Salary Cap Discussion

[Bengalholic]

After factoring in futures contracts as placeholders and accounting for tag/tenders (Higgins, Browning, Adomitis) the Bengals will have 51 players under contract...and adding an estimated 3.25m for draft picks, they will have an effective cap space number of about 34.4m. 

Let's say they re-sign the 9 players listed below 1 year deals (just as examples). These contracts replace the placeholders for a net cap hit of 15.15m...meaning they will still be at 51 contracts and have around 19.25m in remaining cap space.
   
RB- Trayveon Williams               1 yr- 1.225m
WR- Trenton Irwin                     1 yr- 1.2m
TE- Tanner Hudson                    1 yr- 1.35m
TE- Drew Sample                       1 yr- 1.275m
G- Max Scharping                      1 yr- 1.25m
DT- DJ Reader                           1 yr- 12m
LB- Akeem Davis-Gaither            1 yr- 2.125m 
LB- Joe Bachie                           1 yr- 1.2m
LB- Markus Bailey                       1 yr- 1.175m

*I used a low-end estimate for Reader just because of the uncertainty with the injury and the risk of signing him to more than one year right now. I feel like the high end would be something in the 13-14m range.

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

I think Markus Bailey is the only guy out of those 9 I would re-sign, and that's just for ST.

Also leaning less toward Tee being tagged. Not sure our FO would be able to work out a tag-and-trade, and $23m for 1 year of Tee coming off his 2023 just doesn't seem worth it.


- - - - -
EDIT: How did Tee (~$23m), Browning (<$1m), Adomitis (<$1m), and $3.25m for draft picks take us from $69.8m to $34.4m? Did you remove an extra $10m by accident?

[jj22]

Scharping I’d be willing to let walk. I’d like to see the rest signed for cap at least.

[Bengalholic]

(01-14-2024, 04:23 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: I think Markus Bailey is the only guy out of those 9 I would re-sign, and that's just for ST.

Also leaning less toward Tee being tagged. Not sure our FO would be able to work out a tag-and-trade, and $23m for 1 year of Tee coming off his 2023 just doesn't seem worth it.


- - - - -
EDIT: How did Tee (~$23m), Browning (<$1m), Adomitis (<$1m), and $3.25m for draft picks take us from $69.8m to $34.4m? Did you remove an extra $10m by accident?

The number I started with is 68.9 because it factors in Devin Cochran.

Higgins, Browning, Adomitis = 23.564
Futers contracts (placeholders to get 51) = 7.635
Draft picks = 3.25

Total = 34.5m
Cap space = 34.4

[casear2727]

(01-14-2024, 04:23 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: I think Markus Bailey is the only guy out of those 9 I would re-sign, and that's just for ST.

Also leaning less toward Tee being tagged. Not sure our FO would be able to work out a tag-and-trade, and $23m for 1 year of Tee coming off his 2023 just doesn't seem worth it.


- - - - -
EDIT: How did Tee (~$23m), Browning (<$1m), Adomitis (<$1m), and $3.25m for draft picks take us from $69.8m to $34.4m? Did you remove an extra $10m by accident?

I wouldnt mind signing all 3 linebackers for ST.  I also wouldnt be against drafting a LB to replace one of them either.  

[Whatever]

(01-14-2024, 04:23 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: I think Markus Bailey is the only guy out of those 9 I would re-sign, and that's just for ST.

Also leaning less toward Tee being tagged. Not sure our FO would be able to work out a tag-and-trade, and $23m for 1 year of Tee coming off his 2023 just doesn't seem worth it.


- - - - -
EDIT: How did Tee (~$23m), Browning (<$1m), Adomitis (<$1m), and $3.25m for draft picks take us from $69.8m to $34.4m? Did you remove an extra $10m by accident?

Between the weak TE market and draft class, I wouldn't mind seeing Sample retained as a blocking TE.  Irwin is an RFA, so he makes sense to tender for cheap depth.

No way I'm paying Reader $12 mil on a one year deal when he's pretty much guaranteed to miss a good chunk of the season.

The Higgins FT is crippling and makes zero sense unless you're going to trade him.  It's a good FA class and top heavy WR class, so you have a good chance to replace him this year.  Why punt on it for another year?  Plus, with it being a one year deal, you can't free up extra cap space for this year with structure.  

[Soonerpeace]

(01-14-2024, 04:03 PM)Bengalholic Wrote: After factoring in futures contracts as placeholders and accounting for tag/tenders (Higgins, Browning, Adomitis) the Bengals will have 51 players under contract...and adding an estimated 3.25m for draft picks, they will have an effective cap space number of about 34.4m. 

