Rapien - Bengals Must Tag Tee Higgins

[SunsetBengal]

(02-15-2025, 08:43 PM)Bengalbug Wrote: The good QB thing is overstated.  Andre Johnson, megatron, Larry fitz… go look at their stats.  It’s not always the best WB leads to production.  

What about Darius Slayton makes you think he can be a 1,000 yard guy? (It might have been the other guy who said burrow will get him 200+ more).

What are you even trying to say there?

Slayton has proven to be a reliable WR2 in the NFL, having the benefit of Joe Burrow throwing his passes can only elevate him.

[J24]

(02-15-2025, 08:18 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Damn, no need to get all emotional about it. Don't be afraid of change, the Bengals offense needs to change directions anyway. Currently they are so pass heavy that the running game has no chance to establish itself.

Some of you Mary's that are hung up on the idea that the Bengals will be sunk without Tee Higgins in the lineup are just delusional. Teams lose good players every year, the good ones proceed onward without them.

Again you are not replacing a good player in Tee. Instead you are  replacing a great player in Tee. This whole notion that  some average Wr can replace Tee is substantially stupid. 

[SunsetBengal]

(02-15-2025, 09:05 PM)J24 Wrote: Again you are not replacing a good player in Tee. Instead you are  replacing a great player in Tee. This whole notion that  some average Wr can replace Tee is substantially stupid. 

Well, you better get used to the idea, because that it is what's most likely to happen.

[NUGDUKWE]

(02-15-2025, 08:18 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Damn, no need to get all emotional about it. Don't be afraid of change, the Bengals offense needs to change directions anyway. Currently they are so pass heavy that the running game has no chance to establish itself.

Some of you Mary's that are hung up on the idea that the Bengals will be sunk without Tee Higgins in the lineup are just delusional. Teams lose good players every year, the good ones proceed onward without them.

We won't be sunk on offense but we will be worse on paper. I do think it's a bit delusional to think a Zac Taylor led offense won't be pass happy. Tee or no Tee Zac is still gonna treat the run game to just complement the pass. 

[NUGDUKWE]

(02-15-2025, 09:15 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Well, you better get used to the idea, because that it is what's most likely to happen.

It may be the most likely thing to happen but nothing wrong with hoping they break theyre norm. The Bengals have they're set positions that they want to put money into and while WR is one of them it's not traditionally 2 WR. But they don't want to pay a safety top money or guard or an aging LT that is still playing well..etc. But you have to pay the talent you have whether it fits your idea of how a team should be constructed. 

[SunsetBengal]

(02-15-2025, 09:32 PM)NUGDUKWE Wrote: We won't be sunk on offense but we will be worse on paper. I do think it's a bit delusional to think a Zac Taylor led offense won't be pass happy. Tee or no Tee Zac is still gonna treat the run game to just complement the pass. 

Smart coaches always adjust their game plan to the players that they have on the team. I'm not so naieve to think that Zac isn't smart enough to adjust his game plan to the players that he has before him.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(02-15-2025, 05:45 PM)wanga Wrote: Where’s the Slayton talk coming from? Fan wishes or legit FA whispers?

Have heard Slayton might be a good trade option for Tee and an End of the Giants or something for us is all.

He isn't a FA, so it isn't that. But he is younger than a lot of the WR options in FA and hasn't played with a great QB like Joe.

(02-15-2025, 06:19 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Yeah, I am a bit curious about that too. Whole lot of folks mentioning just him.

Personally I am on team Josh Palmer plus bringing Boyd back for a year. Both combined are projected to be ~$8m meaning even if you trade for a Noah Fant ($9m) or Kyle Pitts ($10m) at TE (or sign Mark Andrews if he gets cut) you're still at $17-18m, which is a good $8-9m shy of a Tee tag and that savings can be spent on OL and DL, but still gives you two solid WRs and a TE that add needed depth to the supporting cast behind Chase. We have our quality in Chase, now we need some (NFL starting caliber) quantity supporting him. Since you already have an elite guy, with Burrow throwing the ball 3 good guys plus money for trench upgrades is better than 1 really good guy and 2 scrubs.

