DJ Reader gone after this season

[Bengalbug]

Two words:

Franchise Tag

[*SHRacerX*]

(05-04-2023, 07:16 PM)ElkValleyBengal Wrote: Was going to start a thread about Dexter Lawrence and the Giants agreeing upon a 4 year $90 million dollar extension in the Around the NFL thread.  But this does affect the Bengals I feel in that it essentially ensures Reader will not be a Bengal after the upcoming season- assuming the plan is to keep the three amigos together.

I thought the same thing when I heard that number.  I asked "Is he that much better than Reader?"  I sure don't think so. Looks like the deal has $60 million guaranteed and it is a 4 year extension beyond the 5th year option where he makes a little over $12 million, and it makes his average salary over the next 5 years 22.5 million.   Reader may take a 3 year deal to stay in Cincy that has a solid amount that the Bengals will honor.  How much is that?  No clue.  Reader is in the last year of a 4 year, $53 million contract, which at the time made him the highest paid DT in the NFL.  He will be 30 when he is a FA after next season.  

The Bengals obviously really like him and they haven't drafted an heir apparent.  That age component, though.  

With the growth of the cap and probably letting Hendrickson ending after the 2024 season, it could represent a huge savings by replacing him with Murphy and other young draft picks that allows dollars for Reader.  

They could have their relatively inexpensive secondary as well.  

It will be interesting.  Personally, I love the guy in our run-heavy AFC North.  No matter how powerful the offense is, a team that can run the ball limits possessions and can keep your weapons off the field.  

[*SHRacerX*]

(05-05-2023, 08:05 AM)Bengalbug Wrote: Two words:

Franchise Tag

Very fair point.  The contracts for the top 5 NTs in the league (or do they go by just DT?) shouldn't be that crazy despite Lawrence's huge deal.  

[Luvnit2]

(05-04-2023, 07:16 PM)ElkValleyBengal Wrote: Was going to start a thread about Dexter Lawrence and the Giants agreeing upon a 4 year $90 million dollar extension in the Around the NFL thread.  But this does affect the Bengals I feel in that it essentially ensures Reader will not be a Bengal after the upcoming season- assuming the plan is to keep the three amigos together.

This will be DJ's 3rd contract. I am not so sure an aging DL (old in NFL years when he is 29) will command anything close to Lawrence.

[WeezyBengal]

(05-04-2023, 09:06 PM)ElkValleyBengal Wrote: How are they even going to keep him at his current rate if they keep the three amigos though?

You don't keep the "three amigos". 

Why everyone is so hell bent on keeping Higgins is beyond me. You don't tie up 75% of your cap in your QB, WR1, and WR2. 

If it comes to keeping WR2 or an elite nose tackle like Reader (although I am not 100% sure about him specificailly, given his age) I am 100% keeping that elite nose tackle.

[*ochocincos*]

(05-04-2023, 09:15 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: The salary cap has been increasing more rapidly, after the setback from the covid season.

True it's going up, but not crazy amount.

2022 increase of $25.7 mill was primarily due to 2021 decrease of $15.7 mill the year before.
If comparing to 2020, the 2022 cap only went up by $10 mill.

2023 was an increase of $16.6 mill, but there have been other seasons with >$10 mill increase (2016 - $12 mill, 2017 - $11.7 mill, 2019 - $11 mill)

Burrow's, Chase's, and Higgins' contracts are going to eat up (way) more than the cap will increase.
Also, Bengals can't invest nearly as much $$ into the DL moving forward, maybe up to two veteran starters.
Hendrickson, Hubbard, and Hill are all under contract after Reader hits FA, so I think it's a near certainty he's walking unless willing to take even lower money than he makes now.
Bengals won't, I don't think, give $15+ mill APY to a NT who is 30+ years old.

[kalibengal]

(05-04-2023, 07:32 PM)Isaac Curtis: The Real #85 Wrote: Lawrence is 25, made the Pro-Bowl, had 7.5 sacks last year, and played 864 snaps last year.

Reader is nearly 29, did not make the Pro-Bowl, had 0 sacks last year, and played 397 snaps last year.

