Assessing the Cap

[Luvnit2]

Maybe this will help everyone to see the cap hits (top51) for each team which factors in each team's draft picks + the offset of removing a player from  the top 51.

"A look at the estimated Top 51 cap space needed for each team to sign its draft class during the offseason. These figures consist of the projected 2022 cap figure for each slotted draft pick in next month's draft."

https://www.spotrac.com/spots/projected-2022-nfl-draft-pools-1453/

There are teams that need a lot of cap space for draft picks, we need a little over 5.3 million.

[fredtoast]

(03-30-2022, 06:17 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: Maybe this will help everyone to see the cap hits (top51) for each team which factors in each team's draft picks + the offset of removing a player from  the top 51.

"A look at the estimated Top 51 cap space needed for each team to sign its draft class during the offseason. These figures consist of the projected 2022 cap figure for each slotted draft pick in next month's draft."

https://www.spotrac.com/spots/projected-2022-nfl-draft-pools-1453/

There are teams that need a lot of cap space for draft picks, we need a little over 5.3 million.

I am sure the guys at Spotrac understand this better than me.  But they list the estimated base salary of our #1 pick to be $705,000 and the signing bonus to be $1,589,331 for a total of $2,294,331.  Then they list the cap hit under "total" as $2,294,331 and also under "top 51" as $2,294,331.  The signing bonus does not appear to be spread out over the length of the contract and it does not seem to take into account the salary that would be bumped from the "top 51".

Cincinnati Bengals 2022 Salary Cap Table | Spotrac

[Luvnit2]

(03-30-2022, 06:29 PM)fredtoast Wrote: I am sure the guys at Spotrac understand this better than me.  But they list the estimated base salary of our #1 pick to be $705,000 and the signing bonus to be $1,589,331 for a total of $2,294,331.  Then they list the cap hit under "total" as $2,294,331 and also under "top 51" as $2,294,331.  The signing bonus does not appear to be spread out over the length of the contract and it does not seem to take into account the salary that would be bumped from the "top 51".

Cincinnati Bengals 2022 Salary Cap Table | Spotrac

I assume they use past contracts. The base salary can also increase in years 2 through 4 to get to the projected number for the entire contract
We only see their 2022 projection

[Isaac Curtis: The Real #85]

(03-30-2022, 06:17 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: Maybe this will help everyone to see the cap hits (top51) for each team which factors in each team's draft picks + the offset of removing a player from  the top 51.

"A look at the estimated Top 51 cap space needed for each team to sign its draft class during the offseason. These figures consist of the projected 2022 cap figure for each slotted draft pick in next month's draft."

https://www.spotrac.com/spots/projected-2022-nfl-draft-pools-1453/

There are teams that need a lot of cap space for draft picks, we need a little over 5.3 million.

No. You are still not getting it. How is it that people don't get dispacement? Do we need to start all cap discussions with an Archimedes primer?

1) Yes, the total COST to sign our picks would be $7.5 mil or so (though spotrac incorrectly has 7 instead if 8). 

2) Cost is not the same as cap. It would be if we only had 43 guys under contract and the 8 picks were filling out the roster. But the fact is, we have 61/62 guys under contract. So, when we "sign" pick #31, yes, the cap hit for him is $2.4 mil in year 1. But he is replacing a guy at $825k or $895k.  The NET impact on our cap for pick #31 is $1.6 mil or so. Just over $200-$300k for Rd 2. Rd 3 is under $100k. Rd4 on is a wash, or produces a net savings. 

3) All this is assuming we cut the lowest cost guy under contract. Say we pick Daxton Hill. He's a safety. If he takes Brandon Wilson's spot, Wilson makes $2.5 mil with $500k dead cap. Hill might only "cost" us $400k in cap. 

[Luvnit2]

(04-03-2022, 04:38 PM)Isaac Curtis: The Real #85 Wrote: No. You are still not getting it. How is it that people don't get dispacement? Do we need to start all cap discussions with an Archimedes primer?

1) Yes, the total COST to sign our picks would be $7.5 mil or so (though spotrac incorrectly has 7 instead if 8). 