Some good ideas as always TLL. Those are some good cheap WR options and Boyd still knows how to get open. Josh Palmer is a big body WR.

Would love to see what Pitts could do with Burrow and Fant can block a bit unlike Gesicki and Pitts. No to Andrews, he looks washed to me and a 
choker in the biggest games.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(02-15-2025, 09:46 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Smart coaches always adjust their game plan to the players that they have on the team. I'm not so naieve to think that Zac isn't smart enough to adjust his game plan to the players that he has before him.

I think if the run game is really good Zac will use it more...

I don't think he is stupid unlike some fans do.

[SunsetBengal]

(02-15-2025, 09:50 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: I think if the run game is really good Zac will use it more...

I don't think he is stupid unlike some fans do.

I used to think that way, until I heard an interview with Brian Callahan after he was hired as coach of the Titans. When asked about the direction his teams offense would take he responded with something like "You know me, I want to run the ball and establish that before anything else".  And at that very moment I reflected back over his time with the Bengals and wondered "Why didn't they run more under Callahan's offense"? The only answer can be Zac over ruled calls.

[NUGDUKWE]

(02-15-2025, 09:46 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Smart coaches always adjust their game plan to the players that they have on the team. I'm not so naieve to think that Zac isn't smart enough to adjust his game plan to the players that he has before him.

Wait is this the same Zac Taylor that started off his tenure with a top 5 runningback but still had Dalton throwing it 40+ times and letting the running game be the worst in the league for the 1st half of the season. To his credit he did have mixon start running the 2nd half of the season. But the same Zac Taylor that has asked Burrow to throw it far more than us run whether he's a rookie or coming back from knee surgery or an appendectomy or being severely limited due to a calf injury? I'm sorry but anyone that thinks we are going to start running it more after the season Burrow just had are kidding themselves. We have enough of a sample size to know what Taylor does.

[SunsetBengal]

(02-15-2025, 10:09 PM)NUGDUKWE Wrote: Wait is this the same Zac Taylor that started off his tenure with a top 5 runningback but still had Dalton throwing it 40+ times and letting the running game be the worst in the league for the 1st half of the season. To his credit he did have mixon start running the 2nd half of the season. But the same Zac Taylor that has asked Burrow to throw it far more than us run whether he's a rookie or coming back from knee surgery or an appendectomy or being severely limited due to a calf injury? I'm sorry but anyone that thinks we are going to start running it more after the season Burrow just had are kidding themselves. We have enough of a sample size to know what Taylor does.

Have you ever given any thought as to why Zac didn't utilize a "top 5" RB to his fullest abilities? I'm just guessing here, but it could be because the OL couldn't drive people off of the ball. As the years have passed, much change has happened on that OL, yet they still seem incapable of moving opponents off the ball. Hey, we got a new OL coach. Hopefully he can preach the gospel of running the ball to Zac Taylor?

[pulses]

(02-15-2025, 09:50 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: I think if the run game is really good Zac will use it more...

I don't think he is stupid unlike some fans do.

Fix that OL and we'll run more than some might think.

[Nicomo Cosca]

(02-15-2025, 10:27 PM)pulses Wrote: Fix that OL and we'll run more than some might think.

They’ve been trying to “fix the OL” for a decade. But I’m sure this will be the year!

[pulses]

(02-15-2025, 10:38 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: They’ve been trying to “fix the OL” for a decade. But I’m sure this will be the year!

So nice of your positive feedback and contribution to the conversation

[*ochocincos*]

(02-15-2025, 06:56 PM)Bengalbug Wrote: Half the price, 1/4 the player.  This is how you end up letting allpro/probowl type guys leave and fill them with average dudes getting paid a premium.

Slayton has averaged 720 yards a season in his 6-year career with horrendous QBs.
He has 66 starts across 92 games played.

Slayton has been playing on just a $6 mill per year contract.
If anything, he'll be closer to 1/4th the price, but ~70% the receiver.