See the differences?

dude...thx for these stats. Brings some reality to what we are talking here which can be  an echo chamber at times.  I didnt know Lawrence was kicking that much ass up in NY. 
Unless Reader comes close to this I dont see  reason to panic to get him back

[Frank Booth]

(05-05-2023, 09:52 AM)WeezyBengal Wrote: You don't keep the "three amigos". 

Why everyone is so hell bent on keeping Higgins is beyond me. You don't tie up 75% of your cap in your QB, WR1, and WR2. 

If it comes to keeping WR2 or an elite nose tackle like Reader (although I am not 100% sure about him specificailly, given his age) I am 100% keeping that elite nose tackle.

People are hell bent on keeping Higgins because that’s what the front office says they want to do. Whatever the front office and head coach say, the fans just parrot it. I personally don’t want the team to dump a bunch of money into the WR2 spot

Now, if DJ Reader was even 2 years younger, I’d prioritize him over Higgins all day. Reader is why cincy’s run defense is so damn good. It’s night and day when he’s off the field

[WeezyBengal]

(05-05-2023, 11:10 AM)Frank Booth Wrote: People are hell bent on keeping Higgins because that’s what the front office says they want to do. Whatever the front office and head coach say, the fans just parrot it. I personally don’t want the team to dump a bunch of money into the WR2 spot

Now, if DJ Reader was even 2 years younger, I’d prioritize him over Higgins all day. Reader is why cincy’s run defense is so damn good. It’s night and day when he’s off the field

I like Tee and think he's a really good receiver, but there is absolutely 100% no question that this team needs to prioritize Chase over Tee. Tee's production is replaceable to an extent. Chase is special. Talents like him are generational. It's not necessarily "hard" to find a productive WR2, especially given you have an elite QB and WR1.  

[Frank Booth]

(05-05-2023, 11:19 AM)WeezyBengal Wrote: I like Tee and think he's a really good receiver, but there is absolutely 100% no question that this team needs to prioritize Chase over Tee. Tee's production is replaceable to an extent. Chase is special. Talents like him are generational. It's not necessarily "hard" to find a productive WR2, especially given you have an elite QB and WR1.  

I think the argument for Tee is that he is a top 15 WR and a WR1 who just happens to play with Jamarr Chase. He proved himself when Jamarr was out with an injury

But still, I’d be hesitant to give him big money when they’re obviously gonna pay Joe and Chase

[Housh]

I tried making the money work for Reader in my Madden franchise after signing Chase, Burrow and Tee and even with the game giving me discounts(Chase signed for 21 M per cap hit, Tee for 18M) i absolutely could not keep anyone but Logan Wilson on D. Literally everyone else had to go. I think i was able to sign Pratt too. All of Trey, DJ, BJ, Akeem Davis-Gaither, Awuzie, Bell, and Bates all had to go.


Cap space is deceptive. Accounting for players who gain more money as the contact goes up, factoring in guys who you didn’t think would be as good that you have to now pay. The money does go fast. With Burrow’s extension taking this long I’m starting to believe Burrow was allowing us to engage in FA without fear just so he can see where our cap is at. I assume If we were getting close to what we want to offer Joe, we would’ve let him know and he would’ve told us to stop signing people or to keep signing people if he was willing to take a paycut.

[Housh]

(05-05-2023, 11:22 AM)Frank Booth Wrote: I think the argument for Tee is that he is a top 15 WR and a WR1 who just happens to play with Jamarr Chase. He proved himself when Jamarr was out with an injury

But still, I’d be hesitant to give him big money when they’re obviously gonna pay Joe and Chase

Tee has the build of a #1, the ability of a #1, and he’s managed to find a way to have the stats/production of a #1. I say that because playing with Chase he should theoretically have a hard time reaching 1000 yards but he’s done it the past 2 seasons even with missed games.


The only mark on his game i could see a team at least mentioning is he misses games and he’s not a speed demon. He’s still a deep threat tho so i can’t really see a team bringing it up.

[Frank Booth]

(05-05-2023, 11:46 AM)Housh Wrote: Tee has the build of a #1, the ability of a #1, and he’s managed to find a way to have the stats/production of a #1. I say that because playing with Chase he should theoretically have a hard time reaching 1000 yards but he’s done it the past 2 seasons even with missed games.


The only mark on his game i could see a team at least mentioning is he misses games and he’s not a speed demon. He’s still a deep threat tho so i can’t really see a team bringing it up.

