Breakdown: Why the Offense is Struggling

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(10-05-2023, 05:27 PM)casear2727 Wrote: Kyle pointing out the missed chips by the RBs resulting in sacks left me ill.  Such basic football miscues that should not happen at this level.  

That's what really stuck out to me. This is where we miss Perine, or a guy like Gio. Brown had it set up perfectly for a rib shot on the chip. No one chipped. Williams never even tried, and it looked Mixon just didn't take the right angle.

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(10-05-2023, 01:14 PM)bfine32 Wrote: It does appear they're trying. The last couple weeks I've seen a TE lined up at H-Back in a few sets. I can't remember doing that on a consistent basis since Ryan Hewit. 

Same, and the backs are missing assignments left and right. 

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(10-05-2023, 03:45 PM)Frank Booth Wrote: the offense relies on the passing game way too much. When their passing game is bad, and they still manage to win, it's usually the defense that bails them out. Rarely the run game.

People here didnt care about the run game because "we have Joe burrow" and all we need is 4ypc. 

well when Burrow is hurt, how you gonna win? You put the offense of Burrow's shoulders. There has never been a healthy balance with this team. And when I say balance, I dont mean equal rushing attempts to pass attempts. I mean having a run game that can be top 15 in YPC when called upon. But it's never been that way here under Joe Burrow. The run game has always been bad and inneficient 

It's honestly been bad and inefficient for over a decade, save for Jeremy Hill's one hit wonder. 

I saw a quote from Callahan that they called 12 run plays out of 25 at Tennessee. So, they did try to be more balanced, they just sucked.

[samhain]

(10-05-2023, 03:45 PM)Frank Booth Wrote: the offense relies on the passing game way too much. When their passing game is bad, and they still manage to win, it's usually the defense that bails them out. Rarely the run game.

People here didnt care about the run game because "we have Joe burrow" and all we need is 4ypc. 

well when Burrow is hurt, how you gonna win? You put the offense of Burrow's shoulders. There has never been a healthy balance with this team. And when I say balance, I dont mean equal rushing attempts to pass attempts. I mean having a run game that can be top 15 in YPC when called upon. But it's never been that way here under Joe Burrow. The run game has always been bad and inneficient 

That's the difference between being quarterback-friendly like Shanahan's system in SF and quarterback-driven like the Bengals.  They can plug whoever in and move the ball.  KC has an all-world qb, but the offense has been geared to make life easier on him since he was eased into it in year 2, and he always has a security blanket TE.  He's plenty capable of taking over a game on his own, but on bad days, the offense can survive if he doesn't.  Chad Henne ran it quite effectively when he had to last year.  

It's the same question for the entire Burrow-Taylor era.  What is our offensive system?  DO we even have one?  

I'm not bitching about it, because it's a priveledge to have a talent like 9.  It doesn't come along often.  They'v e done uncharacteristic things organizationally by letting Burrow have unprecedented input in how the offense is run.  That's all great until you don't have peak Burrow and no one but a top 3 qb in the league can survive in the system, or non-system.  

[*ochocincos*]

(10-06-2023, 10:15 AM)samhain Wrote: That's the difference between being quarterback-friendly like Shanahan's system in SF and quarterback-driven like the Bengals.  They can plug whoever in and move the ball.  KC has an all-world qb, but the offense has been geared to make life easier on him since he was eased into it in year 2, and he always has a security blanket TE.  He's plenty capable of taking over a game on his own, but on bad days, the offense can survive if he doesn't.  Chad Henne ran it quite effectively when he had to last year.  

It's the same question for the entire Burrow-Taylor era.  What is our offensive system?  DO we even have one?  

I'm not bitching about it, because it's a priveledge to have a talent like 9.  It doesn't come along often.  They'v e done uncharacteristic things organizationally by letting Burrow have unprecedented input in how the offense is run.  That's all great until you don't have peak Burrow and no one but a top 3 qb in the league can survive in the system, or non-system.  

Some may disagree, but here's my take.

The system is a passing offense that is dependent on big plays.
It is also entirely dependent on the QB who is running it, also dependent on having receivers like Chase and Higgins.

I see the Bengals offense very similar to the Bills offense.
You take Josh Allen out of that offense, he's limited, or having a bad day, and they'll really struggle.

[*bengalfan74*]

(10-06-2023, 11:52 AM)ochocincos Wrote: Some may disagree, but here's my take.

The system is a passing offense that is dependent on big plays.
It is also entirely dependent on the QB who is running it, also dependent on having receivers like Chase and Higgins.

I see the Bengals offense very similar to the Bills offense.
You take Josh Allen out of that offense, he's limited, or having a bad day, and they'll really struggle.

I agree mostly. It's a feast or famine situation. There's very little margin for error. It's either full go 100% cracking heads and taking names.

Or it's struggling mightily.

[jj22]

(10-05-2023, 03:04 PM)PhilHos Wrote: I didn't quote it, but you admit you're not a doctor but now you KNOW that there are MORE injuries that we don't know about. Ok. Sure.

He's human believe it or not. No player is 100% at the end of the year. You've seen as we all have the beating he's taking. I said nagging. You think he hasn't felt anything from the number of hits he's taken? 

[*PhilHos*]

(10-06-2023, 02:05 PM)jj22 Wrote: He's human believe it or not. No player is 100% at the end of the year. You've seen as we all have the beating he's taking. I said nagging. You think he hasn't felt anything from the number of hits he's taken? 

I wouldn't call typical aches and pains from playing a game "injuries". 