Let's say they re-sign the 9 players listed below 1 year deals (just as examples). These contracts replace the placeholders for a net cap hit of 15.15m...meaning they will still be at 51 contracts and have around 19.25m in remaining cap space.
   
RB- Trayveon Williams               1 yr- 1.225m
WR- Trenton Irwin                     1 yr- 1.2m
TE- Tanner Hudson                    1 yr- 1.35m
TE- Drew Sample                       1 yr- 1.275m
G- Max Scharping                      1 yr- 1.25m
DT- DJ Reader                           1 yr- 12m
LB- Akeem Davis-Gaither            1 yr- 2.125m 
LB- Joe Bachie                           1 yr- 1.2m
LB- Markus Bailey                       1 yr- 1.175m

*I used a low-end estimate for Reader just because of the uncertainty with the injury and the risk of signing him to more than one year right now. I feel like the high end would be something in the 13-14m range.

I think Awouzie is brought back

[007BengalsFan]

Im a big fan of Reader when he is healthy. The problem is he is often injured and will be 30 next year. I dont think we can give him a large contract with this in mind but we should bring him back if affordable. 12 million still sounds like a lot to me. Right now the only good DT we have signed is Hill and he is on the last year of his contract. We need to address Reader's replacement plus we need to think about drafting Hill's replacement since he is gone after the 2024 season. We cant go into next season with two starting defensive tackles on the last year of their contract and have no quality DT's for 2025

[Soonerpeace]

(01-14-2024, 05:34 PM)007BengalsFan Wrote: Im a big fan of Reader when he is healthy. The problem is he is often injured and will be 30 next year. I dont think we can give him a large contract with this in mind but we should bring him back if affordable. 12 million still sounds like a lot to me. Right now the only good DT we have signed is Hill and he is on the last year of his contract. We need to address Reader's replacement plus we need to think about drafting Hill's replacement since he is gone after the 2024 season. We cant go into next season with two starting defensive tackles on the last year of their contract and have no quality DT's for 2025

I think you give Reader a choice. 1 year 10 million or 2 years 15. Lots if DT play well until 32. The guy is a disrupter

[WeezyBengal]

(01-14-2024, 05:39 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: I think you give Reader a choice. 1 year 10 million or 2 years 15. Lots if DT play well until 32. The guy is a disrupter

Guy has had two serious injuries on two different legs and will most likely miss at least 1/2 of next year. 

Take bias out of it. No chance in hell we'd ever look at a random player on the open market in Readers situation and want to sign him. 

[kevin]

(01-14-2024, 04:03 PM)Bengalholic Wrote: After factoring in futures contracts as placeholders and accounting for tag/tenders (Higgins, Browning, Adomitis) the Bengals will have 51 players under contract...and adding an estimated 3.25m for draft picks, they will have an effective cap space number of about 34.4m. 

Let's say they re-sign the 9 players listed below 1 year deals (just as examples). These contracts replace the placeholders for a net cap hit of 15.15m...meaning they will still be at 51 contracts and have around 19.25m in remaining cap space.
   
RB- Trayveon Williams               1 yr- 1.225m
WR- Trenton Irwin                     1 yr- 1.2m
TE- Tanner Hudson                    1 yr- 1.35m
TE- Drew Sample                       1 yr- 1.275m
G- Max Scharping                      1 yr- 1.25m
DT- DJ Reader                           1 yr- 12m
LB- Akeem Davis-Gaither            1 yr- 2.125m 
LB- Joe Bachie                           1 yr- 1.2m
LB- Markus Bailey                       1 yr- 1.175m

*I used a low-end estimate for Reader just because of the uncertainty with the injury and the risk of signing him to more than one year right now. I feel like the high end would be  something in the 13-14m range.

*I have Hudson not being tendered and re-signed on a cheaper deal in this example, but if they tender him, it would be 2.8m.

The 12 million jumps out here on Reader.  

The BIG off season move will be re-signing Chase before opening day in September.  Bengals want both Burrow and Chase locked in. 

We probably lose Boyd in March who is making over 10 mil.  Higgins would want a huge contract and some team will sign him day one of free agency in March So we lose Higgins and Boyd but resign Chase before September to avoid Chase a free agent.  

So the Salary Cap is going to change greatly on big money players leaving in March, but Chase later signed to a huge contract before September. 

Reader at 13 million-gone
Boyd at 11 million- gone
Awuzie at 7 million-gone

That is 31 million right there.  

Jonah Williams at 4 million- gone 

That is 35 million

Higgins at 2 million will get signed by another team day one of free agency at huge money-so gone. 

That is 37 million

Irv Smith at 2 million never panned out-gone

That is 39 million. 

McCarron at 1 million probably gone

That is 40 million. 

