Zeitler - All Pro or Free Agent?

[GreenCornBengal]

I have seen many on here discuss our starting guard Zeitler in various threads, discussing whether we will keep him long term or look for a replacement.

Some say he is good, some say not so good.

I am somewhere in the middle, I think he is serviceable, but I'm not very good at judging lineman anyways.

Here is an article from Bengals.com about Zeitler trying to be the best guard in the NFL. http://blogs.bengals.com/2015/06/03/zeitler-on-quest-to-be-the-best/

They compare him to Munoz and say he is the hardest worker on the team (even harder than Whit??)


So my question to you guys is, how good is Zeitler really, and can he be an all pro guard for us for the second half of this decade?
OR
Like some have said, is he replaceable with the new offensive talent we have nabbed in the draft?


ALSO how does giving Zeitler a contract fit into the long term goals of this offensive unit? We just signed Boling, and to me, if you want to keep Zeitler you have to let either Whit or Andre walk.


The struggles of having too many good linemen

[Stormborn]

He's very good. One of the strongest interior guys out there. By far our best run blocker.

He doesn't, however, fit the mold of a ZBS guy, he plays best in a phone booth and not in space, the last 3 Olinemen we've drafted have the opposite skillset, so I hope that's not a sign that Z isn't in our long term plans.

[WhoDeyWho]

(06-03-2015, 03:04 PM)GreenCornBengal Wrote: I have seen many on here discuss our starting guard Zeitler in various threads, discussing whether we will keep him long term or look for a replacement.

Some say he is good, some say not so good.

I am somewhere in the middle, I think he is serviceable, but I'm not very good at judging lineman anyways.

Here is an article from Bengals.com about Zeitler trying to be the best guard in the NFL. http://blogs.bengals.com/2015/06/03/zeitler-on-quest-to-be-the-best/

They compare him to Munoz and say he is the hardest worker on the team (even harder than Whit??)


So my question to you guys is, how good is Zeitler really, and can he be an all pro guard for us for the second half of this decade?
OR
Like some have said, is he replaceable with the new offensive talent we have nabbed in the draft?


ALSO how does giving Zeitler a contract fit into the long term goals of this offensive unit? We just signed Boling, and to me, if you want to keep Zeitler you have to let either Whit or Andre walk.


The struggles of having too many good linemen

I'm pretty sure re-signing Zeitler will be a priority of the team.  He's one of our best lineman coming off of his rookie deal.  

[CJD]

Zeitler came into the league with the reputation of being a powerful run blocker who would require help against speed rushers. He is good in pass protection except against quicker guys who will test him with their first step. He is an ideal power running scheme OG.

Stormborn is right though, we just drafted 2 great zone blocking offensive tackles.

Kind of makes you wonder what the plan is, as Boling is better as a zone blocker as well.
Even Bodine is surprisingly quick for his size and works well in the 2nd level.

I believe Zeitler works great next to Smith, who is another non zone blocking road grader at RT.

But my guess is we let Smith leave for free agency after this year, replace him with one of our ZBS tackles, Ogbuehi or Fisher, then the next year, we let Zeitler go to free agency, and replace him with the other ZBS tackle/guard. Or, that player goes to LT once Whitworth retires/doesn’t re-sign etc, and we may re-sign Zeitler until we can find a ZBS guard in the draft.

[Bengal Dude]

Zeitler is an awesome player for us. Here's the thing for us. We have Jake Fisher and Cedric Ogbuehi in the wings for next season. So Andre can walk after the season and we have two guys on friendly rookie deals. There should be zero issue for us to re-sign Zeitler. I know Iupati just signed a huge deal for a guard, but Marshall Yanda is the highest paid RG at a little over $6 million. I think Zeitler is more valuable than Boling, so just use those for reference and work on a long term deal.

[SunsetBengal]

In my opinion, Zeitler is the real deal.  When healthy, his play is nothing short of All-Pro quality. Clearly one of the best run blocking Guards in the league.  Yes, he has been hampered by some nagging injuries, the past two years, he has also showed some good courage by playing through the pain.  Hopefully, he is completely healthy, and can remain injury free the entire season.

[RoyleRedlegs]

Zeitler is fine in the ZBS.
He's proven he can adapt and play well. I'd get it if he were struggling, but he isn't.

He's worth the money.

[XenoMorph]

(06-03-2015, 04:18 PM)RoyleRedlegs Wrote: Zeitler is fine in the ZBS.
He's proven he can adapt and play well. I'd get it if he were struggling, but he isn't.

He's worth the money.

It will call come down to how much we want to invest @ OG with Boiling under contract. Our 2 new tackles wont need new contracts for at least 3 years Fisher and 4/5 Years O. so we could invest in retaining him.

It will probly all just come down to Cash available after the other extenstions are handed out. a lot can happen between now and years end though.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

I think Zeit has the biggest ceiling of any of our Guards by far. He was injured a bit the last
couple of years and i think that is a big reason why we have not seen him be an All-Pro quite
yet. I would rather us let Andre go and use Obuehi or Fisher at RT then let Zeit hit the market.

[Beaker]

Let Andre Smith play out his contract. Re-sign Zeitler. Sign Whitworth for 2 more yrs. Then let him go also.

[Steeler Eater]

(06-03-2015, 05:03 PM)Beaker Wrote: Let Andre Smith play out his contract. Re-sign Zeitler. Sign Whitworth for 2 more yrs. Then let him go also.

