Joey B talks to Collinsworth

[JaggedJimmyJay]

(04-21-2021, 04:39 PM)TJ528 Wrote: I'll be the first to support Zac and the coaching staff if they turn it around and win 10+ games this year. 

The chances of that happening IMO are slim to none but if they do happen i'll be the first to eat crow. 

With the talent he's had the first 2 years and done nothing with it, prove to me you can win.

Part of me wonders if Burrow supports Taylor so much because Zac played football at Nebraska so I'm sure the families know one another.  

So he isnt going to call out a family friend for being a loser. 

That's definitely not why Burrow supports Taylor.

Burrow supports Taylor because Burrow believes in Taylor. This stuff isn't that surprising, and Joe is hardly the only one. Did anyone listen to Mike Daniels' interview with Jim Rome this week? He raved about Zac Taylor, and there have been others too. The players, for better or for worse, largely seem to love the guy.

[Sled21]

(04-21-2021, 04:45 PM)JaggedJimmyJay Wrote: That's definitely not why Burrow supports Taylor.

Burrow supports Taylor because Burrow believes in Taylor. This stuff isn't that surprising, and Joe is hardly the only one. Did anyone listen to Mike Daniels' interview with Jim Rome this week? He raved about Zac Taylor, and there have been others too. The players, for better or for worse, largely seem to love the guy.

Because the players see what he's building and know it takes time.

[TJ528]

(04-21-2021, 04:45 PM)JaggedJimmyJay Wrote: That's definitely not why Burrow supports Taylor.

Burrow supports Taylor because Burrow believes in Taylor. This stuff isn't that surprising, and Joe is hardly the only one. Did anyone listen to Mike Daniels' interview with Jim Rome this week? He raved about Zac Taylor, and there have been others too. The players, for better or for worse, largely seem to love the guy.

For better or worse though, I've raved about bosses in the past that end up getting fired due to lack of success.  

So whether I liked the guy or not didnt lead to our department having success with him at the helm.  

Just sayin!

[JaggedJimmyJay]

(04-21-2021, 04:50 PM)TJ528 Wrote: For better or worse though, I've raved about bosses in the past that end up getting fired due to lack of success.  

So whether I liked the guy or not didnt lead to our department having success with him at the helm.  

Just sayin!

I agree, it's no guarantee.

For the organization's sake, I really hope they take significant strides this season. If they have a head coach that is extremely popular with the players and extremely unpopular with the fanbase, I don't envy the position they'd be in. If you fire the guy to satiate fans and in the process alienate your core (possibly even Burrow himself), that's a shitty spot.

[TJ528]

(04-21-2021, 04:55 PM)JaggedJimmyJay Wrote: I agree, it's no guarantee.

For the organization's sake, I really hope they take significant strides this season. If they have a head coach that is extremely popular with the players and extremely unpopular with the fanbase, I don't envy the position they'd be in. If you fire the guy to satiate fans and in the process alienate your core (possibly even Burrow himself), that's a shitty spot.

My question to you Jagged would be then, we're at the midway point of the season and our Bengals are 1-7 (hypothetical).  We've had some injuries and bad luck.  Defense is ranked 30th in the NFL.  Lou can't coach an NFL defense to save his life. 

What do you do?  I probably fire Zac.  However, I dont think we'll be 1-7.  i think our high end for wins in 2021 is 9 and our low end is 4-5 depending on injuries and Burrows health.  

[JaggedJimmyJay]

(04-21-2021, 04:58 PM)TJ528 Wrote: My question to you Jagged would be then, we're at the midway point of the season and our Bengals are 1-7 (hypothetical).  We've had some injuries and bad luck.  Defense is ranked 30th in the NFL.  Lou can't coach an NFL defense to save his life. 

What do you do?  I probably fire Zac.  However, I dont think we'll be 1-7.  i think our high end for wins in 2021 is 9 and our low end is 4-5 depending on injuries and Burrows health.  

