Joe Burrow under pressure

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(05-05-2020, 08:39 PM)Cicero Wrote: Might be a combo of the two. As a Buckeye fan I was skeptical hen Meyer came in talking about a power running attack from the spread shotgun but then we had Elliot and Dobbins and other major programs doing the same thing. I am a football nerd to say the least but I find it really interesting to watch the game evolve.   

Feel the same, watching the game evolve is fun. What Joe Burrow clearly likes is more space with less blockers so he can use 
his gifts of manipulating the pocket all the while throwing the ball into the empty spots on the field. This is a very rare quality in
QB's and is something that I think gives Burrow a jump ahead of other rookie QB's entering the NFL.

We will see what the lack of a full Offseason playing with the team and how it will affect him.

I don't see Burrow just coming in and taking the league by storm but he will grow as the season goes on and I think he will do 
well and hopefully break Mayfield's records as a rookie. Not betting against it.

I don't like the Ratbirds taking Dobbins BTW, I think Dobbins is special.

[Cicero]

(05-05-2020, 09:07 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Feel the same, watching the game evolve is fun. What Joe Burrow clearly likes is more space with less blockers so he can use 
his gifts of manipulating the pocket all the while throwing the ball into the empty spots on the field. This is a very rare quality in
QB's and is something that I think gives Burrow a jump ahead of other rookie QB's entering the NFL.

We will see what the lack of a full Offseason playing with the team and how it will affect him.

I don't see Burrow just coming in and taking the league by storm but he will grow as the season goes on and I think he will do 
well and hopefully break Mayfield's records as a rookie. Not betting against it.

I don't like the Ratbirds taking Dobbins BTW, I think Dobbins is special.

I was upset about it to but my wife pointed out that he could have been a stealer like Cam. My dislike of Baltimore pales in comparison to my stealer hatred. 

As for Burrow I agree that he might struggle out of the gate. The learning curve is steepest for quarterbacks.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(05-06-2020, 12:42 PM)Cicero Wrote: I was upset about it to but my wife pointed out that he could have been a stealer like Cam. My dislike of Baltimore pales in comparison to my stealer hatred. 

As for Burrow I agree that he might struggle out of the gate. The learning curve is steepest for quarterbacks.

True, could of been worse, Dobbins could of went to those shitheads.

[Joelist]

In order for Burrow to play the five man protect he likes we NEED to have a strong interior OL. It is in a way more important than the tackles because pressure right up the middle is death to this type of strategy. The Bengals should know all about this as we have had big issues on the interior OL for a while. Trey Hopkins has FINALLY elevated our Center position to a form of decency but the Guard spots are still in flux.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(05-06-2020, 02:10 PM)Joelist Wrote: In order for Burrow to play the five man protect he likes we NEED to have a strong interior OL. It is in a way more important than the tackles because pressure right up the middle is death to this type of strategy. The Bengals should know all about this as we have had big issues on the interior OL for a while. Trey Hopkins has FINALLY elevated our Center position to a form of decency but the Guard spots are still in flux.

I liked the XSF pick up and Jordan could improve into a decent Guard for us but this is truly still the main concern in my eyes.

Price just hasn't shown anything decent in the NFL yet so he doesn't seem to be the answer.

But it is not like LSU's interior O-line was great in pass protection either. I saw many times where Burrow had Defenders come
through the middle and Burrow would just avoid the rush and either take off or make the throw he was intending to anyways.

Still hoping for at least one more addition at Guard though in case cause this is still a concern.

[fredtoast]

(05-06-2020, 02:46 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: But it is not like LSU's interior O-line was great in pass protection either. 

They had the #2 OC taken in the draft and the #3 OG.  The LSU O-line won the Joe Moore Award for the best O-line in the country.

Generally the only time he had pressure was when they only had 5 in protection and the overloaded a spot with a blitz.

BTW, anyone who thinks Joe is going to avoid rushers in the NFL like he did in college needs to realize that he was rarely being chased by a group of NFL level talented pass rushers.  Johnny Maoziel made it look easy to avoid the pass rush in college also.  But things change when everyone rushing you is an NFL talent.

Not bashing Joe.  Just trying to keep the discussion realistic.

[fredtoast]

(05-01-2020, 10:47 PM)Whatever Wrote: The Joe Moore award isn't for the best OL in football.

Yes it is unless you want to argue that "most outstanding" is not the same as "best"

https://247sports.com/college/lsu/Article/College-Football-Joe-Moore-Award-LSU-OL-winner-2019-offensive-line-140841795/

The LSU Tigers offensive line has been selected as the 2019 winner of the Joe Moore Award for the Most Outstanding Offensive Line Unit in College Football. The announcement was made by The Foundation for Teamwork which has presented this unique award since 2015.

