seems like something insane could happen...he's like the Rex Grossman of WRs, you just can't look away when he's involved.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(05-30-2019, 02:16 PM)Nately120 Wrote: Fair enough.  I can only deduce that him being inordinately effective in the red zone indicates Dalton isn't very confident in Ross' ability to handle the ball within the actual field of play. I will say from an entertainment standpoint I do love John Ross. Every time the ball is headed his way it seems like something insane could happen...he's like the Rex Grossman of WRs, you just can't look away when he's involved.

Yeah, i guess that is why i wanted Ross in the first place and i want him to succeed so badly.

The guy can be electric at times, he just needs to put it all together. As Boyd says he needs to stop thinking and just react.

Prior to that Draft i wanted Ross or OJ Howard at 9 or for us to trade back and select an O-lineman.

[fredtoast]

(05-30-2019, 12:26 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Depends if Dalton is underthrowing him all the time, if not no one would be to blame but Ross.

There was a game last year where Ross could of had 3 TD's in one game instead of just 1 cause Dalton was underthrowing him.

Which game was that?