If they start 1-7 I probably fire him too. I'd at least be mindful of context in case of major injuries or something, but it's hard to be competent and start 1-7 or worse twice in three seasons.

I think the players would probably be more open to it then too. Just as winning cures all ailments, losing cures all optimism.

[TJ528]

(04-21-2021, 05:03 PM)JaggedJimmyJay Wrote: If they start 1-7 I probably fire him too. I'd at least be mindful of context in case of major injuries or something, but it's hard to be competent and start 1-7 or worse twice in three seasons.

I think the players would probably be more open to it then too. Just as winning cures all ailments, losing cures all optimism.

Trust me, i REALLY want to see a winner/playoff team in Cincinnati next season.  

I'd love to see Zac turn into the next Bill Belichick and turn into one of the greatest in NFL history.

I just have to manage my expectations with reality because I've gone into season with high expectations and got let down.  

Lucy's pulled the football from me one too many times.  

As Marvin would say, I see better than i hear.  

[GodFather]

How can ya not love this kid? He will do special things here if the front office doesn’t F’k it up.

[ah5]

(04-21-2021, 12:18 PM)Big_Ern Wrote: We are so lucky to have this kid. Thank God Huber shanked that punt and we list to Miami.

As with every other year, Huber is the MVP.

[sandwedge]

(04-21-2021, 04:39 PM)TJ528 Wrote: I'll be the first to support Zac and the coaching staff if they turn it around and win 10+ games this year. 

The chances of that happening IMO are slim to none but if they do happen i'll be the first to eat crow. 

With the talent he's had the first 2 years and done nothing with it, prove to me you can win.

Part of me wonders if Burrow supports Taylor so much because Zac played football at Nebraska so I'm sure the families know one another.  

So he isnt going to call out a family friend for being a loser. 

Or he supports Zac because he knows more about football than a bunch of us on a message board.....

[PDub80]

(04-22-2021, 12:43 AM)sandwedge Wrote: Or he supports Zac because he knows more about football than a bunch of us on a message board.....

^ This

[Nicomo Cosca]

I think it’s quite possible Joe just really likes Zac personally, and he hopes he will turn out to be a good coach.

[fredtoast]

(04-22-2021, 12:43 AM)sandwedge Wrote: Or he supports Zac because he knows more about football than a bunch of us on a message board.....

(04-22-2021, 01:18 AM)PDub80 Wrote: ^ This

Yeah, right, because no NFL player who supported his coach has ever been proven wrong.

NFL players almost always support their current coach.  It is hard to be successful if you convince yourself that you are going to fail.  So most of them try to think positive and work toward winning instead of sitting around moping because they believe that they can't win with a certain coach.  Team leaders often try even harder to promote a positive outlook.  Teams that think they can win are more likely to win.  They are more likely to work harder and not give up when things get tough.

As a fan I don't have to buy it.  But I understand why they do it.  NFL players literally risk their health and safety when they take the field.  They would be useless if they went into games with no hope.

[XenoMorph]

(04-22-2021, 12:43 AM)sandwedge Wrote: Or he supports Zac because he knows more about football than a bunch of us on a message board.....

or cause hes his boss? and you dont trash your boss to the media then go to work like nothing happened the next day lol

Joe is smart and says the right things.

[TJ528]

(04-22-2021, 12:43 AM)sandwedge Wrote: Or he supports Zac because he knows more about football than a bunch of us on a message board.....

Well I'll give you that.  I have no doubt that Zac Taylor knows more about football in his pinky finger than 99.9% of the people on this board.

However, I'm not sure that 99.9% of the people on this board would have a 6-25-1 record after 32 games in the NFL either.  

Again, I'm like the Missouri state...."Show Me".  Show me results that prove your a good football coach.

Have you seen anything in 2 years that tell you he's a good football coach?  I mean the results speak for themselves.  

This guy has more support from the front office and still failed to win more games in his first 2 seasons than Dave Shula.  

That's saying alot....

However, I hope we do have a winning season because this team will never win with Burrow changing out coaches all the time. 