However Chase will want a big salary and Bengals will pay it.  Then, How much more does Browning want, or does Browning see if an NFL team goes after him in March.  Browning is better than what some teams have. 

Chase is going to take close to half of that 40 million, which will leave 20 million more or less. 

The majority of the team will be back.  

Could ex Bengals like a Hurst or Perrine return at less money than they wanted in 2023 ?  

If Bengals wanted Higgins, Boyd, Reader. Awuzie, Jonah, Irv Smith they would be locked in, not free agents.  However I think if a good WR or TE is on The Board when Bengals draft in Round One, Hey, Bengals did well drafting Boyd, Higgins and Chase and may have to reload in The Draft to get Burrow more top targets.  Instead of paying Boyd and Higgins star veteran prices, Bengals could keep paying just out of college wages and just maybe get top talent as Boyd and Higgins picks were..  

The goal is still Super Bowl.  Bengals will lose some Fan Favorites in March, and Bengals will lose their deep stable of WR's.  Still, I think Brown Family and Tobin and Taylor have a Reload Plan of Attack.  Burrow back in 2024 with many weapons and a Super Bowl type team.  I am sure Bengals want Burrow to Chase and Burrow resigned last off season, and Chase to be resigned this off season.

Also The NFL Salary Cap WILL have to go UP due to all the huge pay increases to QBs all over NFL. So look for a much higher Salary Cap based on all the higher NFL player contracts. So the Cap will probably go Way Up early in Off Season for a New, Higher 2024 Salary Cap per team.

GO BENGALS THIS OFF SEASON and SUPER BOWL Season in 2024.  2021 Super Bowl Season, 2022 Bengals missed Super Bowl by a late Chiefs field goal, 2023 Bengals had winning record and 2024 Bengals with Burrow to Chase back to Super Bowl. JUST WN, BABY. WHO DEY

[casear2727]

(01-14-2024, 06:11 PM)kevin Wrote: The 12 million jumps out here on Reader.  

The BIG off season move will be re-signing Chase before opening day in September.  Bengals want both Burrow and Chase locked in. 

We probably lose Boyd in March who is making over 10 mil.  Higgins would want a huge contract and some team will sign him day one of free agency in March So we lose Higgins and Boyd but resign Chase before September to avoid Chase a free agent.  

So the Salary Cap is going to change greatly on big money players leaving in March, but Chase later signed to a huge contract before September. 

Reader at 13 million-gone
Boyd at 11 million- gone
Awuzie at 7 million-gone

That is 31 million right there.  

Jonah Williams at 4 million- gone 

That is 35 million

Higgins at 2 million will get signed by another team day one of free agency at huge money-so gone. 

That is 37 million

Irv Smith at 2 million never panned out-gone

That is 39 million. 

McCarron at 1 million probably gone

That is 40 million. 

However Chase will want a big salary and Bengals will pay it.  Then, How much more does Browning want, or does Browning see if an NFL team goes after him in March.  Browning is better than what some teams have. 

Chase is going to take close to half of that 40 million, which will leave 20 million more or less. 

The majority of the team will be back.  

Could ex Bengals like a Hurst or Perrine return at less money than they wanted in 2023 ?  

If Bengals wanted Higgins, Boyd, Reader. Awuzie, Jonah, Irv Smith they would be locked in, not free agents.  However I think if a good WR or TE is on The Board when Bengals draft in Round One, Hey, Bengals did well drafting Boyd, Higgins and Chase and ma have to reload in The Draft to get Burrow more top targets.  Instead of paying Boyd and Higgins star veteran prices, Bengals could keep paying just out of college wages and just maybe get top talent as Boyd and Higgins picks were..  

The goal is still Super Bowl.  Bengals will lose some Fan Favorites in March, and Bengals will lose their deep stable of WR's.  Still, I think Brown Family and Tobin and Taylor have a Reload Plan of Attack.  Burrow back in 2024 with many weapons and a Super Bowl type team. 

GO BENGALS THIS OFF SEASON and SUPER BOWL Season in 2024. 

Chase will not be a free agent until 2026.

Browning will receive the vet minimum, he has no other option.

Tee can be franchise tagged.

The salary cap is NOT going to change due to the loss of free agents.  It is already calculated with these departures.

[Soonerpeace]

(01-14-2024, 05:34 PM)007BengalsFan Wrote: Im a big fan of Reader when he is healthy. The problem is he is often injured and will be 30 next year. I dont think we can give him a large contract with this in mind but we should bring him back if affordable. 12 million still sounds like a lot to me. Right now the only good DT we have signed is Hill and he is on the last year of his contract. We need to address Reader's replacement plus we need to think about drafting Hill's replacement since he is gone after the 2024 season. We cant go into next season with two starting defensive tackles on the last year of their contract and have no quality DT's for 2025

I think you give Reader a choice. 1 year 10 million or 2 years 15. Lots if DT play well until 32. The guy is a disrupter

[casear2727]

If we lose Boyd and Higgins I can definitely see them keeping Irwin.  Regardless of who we lose, Irwin could be a Burrow decision at such a low number.  IMHO

[casear2727]

(01-14-2024, 06:18 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: I think you give Reader a choice. 1 year 10 million or 2 years 15. Lots if DT play well until 32. The guy is a disrupter

That would be a real discount, maybe too low for DJ...?

