Bengals Win Out + Broncos & Colts go 2-3, Dolphins go 3-2 & WE'RE IN!!!

[*bfine32*]

(12-26-2024, 11:50 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: 14 missed tackles and fumbles on offense and ST. He didn’t have a single facet of the team ready to go. But yeah Ja’Marr Chase.

Do you really think I expected Ja'Marr's ride or die to look at it objectively?

I feel with a 100% Ja"marr we get enough offense to win. You don't, it's OK I'll fall in line. I could point to how disciplined he had the team with lack of penalties and place execution on players, but why bother. 

Cause Zac, 

[*bfine32*]

(12-25-2024, 09:54 PM)Frank Booth Wrote: good point

I made the mistake of questioning could we have won the game(s) played in the first 2 weeks of the 24-25 season if Ja"marr Chase had been a full participant in Preseason to include the week we installed the gameplan against NE.

[Bengalbug]

If anyone is on the fence on dolphins or colts losing a game against a bad game, I guess you’re not watching TNF. A playoff team needing a must win, is really struggling against a 4 win team. Not saying the bears will win, but it’s not crazy to think that mediocre teams can lose to a bad team. I’d consider dolphins, colts and broncos (against chiefs backups) all mediocre. You could throw bengals into that conversation as well, but the biggest difference is you have a (should be) MVP candidate, a OPTY candidate and a pretty good pass rusher.

[Nicomo Cosca]

(Yesterday, 12:04 AM)bfine32 Wrote: Do you really think I expected Ja'Marr's ride or die to look at it objectively?

I feel with a 100% Ja"marr we get enough offense to win. You don't, it's OK I'll fall in line. I could point to how disciplined he had the team with lack of penalties and place execution on players, but why bother. 

Cause Zac, 

Week 1 Justin Jefferson had 4 catches for 59 yards against a terrible NYG team. Vikes ofc still won 28-6.

Week 1 Amon-Ra St. Brown had 3 catches for 13 yards against the Rams. His team also got the W.

I wonder if Kevin O'Connell (who’s 13-2 with Sam Darnold as his QB) or Dan Campbell could have possibly overcome such a huge challenge like having their superstar WR not participate in TC.

And yeah, penalties weren’t a factor at all in either of the first couple games…

[Brownshoe]

(12-26-2024, 11:46 PM)bfine32 Wrote: You know what, you're right.

Zac should have tried harder to get Chase ready to start the season 

I've clearly stated JC is the best WR in the NFL, but thanks for verifying it. Not sure what that has to do with what I posed. 

Maybe it's not just Chase that needed to be ready. The whole team has been unprepared every season. That is a coaching issue. It's not just because a WR had a mediocre game. Even the best WRs have mediocre games. Teams don't CONSTANTLY have piss poor performances unless there's a issue with something like coaching. The whole team looked like garbage. Why did Joe Burrow have a bad game? Why did Chase Brown have a bad game? Why did Mike Gesicki have a bad game? Why did basically the whole team have a bad game? IDK must be Ja'Marr sitting out preseason, obviously.

[Nicomo Cosca]

(Yesterday, 01:35 AM)Brownshoe Wrote: Maybe it's not just Chase that needed to be ready. The whole team has been unprepared every season. That is a coaching issue. It's not just because a WR had a mediocre game. Even the best WRs have mediocre games. Teams don't CONSTANTLY have piss poor performances unless there's an issue with something like coaching. The whole team looked like garbage. Why did Joe Burrow have a bad game? Why did Chase Brown have a bad game? Why did Mike Gesicki have a bad game? Why did basically the whole team have a bad game? IDK must be Ja'Marr sitting out preseason, obviously.

I guess starting Moss over him wasn’t on the coaches either.

[*bfine32*]

I get it. I think Ja"Marr at a 100% could influence a game others do not.

[phil413]

I'm in the whatever happens camp but the inevitable is likely. We will be watching the KC subs lose by 10 to Denver and eliminate us. Sink or swim I hope they keep the 3 known stars (4 with Brown) at skill spots. Get a new DQ with a few high picks and a few average FA and hope for a better start next year.