In reality, Slayton could be a 800-900 yard WR in Cincy.
Not Higgins's caliber, but Higgins is arguably the top WR, maybe top guy overall in FA.

I think in reality, we all want to have Higgins back.
But he's going to be pricy.
And they have traditionally been bad drafting OL and DL, having more success in FA.

So would you rather have Slayton plus an upgrade at OL or DL added in FA, or just Higgins?

Personally, I'm cool either way. I won't be one of the ones upset if Higgins departs.

[NUGDUKWE]

(02-15-2025, 10:18 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Have you ever given any thought as to why Zac didn't utilize a "top 5" RB to his fullest abilities? I'm just guessing here, but it could be because the OL couldn't drive people off of the ball. As the years have passed, much change has happened on that OL, yet they still seem incapable of moving opponents off the ball. Hey, we got a new OL coach. Hopefully he can preach the gospel of running the ball to Zac Taylor?

Well i was referring to when he got here. Mixon was top 5 in 2018. First half of the season we were the worst running team 2nd half mixon was the #2 back in the league. So same line. But there is just too much evidence Taylor isn't going to switch up his offense now he's just not. 

[*bfine32*]

(02-15-2025, 10:02 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: I used to think that way, until I heard an interview with Brian Callahan after he was hired as coach of the Titans. When asked about the direction his teams offense would take he responded with something like "You know me, I want to run the ball and establish that before anything else".  And at that very moment I reflected back over his time with the Bengals and wondered "Why didn't they run more under Callahan's offense"? The only answer can be Zac over ruled calls.

Or it could be that he came from a Team with Joe Burrow as QB to a Team that has Will Levis as QB.

IDC what my philosophy is. You gimme a team with Joe Burrow, Ja'Marr Chase, and Tee Higgins; I'm throwing the ball and telling folks that's how I roll

You give me a team with Will Levis, Nate Westbrook, and Calvin Ridley, Ima build around the run and tell folks that's my plan

[pulses]

(02-15-2025, 11:19 PM)NUGDUKWE Wrote: Well i was referring to when he got here. Mixon was top 5 in 2018. First half of the season we were the worst running team 2nd half mixon was the #2 back in the league. So same line. But there is just too much evidence Taylor isn't going to switch up his offense now he's just not. 

Mixon was NEVER a top 5 RB and even if he was it would not have been in his second season 

[NUGDUKWE]

(02-15-2025, 11:09 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Slayton has averaged 720 yards a season in his 6-year career with horrendous QBs.
He has 66 starts across 92 games played.

Slayton has been playing on just a $6 mill per year contract.
If anything, he'll be closer to 1/4th the price, but ~70% the receiver.

In reality, Slayton could be a 800-900 yard WR in Cincy.
Not Higgins's caliber, but Higgins is arguably the top WR, maybe top guy overall in FA.

I think in reality, we all want to have Higgins back.
But he's going to be pricy.
And they have traditionally been bad drafting OL and DL, having more success in FA.

So would you rather have Slayton plus an upgrade at OL or DL added in FA, or just Higgins?

Personally, I'm cool either way. I won't be one of the ones upset if Higgins departs.

I won't be happy if we let Higgins go but I will accept it. It's possible to sign our guys and still get an upgrade for the OL and DL is what will really be disappointing. That's probably part of the reason I want Higgins back because it is possible if the bengals do what most of the league is doing. Are they willing to change to try and give us the absolute best chance to win a championship? 

[NUGDUKWE]

(02-15-2025, 11:40 PM)pulses Wrote: Mixon was NEVER a top 5 RB and even if he was it would not have been in his second season 

2018 he was 4th in rush yards so I would say that puts him top 5 in my mind. Then in 2019 the 2nd half of the season he was 2nd only behind Henry. He was never the focus with Taylor being here and that's the point I was making. Taylor is more focused on the pass. I think 2019 might be the perfect example of how that can effect the run game as you go from the worst to 2nd by only making it more of a priority.