[Soonerpeace]

(01-14-2024, 05:48 PM)WeezyBengal Wrote: Guy has had two serious injuries on two different legs and will most likely miss at least 1/2 of next year. 

Take bias out of it. No chance in hell we'd ever look at a random player on the open market in Readers situation and want to sign him. 

You know that timeline? Certainly my scenario is if he returns game 1. I don’t count him out.

[Soonerpeace]

(01-14-2024, 06:20 PM)casear2727 Wrote: That would be a real discount, maybe to low for DJ...?

Not for 2 years

[*michaelsean*]

(01-14-2024, 06:11 PM)kevin Wrote: The 12 million jumps out here on Reader.  

The BIG off season move will be re-signing Chase before opening day in September.  Bengals want both Burrow and Chase locked in. 

We probably lose Boyd in March who is making over 10 mil.  Higgins would want a huge contract and some team will sign him day one of free agency in March So we lose Higgins and Boyd but resign Chase before September to avoid Chase a free agent.  

So the Salary Cap is going to change greatly on big money players leaving in March, but Chase later signed to a huge contract before September. 

Reader at 13 million-gone
Boyd at 11 million- gone
Awuzie at 7 million-gone

That is 31 million right there.  

Jonah Williams at 4 million- gone 

That is 35 million

Higgins at 2 million will get signed by another team day one of free agency at huge money-so gone. 

That is 37 million

Irv Smith at 2 million never panned out-gone

That is 39 million. 

McCarron at 1 million probably gone

That is 40 million. 

However Chase will want a big salary and Bengals will pay it.  Then, How much more does Browning want, or does Browning see if an NFL team goes after him in March.  Browning is better than what some teams have. 

Chase is going to take close to half of that 40 million, which will leave 20 million more or less. 

The majority of the team will be back.  

Could ex Bengals like a Hurst or Perrine return at less money than they wanted in 2023 ?  

If Bengals wanted Higgins, Boyd, Reader. Awuzie, Jonah, Irv Smith they would be locked in, not free agents.  However I think if a good WR or TE is on The Board when Bengals draft in Round One, Hey, Bengals did well drafting Boyd, Higgins and Chase and may have to reload in The Draft to get Burrow more top targets.  Instead of paying Boyd and Higgins star veteran prices, Bengals could keep paying just out of college wages and just maybe get top talent as Boyd and Higgins picks were..  

The goal is still Super Bowl.  Bengals will lose some Fan Favorites in March, and Bengals will lose their deep stable of WR's.  Still, I think Brown Family and Tobin and Taylor have a Reload Plan of Attack.  Burrow back in 2024 with many weapons and a Super Bowl type team.  I am sure Bengals want Burrow to Chase and Burrow resigned last off season, and Chase to be resigned this off season.

Also The NFL Salary Cap WILL have to go UP due to all the huge pay increases to QBs all over NFL. So look for a much higher Salary Cap based on all the higher NFL player contracts. So the Cap will probably go Way Up early in Off Season for a New, Higher 2024 Salary Cap per team.

GO BENGALS THIS OFF SEASON and SUPER BOWL Season in 2024.  2021 Super Bowl Season, 2022 Bengals missed Super Bowl by a late Chiefs field goal, 2023 Bengals had winning record and 2024 Bengals with Burrow to Chase back to Super Bowl. JUST WN, BABY. WHO DEY

I thought Jonah was at like $12 million. And isn’t the salary cap a percentage of revenue?

[casear2727]

(01-14-2024, 06:27 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: Not for 2 years

If you are suggesting 2 years 15M as in 7.5M per year, that could be seen as disrespectful to DJ.

If you are suggesting 2 years at 15M per, that would seem kind of high for 2024.

[Soonerpeace]

(01-14-2024, 06:51 PM)casear2727 Wrote: If you are suggesting 2 years 15M as in 7.5M per year, that could be seen as disrespectful to DJ.

If you are suggesting 2 years at 15M per, that would seem kind of high for 2024.

2 years @ 7.5 million is better than 1 year 10 million. If he can get a long term contract for much better let him go. He can’t be what he was do you think? Big gamble for Cincy not knowing his health so I don’t think it’s disrespectful