71% of Americans do not want to give Amnesty to DACA illegal aliens

[BmorePat87]

(11-10-2017, 01:33 AM)Benton Wrote: Ask trump. He said it’s really hard to find employees and everybody brings in foreign labor to fill jobs. (This is in reference to his recent application to bring in dozens of wait staff because he “can’t” find workers with newspaper ads featuring no contact info).

We’re likely stuck with 5%+. And many of those jobs are going to go unfilled as there’s no shortage of jobs paying less than a living wage.

To be fair, there was a fax number. You telling me people don't have fax machines?

[Belsnickel]

(11-09-2017, 11:53 PM)bfine32 Wrote: OK, do it your way. Just a suggestion. 

I get that you enjoy, what does Lucie call it, virtue signalling on this. I just don't have any issues when I attack the article than get attacked personally in response.

[GMDino]

(11-10-2017, 01:26 AM)Benton Wrote: Never recover from what? Allowing the 16 million people already here to... be here?

If the raise act is trumps proposal, you might as well close borders. There’s an incredibly short list of international rocket scientist millionaires in the 20 looking to invest in American companies.

And why by nation? Is an Albanian computer programmer better than a Nigerian computer programmer just because he’s from Albania?

Third time that question has been asked...still no answer.

But you know the answer to the last two questions...no need to ask them again.  

[StLucieBengal]

(11-10-2017, 01:26 AM)Benton Wrote: Never recover from what? Allowing the 16 million people already here to... be here?

If the raise act is trumps proposal, you might as well close borders. There’s an incredibly short list of international rocket scientist millionaires in the 20 looking to invest in American companies.

And why by nation? Is an Albanian computer programmer better than a Nigerian computer programmer just because he’s from Albania?

16 million people who are taking away jobs from actual Americans.

The unemployment rate can get a real shot to go down. Plus we have a problem already with immigrants who aren’t assimilating.

We don’t need rocket scientists. I would settle for educated people who follow the laws.

[StLucieBengal]

(11-10-2017, 10:34 AM)GMDino Wrote: Third time that question has been asked...still no answer.

But you know the answer to the last two questions...no need to ask them again.  

How about we don’t need 16 million law breakers who aren’t even supposed to be here. It’s bad enough we have to deal with US citizens who are criminals why should we be dealing with other countries law breakers as well?

[Belsnickel]

(11-10-2017, 10:44 AM)StLucieBengal Wrote: 16 million people who are taking away jobs from actual Americans.

The unemployment rate can get a real shot to go down. Plus we have a problem already with immigrants who aren’t assimilating.

We don’t need rocket scientists. I would settle for educated people who follow the laws.

We are at or near what economists are saying is full employment for us. So I'm not sure what the jobs argument is. As for assimilation, it's a two-way street. If immigrants face discrimination, they stick together in their communities even more and will be less likely to assimilate. It is a vicious cycle that will never stop.

[BmorePat87]

(11-10-2017, 10:52 AM)Belsnickel Wrote: We are at or near what economists are saying is full employment for us. So I'm not sure what the jobs argument is. As for assimilation, it's a two-way street. If immigrants face discrimination, they stick together in their communities even more and will be less likely to assimilate. It is a vicious cycle that will never stop.

"A large majority of them can neither read nor write, cannot understand our language, and have a natural tendency to live crowded among their own race and to continue their customs brought with them. The time has come when the American people must call a halt to the Italians."
-Baltimore Sun, 1906

[StLucieBengal]

(11-10-2017, 01:33 AM)Benton Wrote: Ask trump. He said it’s really hard to find employees and everybody brings in foreign labor to fill jobs. (This is in reference to his recent application to bring in dozens of wait staff because he “can’t” find workers with newspaper ads featuring no contact info).

We’re likely stuck with 5%+. And many of those jobs are going to go unfilled as there’s no shortage of jobs paying less than a living wage.

Disney is a massive exploiter of the foreign workers. Unemployment in Florida and California is high enough that I am sure Disney could find people.

As to the lower end jobs. Once we deport the illegals then we can start pushing people off welfare into these jobs.

[StLucieBengal]

(11-10-2017, 10:52 AM)Belsnickel Wrote: We are at or near what economists are saying is full employment for us. So I'm not sure what the jobs argument is. As for assimilation, it's a two-way street. If immigrants face discrimination, they stick together in their communities even more and will be less likely to assimilate. It is a vicious cycle that will never stop.

Discrimination happens when people exclude themselves from the rest of the society.

You have to reach out to people.

There is no reason they should have “communities”. The fact that they do should send a signal they aren’t working out and should go home.

And if we are at “full unemployment” then we need to remove some more illegals until that number is below.

[treee]

(11-10-2017, 11:01 AM)StLucieBengal Wrote: Disney is a massive exploiter of the foreign workers.   Unemployment in Florida and California is high enough that I am sure Disney could find people.  

As to the lower end jobs.  Once we deport the illegals then we can start pushing people off welfare into these jobs.

This is definitely true. That said, they use documented immigrants so that doesn't necessarily apply to the immigrants affected by DACA.