(05-01-2020, 10:47 PM)Whatever Wrote: The LSU OL was mostly slow footed in line maulers that were good in the run game, but were not good in pass protection

Wrong

(05-01-2020, 11:16 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Yeah, they were far from the best OL in the country. Every game I watched Burrow was pressured A TON.

Burrow was not pressured "a ton".  But when he was pressured it was generally because there were only 5 in protection and the defense could easily overload one spot with a blitz

(05-01-2020, 11:28 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Sometimes the best thing to do is watch the bad tape if the good tape is just so damn good.



Makes more sense to me now, I thought I saw terrible pass blocking and good run blocking with LSU last season.

Here are what the experts who watched the film and voted on the Joe Moore Award had to say about the pass blocking of LSU's offensive line


"There is a tendency to hyper-focus on the rushing attacks and the run-blocking of these units, but LSU forced us to really alter our filters and do a deeper dive. They were solid against the run, but their ability to handle protection duties against SEC rushers with so many receivers out in routes was really impressive and one of the reasons QB Joe Burrow won the Heisman. It's not THE reason, but it's definitely one of them."

"It's incredible how often and how well they pass block in "empty" protection (no TE or RB help). There are plays all season, including the SEC Championship game where they are blocking 6, 7, 8, 10 seconds while Burrow looks to throw downfield. Great awareness in pass pro and often look for work and pick up delayed rushers. Appear willing to happily serve up some "full slabs" by rearranging an unsuspecting D-lineman's rib cage in slide protection. Very physical bunch."

"Passing as much as this offense did this year puts a unique strain on the group up front and boy did they respond. Sitting and watching these guys on film, the number of pass protection reps that I wrote down 'Teach Tape Worthy' next to in my notes was remarkable. Pass pro is definitely not passive for these guys."

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(05-06-2020, 03:16 PM)fredtoast Wrote: They had the #2 OC taken in the draft and the #3 OG.  The LSU O-line won the Joe Moore Award for the best O-line in the country.

Generally the only time he had pressure was when they only had 5 in protection and the overloaded a spot with a blitz.

BTW, anyone who thinks Joe is going to avoid rushers in the NFL like he did in college needs to realize that he was rarely being chased by a group of NFL level talented pass rushers.  Johnny Maoziel made it look easy to avoid the pass rush in college also.  But things change when everyone rushing you is an NFL talent.

Not bashing Joe.  Just trying to keep the discussion realistic.

Cushenberry and Damien Lewis were pretty good but that was mostly cause they are good run blockers.

Burrow got hit tons and it wasn't cause they were in five-man protection...

Read what Holic shown in the Bengals failing Burrow thread...

Statistically, in 5 man pro the QB gets sacked less and it opens it up for the QB so he has more lanes and more options.

Definitely true that Joe hasn't faced NFL level yet but the SEC as you know is the best in college for the most part.

[Nicomo Cosca]

There’s a reason Burrow went #1OA, and no LSU Olineman went before the 3rd round. Period. Especially these days when team’s are desperate for good OL players.

Idc about Joo Moore awards or Rimington awards (how’d that work out for Billy Price?), or blue ribbon super duper awards, Burrow is the one that made that offense go. Fred trying to paint the LSU OL as the Dallas Cowboys of college football is disingenuous, and flat out wrong.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(05-06-2020, 08:43 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: There’s a reason Burrow went #1OA, and no LSU Olineman went before the 3rd round. Period. Especially these days when team’s are desperate for good OL players.

Idc about Joo Moore awards or Rimington awards (how’d that work out for Billy Price?), or blue ribbon super duper awards, Burrow is the one that made that offense go. Fred trying to paint the LSU OL as the Dallas Cowboys of college football is disingenuous, and flat out wrong.

True, if anything the best overall Lineman in the draft a couple years ago should do very well at LT and so should Trey-Hop and
the rest of the Line should get better cause of Burrow. He helps everyone around him including the OL and his weapons, might 
be just what makes Joe Burrow so special.

What is crazy is there is so much more that makes Burrow special. The best QB's are great under pressure.

[Nicomo Cosca]

(05-06-2020, 08:49 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: True, if anything the best overall Lineman in the draft a couple years ago should do very well at LT and so should Trey-Hop and
the rest of the Line should get better cause of Burrow. He helps everyone around him including the OL and his weapons, might 
be just what makes Joe Burrow so special.

What is crazy is there is so much more that makes Burrow special. The best QB's are great under pressure.

Yeah, hopefully Jonah shows Joe what it’s like to have an elite LT blocking for him...

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(05-06-2020, 09:10 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Yeah, hopefully Jonah shows Joe what it’s like to have an elite LT blocking for him...

Yes sir cause Burrow sure didn't have an elite one at LSU last year no matter what Fred tries to argue.