2) Cost is not the same as cap. It would be if we only had 43 guys under contract and the 8 picks were filling out the roster. But the fact is, we have 61/62 guys under contract. So, when we "sign" pick #31, yes, the cap hit for him is $2.4 mil in year 1. But he is replacing a guy at $825k or $895k.  The NET impact on our cap for pick #31 is $1.6 mil or so. Just over $200-$300k for Rd 2. Rd 3 is under $100k. Rd4 on is a wash, or produces a net savings. 

3) All this is assuming we cut the lowest cost guy under contract. Say we pick Daxton Hill. He's a safety. If he takes Brandon Wilson's spot, Wilson makes $2.5 mil with $500k dead cap. Hill might only "cost" us $400k in cap. 

I am getting it just fine. Have you look at projected (actual cap cost and not cash) rookie pool on Spotrac projected cap space with the 2 columns. !st column is with no offset, or over 7 million needed and 2nd column is with offset and where I got the number of 5.3 million needed for the Bengals rookie pool.

[casear2727]

(04-03-2022, 06:15 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: I am getting it just fine. Have you look at projected (actual cap cost and not cash) rookie pool on Spotrac projected cap space with the 2 columns. !st column is with no offset, or over 7 million needed and 2nd column is with offset and where I got the number of 5.3 million needed for the Bengals rookie pool.

The 5.3 is definitely high.  Sportract Top 51 column includes the 3 top base salaries plus all estimated bonuses without any proration.

We know the bottom 7 of the current roster salaries range from 825,000 to 895,500.

If every signing bonus is prorated the only salary that would count would be the #1 pick at an estimated 1M cap hit.  However, so many of the signing bonuses are very cheap and may not be prorated.  

I would guess that 2.3M would be sufficient.

Also Sportrac lists only 7 rookies instead of 8, so that could have a minor impact.

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

(04-03-2022, 06:15 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: I am getting it just fine. Have you look at projected (actual cap cost and not cash) rookie pool on Spotrac projected cap space with the 2 columns. !st column is with no offset, or over 7 million needed and 2nd column is with offset and where I got the number of 5.3 million needed for the Bengals rookie pool.

https://overthecap.com/draft/
~$8.4m pool, ~$2.7m cap hit

Your $7m and $5.3m can't add up, Luvnit. The cheapest player on the Bengals roster right now is making $705k, so your difference of $1.7m just isn't possible because they have 8 draft picks. 8 picks x $705k (minimum) = at least $5.64m of the rookie pool that isn't going towards the cap.

[Luvnit2]

(04-03-2022, 08:24 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: https://overthecap.com/draft/
~$8.4m pool, ~$2.7m cap hit

Your $7m and $5.3m can't add up, Luvnit. The cheapest player on the Bengals roster right now is making $705k, so your difference of $1.7m just isn't possible because they have 8 draft picks. 8 picks x $705k (minimum) = at least $5.64m of the rookie pool that isn't going towards the cap.

Look at Spotrac, it is not my numbers, it is theirs at right on the Bengals page for all to see. It breaks down each pick 2 ways, with an offset projected and first column with no offset.
https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/cincinnati-bengals/cap/


2022 Projected Draft Pool Cap


Estimated cap dollars necessary to sign upcoming draft picks (not included in the cap figure yet)
PLAYER (7)
POS.
BASE SALARY
SIGNING BONUS
ROSTER BONUS
OPTION BONUS
WORKOUT BONUS
RESTRUC. BONUS
MISC.
DEAD CAP
CAP HIT (TOTAL)
CAP HIT (TOP 51)Round 1, Pick #31

$705,000
$1,589,331
-
-
-
-
-
-
$2,294,331
$2,294,331
Round 2, Pick #63

$705,000
$398,798
-
-
-
-
-
-
$1,103,798
$1,103,798
Round 3, Pick #95

$705,000
$242,421
-
-
-
-
-
-
$947,421
$947,421
Round 4, Pick #136

$705,000
$184,287
-
-
-
-
-
-
$889,287
$184,287
Round 5, Pick #174

$705,000
$76,633
-
-
-
-
-
-
$781,633
$76,633
Round 6, Pick #209

$705,000
$42,835
-
-
-
-
-
-
$747,835
$42,835
Round 7, Pick #252

$705,000
$21,894
-
-
-
-
-
-
$726,894
$21,894Projected Draft Pool:









$7,491,199
$4,671,199


You like over the cap, I  have used both over the years and like Spotrac better for accuracy. Maybe we can just agree to disagree.