[GodFather]

Even if we win the next two games and Miami and Indy loses one there's no way the Chiefs will beat the Broncos (already having had secured the one seed) with the chance of seeing us in the post season. They fear Joey B, and would much rather see a Broncos team if need be in the post season.

[Bengalbug]

(Yesterday, 08:00 AM)GodFather Wrote: Even if we win the next two games and Miami and Indy loses one there's no way the Chiefs will beat the Broncos (already having had secured the one seed) with the chance of seeing us in the post season. They fear Joey B, and would much rather see a Broncos team if need be in the post season.

The Chiefs won’t go out there and say “we better lose”. I actually doubt the chiefs consider the bengals in this at all. The chiefs will rest some starters for the betterment of their team. Carson Wentz will play QB and Andy Reid will call plays to try to get the win. The chiefs are 2-2 in final week games in which their seed is locked up and they rest starters.

[Bengalbug]

(Yesterday, 02:59 AM)phil413 Wrote: I'm in the whatever happens camp but the inevitable is likely. We will be watching the KC subs lose by 10 to Denver and eliminate us. Sink or swim I hope they keep the 3 known stars (4 with Brown) at skill spots. Get a new DQ with a few high picks and a few average FA and hope for a better start next year.

Chiefs are 2-2 under any Reid when resting players due to playoffs position being locked up.

[Isaac Curtis: The Real #85]

(Yesterday, 12:28 AM)Bengalbug Wrote: If anyone is on the fence on dolphins or colts losing a game against a bad game, I guess you’re not watching TNF.  A playoff team needing a must win, is really struggling against a 4 win team.  Not saying the bears will win, but it’s not crazy to think that mediocre teams can lose to a bad team.  I’d consider dolphins, colts and broncos (against chiefs backups) all mediocre.  You could throw bengals into that conversation as well, but the biggest difference is you have a (should be) MVP candidate, a OPTY candidate and a pretty good pass rusher.

You are not wrong. There is no point in giving up the ghost. It does us no good. 

We have the last two games against, in my view, non-contender teams who have winning records, one of whom has clinched a PO spot. 

It will be a good measuring stick for where we are.


We have been pretty banged up for some time. Missing starters at RB, RT, DT, DE, LB, CB, PK, and contributors at TE and CB: Moss, Trent Brown, Rankins, Hubbard, L. Wilson, D. Hill, McPherson, All, and Turner). That's 28% of our starters (7/25) and had 2 more benched (Volson, Bell). And another who had been benched (CTB) regain his starting job. 9/22 opening day starters on O/D are not playing. 

We thought some guys were gonna be starter quality, and paid them accordingly, and they just have not been. In fact, our list of "quality starters" is pretty thin heading into next year: Burrow, Chase, Chase Brown, and Hendrickson is about it. Higgins, BJ Hill, and Hilton are FA's. Orlando Brown, Mims, Karras, Logan Wilson, Pratt, CTB, Dax Hill, Stone, Battle, Rehkow, and Adomitis all range from just slightly above mediocre to barely adequate. 

Anyway, my point is we should find out a lot about who should go and who should stay in the remaining two games. But the coaches & FO have not shown an ability to discren the diffetence lately (Rankins, Bell, Moss, Volson, Stone, etc.)

But there are fantastic building blocks. Burrow & Chase may win triple crowns: yards, tds, rec/comp. Hendrickson is leading in sacks. Chase Brown has been fantastic despite a mediocre line. Mims, Jenkins, and Jackson are all showing some legit potential after being thrust in to bigger roles sooner than we wanted due to injury, or being injured themselves in camp. 

Despite all this, we've been a whisker away from beating the Chiefs, Ravens (twice), Chargers, and Commanders. And hung with Philly for a half, Pitt too. 

My long winded point is, despite all that has gone wrong, we are still alive. And if we win tomorrow, we still will be in Week 18. You give up after you're dead, not before. And even if we fail, it is a useful evaluation. This shouldn't be some long rebuild, we need to fix this while Burrow, Chase, and Trey are still here. 

