Hobsons choice: no need to invest more in the offensive line?

[NATI BENGALS]

We should. But instead two of those picks are no longer on the team, one is a backup, and the other has never played an NFL snap and was drafted by the same guy who picked the other 3... And the veteran tackle we traded for doesn’t want to be here. So shit.

Apparently the guys we have picked up off the scrap heap are here to solve all of our problems and we don’t even have to worry about the OL anymore. We did win a couple games last year ya know.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(02-10-2020, 12:51 PM)Bengalstripes18 Wrote: Thats my thinking. If they want to keep Glenn as our LG, then we may be fine for starters this year, but we have zero depth like last year. Id like to see another guard with great upside added at the very least. Would prefer one guard and one tackle.


The line definitely needs some identity. I have been wanting a veteran guard to solidify our line. The titans poached a guard from the rams and it worked out quite well on their run this year.

If they think they are good for this year with Glenn, they still need to draft one with a lot of potential. A guard that can play tackle would be great for depth.

Glenn is a decent pass protector but he is so soft in the run game and he costs like 9 mil this year.

That and he was being an ass last year. I don't see him being back unless the FO is even more inept than I thought.

They have to bring in at least 1 FA O-lineman and with the dough we should have with letting Dalton and Glenn go we 
can easily afford one whether it is a Guard or even a RT like Conklin.

[Shake n Blake]

(02-10-2020, 02:45 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Over the last 5 years we have spent three first round picks and one second round on the offensive line.  We have also traded for the 8th highest paid OT in the league.

The front office obviously realizes how important the o-line is.  They just can't pick the right players.  With the resources we have spent on it we should have a very good O-line right now.

I have no issue with the drafting priorities, but when it was obvious that Ogbuehi/Fisher weren't working out, I think we should've shown a little more urgency in using other avenues to address the problem. Trading for Glenn was nice, but that was the only significant non-draft move we made in 4 years of terrible line play...and Glenn was kind of a bust as a Bengal.

...and no, I don't consider John Miller, Bobby Hart or John Jerry to be significant moves. We scraped the bottom for those guys.

[BrownAssClown]

(02-10-2020, 02:45 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Over the last 5 years we have spent three first round picks and one second round on the offensive line.  We have also traded for the 8th highest paid OT in the league.

The front office obviously realizes how important the o-line is.  They just can't pick the right players.  With the resources we have spent on it we should have a very good O-line right now.

I won't fault the front office for trying as the oline has been reeling since the departure of Big Whit and Zeitler. I understand their reasoning as why they let Whitworth go, they assumed at his age his production was due to drop off; I still don't know why they let Zeitler walk, maybe they thought he wasn't worth the cash Cleveland threw at him. We have had bad luck trying to fill the holes left behind ever since with draft picks that haven't worked out and low tier free agents such as Jerry and Hart. The good OT we did bring in has been disgruntled, hurt and acts like he doesn't want to be here. The only choice is to keep drafting and hope to get some "hits" instead of "misses" and maybe try to bring in some better FA's other than the likes of John Jerry and Bobbie Hart. We need Jonah to come in and live up to round he was picked in and Price to start producing at the professional level but time is quickly running out on Billy.

[bengals1969]

(02-10-2020, 02:45 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Over the last 5 years we have spent three first round picks and one second round on the offensive line.  We have also traded for the 8th highest paid OT in the league.

The front office obviously realizes how important the o-line is.  They just can't pick the right players.  With the resources we have spent on it we should have a very good O-line right now.

 Paul Alexander was considered a guru for Olinemen, and in fact he had a pretty good run.  Since the Bengals use coaches to scout I'd assume his recommendations carried weight in the draft room and when considering FA's.  I put those choices on Paul Alexander and their failure to develop upon him and his staff.

To me this is their first season where they've(coaches) had as much time as any NFL team to make their evaluations of picks and FA's.  

[Truck_1_0_1_]

(02-10-2020, 03:17 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: I have no issue with the drafting priorities, but when it was obvious that Ogbuehi/Fisher weren't working out, I think we should've shown a little more urgency in using other avenues to address the problem. Trading for Glenn was nice, but that was the only significant non-draft move we made in 4 years of terrible line play...and Glenn was kind of a bust as a Bengal.