[bengalsboy]

Stephon Diggs just got  a 4 year 104 million dollar deal with Bills.Can you imagine what Jamar Chase's agent will want?

[XenoMorph]

(04-06-2022, 01:49 PM)bengalsboy Wrote: Stephon Diggs just got  a 4 year 104 million dollar deal with Bills.Can you imagine what Jamar Chase's agent will want?

thats on top of the 2 years he had left on current deal i believe

[higgy100]

(04-06-2022, 01:49 PM)bengalsboy Wrote: Stephon Diggs just got  a 4 year 104 million dollar deal with Bills.Can you imagine what Jamar Chase's agent will want?

Yep but the guy has 600 career catches and over 7000 yards so longevity does play into this, as well, as he's missed only 8-9 games in 7 years. Let's hope Chase can be that consistent but mainly from the health standpoint and the stats will follow and a huge contract will be commanded.

[Destro]

Chase just finished the first year of the rookie deal. Awhile before that is a major concern.

[WeezyBengal]

I mean isn't it more than obvious that Chase and Burrow are going to get paid by now? I don't understand the point of these threads.

[CKwi88]

I mean, of the whacky WR contracts at least Diggs 100% earned that money.

Hopefully Jamaar Chase will also earn a record setting contract.

[NUGDUKWE]

(04-06-2022, 05:35 PM)CKwi88 Wrote: I mean, of the whacky WR contracts at least Diggs 100% earned that money.

Hopefully Jamaar Chase will also earn a record setting contract.

I think Tyreek earned his. I'm not too sure about Diggs. I feel like he had one really good year and the rest was kind of blah. I'm not to sure what or how the Bills are passing out their money. 120mil to an old Vonn Miller whatever Allen is getting paid and now 100 mil to Diggs just crazy. But does make me wish we could work something out with Bates maybe in the 5yrs 70 mil area.

[kalibengal]

(04-06-2022, 05:30 PM)WeezyBengal Wrote: I mean isn't it more than obvious that Chase and Burrow are going to get paid by now? I don't understand the point of these threads.

lets hope Jeff Bezos ex wife buys the team so we can start afford floating these "watson" esque contracts out there.
The teams like Bengals are in deep crap if the NFL doesnt figure out a way to curb this issue thats now out there.
The rich owners who can guarantee large contracts and put the money in escrow will be the teams retaining and or getting all the talent.
  

[jj22]

Just more fire to the funny money cap discussion. They have a franchise QB and signed 2 100 million dollar contracts this offseason (plus more). We got 3 free agents for the price of one and a TE for 3.5 and are pretty much broke.

With the talent we have and the contracts coming up, they are going to have to change their cap philosophy.

[Housh]

If Chase avoids injury and Burrow is who we all think he is he’s gonna be the top paid WR when his contract is up. I cannot see a world in which he’s not getting 10+ TDs a year. Burrows probably also gonna get Mahommes money if he is who we all kinda know he is

Just get ready for it

[*rfaulk34*]

(04-06-2022, 07:24 PM)NUGDUKWE Wrote: I think Tyreek earned his. I'm not too sure about Diggs. I feel like he had one really good year and the rest was kind of blah. I'm not to sure what or how the Bills are passing out their money. 120mil to an old Vonn Miller whatever Allen is getting paid and now 100 mil to Diggs just crazy. But does make me wish we could work something out with Bates maybe in the 5yrs 70 mil area.

Diggs has the 3rd most receiving yards the last 4 years, 4th most receptions, 3rd most targets and 8th most touchdowns. 
Tyreke Hill is 4th most receiving yards the last 4 yeas, 7th most receptions, 6th most targets and 3rd most touchdowns. 

[Sled21]

(04-06-2022, 07:38 PM)kalibengal Wrote: lets hope Jeff Bezos ex wife buys the team so we can start afford floating these "watson" esque contracts out there.
The teams like Bengals are in deep crap if the NFL doesnt figure out a way to curb this issue thats now out there.
The rich owners who can guarantee large contracts and put the money in escrow will be the teams retaining and or getting all the talent.
  

Pffffttt.... there's a cap. Rich owners can't exceed it. This isn't baseball.