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

(Yesterday, 01:28 AM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Week 1 Justin Jefferson had 4 catches for 59 yards against a terrible NYG team. Vikes ofc still won 28-6.

Week 1 Amon-Ra St. Brown had 3 catches for 13 yards against the Rams. His team also got the W.

I wonder if Kevin O'Connell (who’s 13-2 with Sam Darnold as his QB) or Dan Campbell could have possibly overcome such a huge challenge like having their superstar WR not participate in TC.

And yeah, penalties weren’t a factor at all in either of the first couple games…

That looks suspiciously like a lot of stats in a conversation where stats are apparently not allowed, or conversation is allowed either as the conclusion has seemingly already been made and it's just a matter of drawing it out until you and everyone else agree to it.

[Destro]

(Yesterday, 01:49 AM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: I guess starting Moss over him wasn’t on the coaches either.

Heard some using the loss of Moss being one of the many injuries of why the team has done so poorly. 

[M.W.]

(12-26-2024, 10:52 PM)Isaac Curtis: The Real #85 Wrote: He does not give the starting units enough reps during preseason. This is obvious as hell. 

As a result, we come out out of synch on offense and soft on D. 1-11 is 1-11. ZT is so afraid of someone getting hurt in PS that we lose the first two games every year..

Most certainly obvious and makes me wonder .. ... ... . Why? It does not work.

[Nicomo Cosca]

(Yesterday, 03:20 PM)Destro Wrote: Heard some using the loss of Moss being one of the many injuries of why the team has done so poorly. 

Yeah we really miss that 3.3 YPC.

[Isaac Curtis: The Real #85]

(Yesterday, 08:33 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Yeah we really miss that 3.3 YPC.

Giving Chase Brown a blow every once in a while would be nice. Moss was certainly giving us more than Herbert. I don't recall many plays where he obviously got less than was thete or missed a block or dropped a pass. He was OK, despite the poor YPC.

[Nicomo Cosca]

(Yesterday, 08:38 PM)Isaac Curtis: The Real #85 Wrote: Giving Chase Brown a blow every once in a while would be nice. Moss was certainly giving us more than Herbert. I don't recall many plays where he obviously got less than was thete or missed a block or dropped a pass. He was OK, despite the poor YPC.

His rushing success rate was 36.5%. He was bad.

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

(Yesterday, 09:06 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: His rushing success rate was 36.5%. He was bad.

I agree with your point, but I will say the whole "success rates" have never really made me buy into them. 

I think the rules have changed enough that I don't think 4 yards on 1st down is as much of a "success" as it once was. Three decades ago the average QB Completion% was 58.0%... now it's 65.2% and there's multiple guys >67% who aren't even top-10. The average QB Rating then was 78.4 and now it's 91.7.

There's so many quick high % passes now without so many man CBs jamming at the LoS and instead playing well off that I don't know if trading 4 yards for a down on 1st and 10 is all that successful anymore.

- - - - -

Made even weirder by WRs "success %" being the exact same as RBs, so if they get 2 catches for 4 yards each on 1st and 2nd down, that's two successes... but you just threw it twice and got 8 yards.

[Nicomo Cosca]

(Yesterday, 09:22 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: I agree with your point, but I will say the whole "success rates" have never really made me buy into them. 

I think the rules have changed enough that I don't think 4 yards on 1st down is as much of a "success" as it once was. Three decades ago the average QB Completion% was 58.0%... now it's 65.2% and there's multiple guys >67% who aren't even top-10. The average QB Rating then was 78.4 and now it's 91.7.

There's so many quick high % passes now without so many man CBs jamming at the LoS and instead playing well off that I don't know if trading 4 yards for a down on 1st and 10 is all that successful anymore.

- - - - -

Made even weirder by WRs "success %" being the exact same as RBs, so if they get 2 catches for 4 yards each on 1st and 2nd down, that's two successes... but you just threw it twice and got 8 yards.

It’s still useful when comparing a player to his own peers. Chase Brown is currently at 52.2% for example. Zach Moss was MUCH worse in the same offense.