Yea he does seem to get nicked up a bit. I don’t care about the breakaway speed. The one big flaw to his game is that he always finds a way to miss 2-3 games, and leave another 2 games early

[Housh]

(05-05-2023, 08:05 AM)Bengalbug Wrote: Two words:

Franchise Tag

I just don’t know if we want to spend over the cap. Mike Brown tags kickers. No way he tags a premium position.

[OSUfan]

(05-04-2023, 07:16 PM)ElkValleyBengal Wrote: Was going to start a thread about Dexter Lawrence and the Giants agreeing upon a 4 year $90 million dollar extension in the Around the NFL thread.  But this does affect the Bengals I feel in that it essentially ensures Reader will not be a Bengal after the upcoming season- assuming the plan is to keep the three amigos together.

These speculations that are made by so many fans are completely pessimistic and mind bogglingly negative. Cue the realist narrative. The fact of the matter is that the Bengals have always done a very good job, and there is no indication that this is changing, of keeping the team in a great place fiscally (while so many fans were screaming about Mike Brown being cheap). There is also the factor of being a successful organization with a great staff. This makes players want to be here and encourages them to remain here. If DJ truly enjoys being a member of this organization and truly wants to be here then there is the chance that he as well as many others will agree to team friendly deals that allow the organization to retain the core of each unit.


The deal of another player assures absolutely nothing.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(05-04-2023, 07:32 PM)Isaac Curtis: The Real #85 Wrote: Lawrence is 25, made the Pro-Bowl, had 7.5 sacks last year, and played 864 snaps last year.

Reader is nearly 29, did not make the Pro-Bowl, had 0 sacks last year, and played 397 snaps last year.

See the differences?

Makes me feel better about giving the Gravedigger an extension, thanks Ike.

(05-04-2023, 08:59 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: ^This, if DJ feels like he's at home with the Bengals, he will want to finish this ride and get a ring.

Damn rights.

(05-04-2023, 09:18 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Dos amigos con Patron!

Hilarious, they love that Tequila, uno cervesa el bartendro!

(05-04-2023, 10:21 PM)NUGDUKWE Wrote: Reader has been a difference maker and a big part of the defense. I loved watching his highlights this past season and all the big plays he was involved with. I think resigning him should be high on the priority list for the Bengals and I'm not sure it will be.

We don't make it to the AFC Championship the last few years without DJ Reader. What would Burrow's career look like? Zac's....

Without winning those Playoff games? I am for extending DJ even over my man Logan Wilson if it has to be done and easily over Tee.

I know he is getting up there in age, but this man can come in and just shut down opposing team's run games when we need it the most.

[Housh]

Nose tackle has to be the most thankless position in football besides holder.

I don’t think the average casual fan really gets all that DJ does.


He stands guys up, pushes offensive lineman into run lanes making the RB change directions, good at the point of contact. When he grips you, you are going down.

He just does so much for Lou’s defense

[SunsetBengal]

(05-05-2023, 01:03 PM)Housh Wrote: Nose tackle has to be the most thankless position in football besides holder.

I don’t think the average casual fan really gets all that DJ does.


He stands guys up, pushes offensive lineman into run lanes making the RB change directions, good at the point of contact. When he grips you, you are going down.

He just does so much for Lou’s defense

Most of the time he commands two blockers' attention.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(05-05-2023, 01:03 PM)Housh Wrote: Nose tackle has to be the most thankless position in football besides holder.

I don’t think the average casual fan really gets all that DJ does.


He stands guys up, pushes offensive lineman into run lanes making the RB change directions, good at the point of contact. When he grips you, you are going down.

He just does so much for Lou’s defense

Yesirree Housh and we don't know how many Sacks and TFL he helps cause where he gets no credit. DJ had a ton of pressures last year 
too and was honestly surprised by the number. Need to keep this guy around over even Tee or Logan in my opinion and I love these guys.

(05-05-2023, 01:21 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Most of the time he commands two blockers' attention.

And he STILL wins more often than not.

[Housh]

(05-05-2023, 01:21 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Most of the time he commands two blockers' attention.

Even if he never recorded a tackle or a pressure that alone makes him vital. When you can count on a guy needing 2 blockers you can really play around with your blitzes