[PDub80]

(04-22-2021, 07:56 AM)fredtoast Wrote: Yeah, right, because no NFL player who supported his coach has ever been proven wrong.

NFL players almost always support their current coach.  It is hard to be successful if you convince yourself that you are going to fail.  So most of them try to think positive and work toward winning instead of sitting around moping because they believe that they can't win with a certain coach.  Team leaders often try even harder to promote a positive outlook.  Teams that think they can win are more likely to win.  They are more likely to work harder and not give up when things get tough.

As a fan I don't have to buy it.  But I understand why they do it.  NFL players literally risk their health and safety when they take the field.  They would be useless if they went into games with no hope.

Your arrogance knows no bounds.

[*Nately120*]

(04-21-2021, 12:57 PM)Sled21 Wrote: When we start rattling off wins, it will be amazing how many people on this board will be all in on Taylor too.....

Yeah, nothing worse than people who change their minds based upon actual evidence.

Personally, I'll believe ZT is a winner when he cracks .500 as a head coach. A 19-0 season will put him exactly at .500 so make it so!

(04-22-2021, 12:43 AM)sandwedge Wrote: Or he supports Zac because he knows more about football than a bunch of us on a message board.....

Hue Jackson and Ryan Leaf know more about football than we do.

(04-22-2021, 08:53 AM)TJ528 Wrote: However, I'm not sure that 99.9% of the people on this board would have a 6-25-1 record after 32 games in the NFL either.  

I personally voted for 8-8 his first season as HC...so it goes.  Telling people he'd have 6 wins in 2 years when he was hired would have been the hater-iest of hater takes ever.

[TJ528]

(04-22-2021, 10:33 AM)PDub80 Wrote: Your arrogance knows no bounds.

Personally, I dont think it's arrogance, its a realistic view on this franchise.  

If you've been a fan since the 80's like a lot of people, we've seen some of the stupid shit this organization does, and still does to this day. 

It's pretty sad that most successful period of time for this franchise in his HISTORY was the 15 year reign of Marvin Lewis and yet everyone criticizes the man and says he couldn't win and the team sucked. 

Well I'd welcome you to look at the previous 40 years and see how many successful seasons are included in those season. 

I'd love to see my team be an elite team in this league, but it wont happen until we have elite leadership. 

Maybe that's starting to change with Mikey taking a step back but I'll wait til i see results before I start blowing smoke up their ass. 

[Shake n Blake]

(04-22-2021, 11:06 AM)TJ528 Wrote: Personally, I dont think it's arrogance, its a realistic view on this franchise.  

If you've been a fan since the 80's like a lot of people, we've seen some of the stupid shit this organization does, and still does to this day. 

It's pretty sad that most successful period of time for this franchise in his HISTORY was the 15 year reign of Marvin Lewis and yet everyone criticizes the man and says he couldn't win and the team sucked. 

Well I'd welcome you to look at the previous 40 years and see how many successful seasons are included in those season. 

I'd love to see my team be an elite team in this league, but it wont happen until we have elite leadership. 

Maybe that's starting to change with Mikey taking a step back but I'll wait til i see results before I start blowing smoke up their ass. 

If you've been a fan since the 80s, you'd realize that 2003-2018 wasn't the most successful run in team history.

Marvin Lewis was Sam Wyche without the Super Bowl run.

[TJ528]

(04-22-2021, 11:11 AM)Shake n Blake Wrote: If you've been a fan since the 80s, you'd realize that 2003-2018 wasn't the most successful run in team history.

Marvin Lewis was Sam Wyche without the Super Bowl run.

Shake you're not wrong on that analysis, but if i remember right Sam's run started in 1984 and ended in 1991.  So that was a 8 years. 

Marvin was around for 15 years. 

Outside those 2 head coaches what do you have?  

I should've said that Marvin was one of two of the most successful coaches in Bengals history and it was the longest running period of success in Bengals history. 

Thank you for correcting me.