...and no, I don't consider John Miller, Bobby Hart or John Jerry to be significant moves. We scraped the bottom for those guys.

Miller's never been a BAD guard; average at worst, above average at best.

Don't disagree with the other two.

[Bengalstripes9]

(02-10-2020, 03:04 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Glenn is a decent pass protector but he is so soft in the run game and he costs like 9 mil this year.

That and he was being an ass last year. I don't see him being back unless the FO is even more inept than I thought.

They have to bring in at least 1 FA O-lineman and with the dough we should have with letting Dalton and Glenn go we 
can easily afford one whether it is a Guard or even a RT like Conklin.

I agree. Itd be nice to see them bring in a proven veteran to help stabilize the line and bring some leadership—forming a nice pairing with jonah williams who is already showing leadership without playing.

Going off what Hobson says, if the team thinks we’re fine, it makes me think Glenn is still in the picture or they are really high on the young guys.

If they aren't bringing in a veteran lineman, i would like to keep Glenn as we need a backup left tackle. Then draft his replacement (a G/T) and let him leave next year. If they let Glenn go, they need to bring in at least two lineman because our depth is horrible.

[SadFaceBengal15]

(02-07-2020, 09:17 AM)Au165 Wrote: I mentioned this in the draft thread, I don't think the team sees the issues the same way we do. The big reason is Williams will fix the LT issue and Fred Johnson played well enough to get a shot at RT at the end of the year. Hopkins is the guy at Center and Miller was average but I think they will stay with him another year based on his contract. That really just leaves LG open and I believe they see Jordan as getting better throughout the year. I know the PFF grades by the way, just saying O line is a place coaches all over the league and PFF often disagree. Now say Lewis from LSU is there to start day 3 I don't think that precludes them from using a mid round pick on a value at guard ( or similarly tackle), however I don't think it'll be big assets.

I agree with this and who knows but the plan last year was to move Glenn inside to LG so honestly with Williams back at LT glenn LG Hopkins in the middle and billy price and miller and Jordan fight for the right guard spot with Fred Johnson at RT I see us as much improved

[bengals1969]

(02-10-2020, 05:50 PM)SadFaceBengal15 Wrote: I agree with this and who knows but the plan last year was to move Glenn inside to LG so honestly with Williams back at LT glenn LG Hopkins in the middle and billy price and miller and Jordan fight for the right guard spot with Fred Johnson at RT I see us as much improved

I see the need for competition on the Oline from the LT to RT spots.  Nobody as of right now deserves to start without competing for it.  Lack of depth on the Oline has been as big an issue as lack of talent.  Williams will get every opportunity to start given his draft pedigree.   Everybody else, run the competition off in training camp if you can, otherwise get replaced.    I see a 2-14 Oline that easily could have a new name at starter for every position.

[fortyyearfan]

(02-07-2020, 10:51 AM)J24 Wrote: We need a RT more than anything else; anyways if you say the oline improved at the end of the season then you can say the same thing about the defense. So both should have the same priority.

First round,Joe Burrow,second and third,will be defense BPA,PROBABLY 4th and on will be defense,unless a monster on offense falls.Top will to get done is the defense. :andy: :andy: :andy: :andy: :andy:

[impactplaya]

I hope they sign a vet with upside like Jack Cockhlin from
The Titans.
Who was the last free agent o-lineman this franchise sigNed
That actually played at a high level when he got here ....
Bobbie Williams ?
That's 12 13 years ago.

[Hammerstripes]

Keep in mind they also tried to trade up in round 2 to get another one

[scorp1974]

We need a good guy to coach them up. Also, everyone seems to get hurt so the constant shuffling around doesnt help at all.

[Nati#1]

Id grab OG-Logan Stenberg from Kentucky in the 3rd. We need to sign a Free Agent Middle Linebacker and hopefully get Kenneth Murray in the 2nd.

[Joelist]

Miller looked better once we scrapped the stretch zone scheme and did more directional blocking. Really it was a mystery why we started the season in that blocking scheme especially after taking Sample - a blocking TE best suited for power schemes.