Probably the best bet. Zeitler is extremely serviceable, but eventually we will have to throw more than run and Zeitler's strength is in the run and considering we brought in 2 lineman with the first 2 picks you would have to think they are going to be starting in the next 2-3 years.

[OSUfan]

(06-03-2015, 03:04 PM)GreenCornBengal Wrote: I have seen many on here discuss our starting guard Zeitler in various threads, discussing whether we will keep him long term or look for a replacement.

Some say he is good, some say not so good.

I am somewhere in the middle, I think he is serviceable, but I'm not very good at judging lineman anyways.

Here is an article from Bengals.com about Zeitler trying to be the best guard in the NFL. http://blogs.bengals.com/2015/06/03/zeitler-on-quest-to-be-the-best/

They compare him to Munoz and say he is the hardest worker on the team (even harder than Whit??)


So my question to you guys is, how good is Zeitler really, and can he be an all pro guard for us for the second half of this decade?
OR
Like some have said, is he replaceable with the new offensive talent we have nabbed in the draft?


ALSO how does giving Zeitler a contract fit into the long term goals of this offensive unit? We just signed Boling, and to me, if you want to keep Zeitler you have to let either Whit or Andre walk.


The struggles of having too many good linemen

Personally, I would sign Whit to a two year deal, keep Zeitler, and let Andre walk. Andre is great when he is healthy but you just do not know when or how long that will be. I just do not see the return on the investment being what it should be with Andre. Just my opinion though.

[XenoMorph]

(06-03-2015, 05:27 PM)OSUfan Wrote: Personally, I would sign Whit to a two year deal, keep Zeitler, and let Andre walk. Andre is great when he is healthy but you just do not know when or how long that will be. I just do not see the return on the investment being what it should be with Andre. Just my opinion though.

If that occurs then with the current lineup

Whit Boiling bodine Z OT

Only 1 of our top 2 picks this year will get playing time on the line.. over the next 3 years... Whoever is the RT.

Hard choices to make for sure.

[Thundercloud]

Zeitler is a very fine guard, and I don't think we should let him get away from us. They may be taking a look at how well they could replace Andre with one of the new tackles. They have to get a good look at the new guys before letting Andre walk, but he probably is the most expendable. He's got a lot of talent, but has been a management problem, and a little up and down in several ways.

If we hold our middle together with with Boling Zeitler and Bodine, and re-sign Whit, then we can use the best new tackle to replace Andre, and have a continuing tough line. We also probably then have Whit's eventual replacement on the roster. Could end up as nice succession planning.

[JSR18]

I've said it before, I'll say it again: Fisher is going to get a chance to outplay ASmith. If he does, ASmith will be gone before the season starts.

Ogbuehi is the LT of the future...

[SunsetBengal]

(06-03-2015, 05:05 PM)Steeler Eater Wrote: Probably the best bet. Zeitler is extremely serviceable, but eventually we will have to throw more than run and Zeitler's strength is in the run and considering we brought in 2 lineman with the first 2 picks you would have to think they are going to be starting in the next 2-3 years.

I don't get why people think that Zeitler is not a good pass blocker?  The only times I've seen him struggle, were when he was playing injured.

[RoyleRedlegs]

(06-03-2015, 07:39 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: I don't get why people think that Zeitler is not a good pass blocker?  The only times I've seen him struggle, were when he was playing injured.

He's good not great at it. He struggles when he plants his feet and can't get them moving again. It's his Achilles Heel. 
Dallas, Miami, San Diego....three big moments in three games he lost badly at the point of attack and it cost us games or at least made the chances of winning near zero. 
All three were near identical plays.  Rusher fakes one way, comes back the other. Zeitler plants his feet and gets beat across the face. 

[SunsetBengal]

(06-03-2015, 07:48 PM)RoyleRedlegs Wrote: He's good not great at it. He struggles when he plants his feet and can't get them moving again. It's his Achilles Heel. 
Dallas, Miami, San Diego....three big moments in three games he lost badly at the point of attack and it cost us games or at least made the chances of winning near zero. 
All three were near identical plays.  Rusher fakes one way, comes back the other. Zeitler plants his feet and gets beat across the face. 

Don't forget that Paul Alexander called him "the hardest working guy that he's ever coached". 

I'm not dismissing that he has flaws in his game, even the best players do.  I'm just saying that I have faith that should his health stay consistent, his footwork should improve on a lineal path. 

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(06-03-2015, 08:14 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Don't forget that Paul Alexander called him "the hardest working guy that he's ever coached". 

I'm not dismissing that he has flaws in his game, even the best players do.  I'm just saying that I have faith that should his health stay consistent, his footwork should improve on a lineal path. 

I completely agree Sunset.

[RoyleRedlegs]

(06-03-2015, 08:14 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Don't forget that Paul Alexander called him "the hardest working guy that he's ever coached". 

I'm not dismissing that he has flaws in his game, even the best players do.  I'm just saying that I have faith that should his health stay consistent, his footwork should improve on a lineal path. 

In theory yes, but at this stage of the game, something like that can be hard to really change. Just like a QB's delivery. In ideal circumstances it can change but heat of the moment instinct takes over and those years of doing that one thing come right back. 

He could easily be our best OL in a year.

I'd love to see him worked at center in an effort to get the 5 best players on the field at once. 
Whit - Boling - Zeilter - Hopkins - Fisher could be an incredible ZBS OL