[jj22]

Also for the record since no one answered.

Luck struggled to come back from...... You guessed it. A left calf strain. He then called it quits. Your body does break down and the more of a beating it takes the harder it is to heal. Sure it's my opinion but it is fact based (which is what I meant when I said factual opinion) and really not some hot take. It's basic anatomy.

You've seen the end of great careers due to what you'd think was a minor issue all the time. Why? Because the injuries, the physical toll a sport takes all adds up.

[*PhilHos*]

(10-06-2023, 02:08 PM)jj22 Wrote: Also for the record since no one answered. Luck struggled to come back from...... You guessed it. A left calf strain. He then called it quits. Your body does break down and the more of a beating it takes the harder it is to heal. Sure it's my opinion but it is fact based (which is what I meant when I said factual opinion) and really not some hot take. It's basic anatomy. You've seen the end of great careers due to what you'd think was a minor issue all the time. Why? Because the injuries, the physical toll a sport takes all adds up.

Wrong, sort of. It started out as a calf injury, but it turned into an ankle injury:


https://www.nfl.com/news/colts-gm-andrew-luck-s-calf-injury-is-high-ankle-issue-0ap3000001041194

Also, the injury did not force Luck to retire. Luck retired because he was tired of the injuries; he was certainly capable of recovering from the injury and continuing his career.

You making it sound like that a calf injury forced Luck to retire is just flat out wrong. Are you eager to see Burrow retire or something?

[jj22]

Eager? It seems like I am the only one worried about all of his injuries adding up and ruining him. And cognizant of what it may look like when they do. Burrow isn't going to give up and retire like Luck, but his play will drop off and we will (should) know it is because everything has caught up to him. Rather that is now or in a couple years. No one thought he'd last long if he continued to take a beating/have surgeries/be injured every single year, and he has. So nothing I have said has been wrong or even outrageous. It's just been a hard pill to swallow for some.

But honestly. This was all from Sunday-Tuesday. And I'm typically and am over losses by mid week so I'm sure I'll see you in another thread, but as far as this one, I said what I said.

[*rfaulk34*]

(10-04-2023, 12:12 PM)Tomkat Wrote: Does this look like a QB who is pushing/driving off his back foot?

And it's not only the lack of push, he has his front foot closed as well. 

[*Nately120*]

(10-06-2023, 02:33 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: And it's not only the lack of push, he has his front foot closed as well. 

In his defense, he said he is 100% now, I don't think he said he was 100% there.  We can all watch him like a hawk Sunday, eh?

[*rfaulk34*]

(10-04-2023, 01:49 PM)PhilHos Wrote: IT'S NOT THE BEATINGS!!! IT'S THE CALF!!! 

Yes, there's a reason to beat the dead horse: it's you not understanding the Joe's issues stem from his calf. 

Correct.

(10-04-2023, 01:54 PM)jj22 Wrote: The issue is y’all using the calf as a crutch for all the woes we see with the team. It’s lazy. If anything the calf is proof Burrows body is breaking down and that is likely from the 4 years of beatings it’s taken. It should be alarming his body at 26 can’t heal in 6 weeks leading up to the season. And the reason is equally likely as it being the number of beatings he’s took. Ask luck. Anyone remember what his injury was when he retired the one his body just struggled to recover from? It wasn’t anything that should have ended his career. I just have a big picture view.

Incorrect.

[*rfaulk34*]

(10-06-2023, 02:36 PM)Nately120 Wrote: In his defense, he said he is 100% now, I don't think he said he was 100% there.  We can all watch him like a hawk Sunday, eh?

No. That comes the following week.

[*Nately120*]

(10-06-2023, 02:42 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: No. That comes the following week.

I said hawk, not Seahog.

[jj22]

(10-06-2023, 02:38 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: Incorrect.

Really. Cause the receipts are everywhere. I won’t bother quoting folks even you because. Well… Folks can read. The calf was blamed for the protection issues that film has now proven otherwise, the calf was blamed for the play calling as if we haven’t pointed out Zac’s play calling the last couple years as being below par, the calf was blamed for the missed reads that even Chase highlighted … I can go on and on.

[Tomkat]

(10-06-2023, 02:33 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: And it's not only the lack of push, he has his front foot closed as well. 

Oh wow, good catch, I never even noticed that!

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(10-06-2023, 02:36 PM)Nately120 Wrote: In his defense, he said he is 100% now, I don't think he said he was 100% there.  We can all watch him like a hawk Sunday, eh?

Yes sir. We will know if he is truly 100% Sunday. Hard to believe after that Titans game, but these calf strains are weird and it will be a 
few weeks since he tweaked it.

[*PhilHos*]

(10-06-2023, 02:22 PM)jj22 Wrote: Eager? It seems like I am the only one worried about all of his injuries adding up and ruining him. 

Because you are the only one that has rejected that the calf is the cause of Joe's issues this year. (Whilst simultaneously claiming "injuries" have ruined Joe)

(10-06-2023, 02:22 PM)jj22 Wrote: Burrow isn't going to give up and retire like Luck, but his play will drop off and we will (should) know it is because everything has caught up to him.

Luck's final season before his injuries supposedly caught up to him: 430 comp 53 att 67.3 comp% 4593 yards 39 TDs 15 INTs. Yeah, those injuries sure did ruin Andrew Luck.

(10-06-2023, 02:22 PM)jj22 Wrote: So nothing I have said has been wrong or even outrageous. It's just been a hard pill to swallow for some.

You literally said Joe Burrow is "ruined" and his window has closed.