[BURROWorBUST]

(02-10-2020, 04:28 PM)bengals1969 Wrote:  Paul Alexander was considered a guru for Olinemen, and in fact he had a pretty good run.  Since the Bengals use coaches to scout I'd assume his recommendations carried weight in the draft room and when considering FA's.  I put those choices on Paul Alexander and their failure to develop upon him and his staff.

To me this is their first season where they've(coaches) had as much time as any NFL team to make their evaluations of picks and FA's.  

It's also their first season to evaluate what they have on the roster.

Jonah Williams
Trey Hopkins
M. Jordan
Billy Price 
John Miller
Bobby Hart
Fred Johnson

Cody Glenn is probably gone.

I don't know how they'd rate these guys, but I'd have to think they'll target at least 1 G and 1 T in FA and/or the Draft. Most of us know better than to get our hopes up about FA, but who knows? They might surprise us. As far as the draft goes, we'll get some extra picks for Andy and Dre K. But we might have to package them to move up in the draft in order to get a decent Olineman and still get a WR and some needed parts for the D. 

The front office and coaches have their work cut out for them this year.

[RunKijanaRun]

I've had a nasty flu for the last 5 days, so I had to read though this twice to ensure I wasn't in some hazy fog of medicine and mucus.

We're now going with the narrative that the o-line is okay? Am I reading this right?

[MEBengalsFan]

(02-07-2020, 01:11 AM)Bengalstripes18 Wrote: I just read the latest hobsons choice and he’s saying they dont need to invest more in the offensive line. This concerns me. I would like to see a stud guard or tackle added to bolster depth and upgrade the starting lineup. He’s saying to let the young guys continue developing—pointing to the late season emergence of a running game and jonah williams coming on as the starting left tackle.

Does this concern anyone? I dont want to see Burrow get killed. Our line got beat like a drum almost every play last year. I feel like we keep falling victim to this stubborn belief that we should invest in skill players and just roll with who we got on the offensive line.

I like what he says about drafting defense; but am I wrong in thinking we need to upgrade the line with another player or two?

If the Bengals add any OL from FA or the draft the FA additions will be on the cheaper side and in the draft the later rounds, especially if someone slips to the 4th or 5th rounds they like. 

I would like the Bengals to add one solid FA addition, maybe not a stud but someone that has played at a high level and isn't ranked below 50 for PFF. If no additions are made to the OL and Burrow comes here, chances are he will do the exact same thing Palmer and Dalton have done in their down years, run for their life. Jonah will help the left side but him alone coming back won't resolve the issues at guard or the RT spots. They need another solid body in there. 

[Truck_1_0_1_]

Personally, I think a 3 way fight at RT (Hart, Fred and either a pick or someone brought in) will shore up the right side and then all we need to worry about is LG (which is either Glenn's or MJ's, at this point). Draft or FA may address that as well.

It's easy to forget too, that many players play better or worse depending on scheme (as Joelist alluded to with Miller above); Matt Kalil went from a stud LT to one of the worst OTs in the league, in *1* season, due to completely changing the blocking scheme around.

Thus, maybe there's a FA OL that happens to fit with Turner perfectly, that they couldn't get last year; we have no idea how this could turn out, realistically.

I just mainly want to see Jonah out there and what he can do; all healed up and going back in the weight room this offseason, I sincerely feel he will be great next year.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(02-10-2020, 05:25 PM)Bengalstripes18 Wrote: I agree. Itd be nice to see them bring in a proven veteran to help stabilize the line and bring some leadership—forming a nice pairing with jonah williams who is already showing leadership without playing.

Going off what Hobson says, if the team thinks we’re fine, it makes me think Glenn is still in the picture or they are really high on the young guys.

If they aren't bringing in a veteran lineman, i would like to keep Glenn as we need a backup left tackle. Then draft his replacement (a G/T) and let him leave next year. If they let Glenn go, they need to bring in at least two lineman because our depth is horrible.

If Glenn wants to play LG and stays in line he may still be here.

If he was acting up last year and wanting to be traded when he was a starting LT I don't see him being content at being a 
backup LT. We need to let Glenn and his salary go, bring in a Guard or RT in FA and Draft an O-lineman relatively early.

I think this is most likely to happen myself. OL and LB in FA. At least I hope so. I just don't see Glenn sticking around.