[treee]

(11-10-2017, 11:05 AM)StLucieBengal Wrote: Discrimination happens when people exclude themselves from the rest of the society.  

You have to reach out to people.  

There is no reason they should have “communities”.  The fact that they do should send a signal they aren’t working out and should go home.

And if we are at “full unemployment” then we need to remove some more illegals until that number is below.

I disagree with what you are claiming is the cause of discrimination.

[BmorePat87]

(11-10-2017, 10:44 AM)StLucieBengal Wrote: 16 million people who are taking away jobs from actual Americans.    

The unemployment rate can get a real shot to go down.    Plus we have a problem already with immigrants who aren’t assimilating.    

We don’t need rocket scientists.   I would settle for educated people who follow the laws.

8 million are in the labor force, actually. There's only 11 million illegal immigrants in this country to begin with and they aren't necessarily taking jobs from citizens. 

And as others have repeatedly stated, ideal unemployment is something between 3-4%. If you expel 8 million from the workforce and all 7m unemployed Americans took their jobs, you'd now have a  shortage, and that's at the current level of 4.4% unemployed. 

[StLucieBengal]

(11-10-2017, 11:08 AM)treee Wrote: This is definitely true. That said, they use documented immigrants so that doesn't necessarily apply to the immigrants affected by DACA.

I have been against worker visa as well. The point was employers hiring foreign workers or illegals.

[StLucieBengal]

(11-10-2017, 11:10 AM)BmorePat87 Wrote: 8 million are in the labor force, actually. There's only 11 million illegal immigrants in this country to begin with and they aren't necessarily taking jobs from citizens. 

And as others have repeatedly stated, ideal unemployment is something between 3-4%. If you expel 8 million from the workforce and all 7m unemployed Americans took their jobs, you'd now have a  shortage, and that's at the current level of 4.4% unemployed. 

Then at that point we could bring In legal workers. Why should we be catering to or providing a job to anyone who purposely disregards the law?

[treee]

(11-10-2017, 11:13 AM)StLucieBengal Wrote: I have been against worker visa as well.   The point was employers hiring foreign workers or illegals.

I wouldn't go so far as to say I'm "against" visas for foreign workers, but it is definitely abused as it stands now. 

[BmorePat87]

(11-10-2017, 11:05 AM)StLucieBengal Wrote: Discrimination happens when people exclude themselves from the rest of the society.  

You have to reach out to people.  

There is no reason they should have “communities”.  The fact that they do should send a signal they aren’t working out and should go home.

And if we are at “full unemployment” then we need to remove some more illegals until that number is below.

This is just false. We have decades of history to fall back on that tell us that discrimination and outward aggression towards immigrants both forced them to live within ethnic communities and caused them to seek the comfort of these communities they were initially forced into by discriminatory practices. 

Italians, Irish, German, Polish, Chinese, you name it, they all had their own communities. They also all assimilated and, in many cases, their culture was merged into the overall American culture. You should review your mid 19th to mid 20th century history. 

[Benton]

(11-10-2017, 10:44 AM)StLucieBengal Wrote: 16 million people who are taking away jobs from actual Americans.    

The unemployment rate can get a real shot to go down.    Plus we have a problem already with immigrants who aren’t assimilating.    

We don’t need rocket scientists.   I would settle for educated people who follow the laws.

A- Mostly of the low income variety. These, mostly,  aren't rocket scientists in their 20s with millions in the bank; it's waiters and barbers and general laborers. It's (mostly) jobs under $10 an hour, which isn't enough to live off of unless you're pooling multiple incomes and living expenses. As a culture, Americans don't do that.

Now, if the economy was one where companies felt responsible enough for their country to pay a living wage, then I'd see your point. But the mantra for a few decades has been to pay as little as possible and get the most labor for the fewest dollars.

2- Give them a reason to assimilate instead of running fake news stories about scary religions and ethnic groups. 

Lastly- Then support DACA, and disregard Trump's ludicrous requirements.

[BmorePat87]

(11-10-2017, 11:15 AM)StLucieBengal Wrote: Then at that point we could bring In legal workers.   Why should we be catering to or providing a job to anyone who purposely disregards the law?

Because no one else is filling these jobs? Are you advocating for no jobs for anyone who breaks the law or just illegal immigrants?

[Benton]

(11-10-2017, 10:50 AM)StLucieBengal Wrote: How about we don’t need 16 million law breakers who aren’t even supposed to be here.    It’s bad enough we have to deal with US citizens who are criminals why should we be dealing with other countries law breakers as well?

Here's my issue with calling them lawbreakers.

Years ago, we stopped funding immigration regulations. Immigration backed up. Suddenly, it's broken and those waiting to get processed are doing things illegally. Which is not always accurate. People wait and wait and never hear anything because their file is 20 down on a desk with 100 other files and it keeps moving down because someone who can afford an immigration attorney moves to the top.

This should never have become a country where you need an attorney to help you do everything.

[GMDino]

(11-10-2017, 10:50 AM)StLucieBengal Wrote: How about we don’t need 16 million law breakers who aren’t even supposed to be here.    It’s bad enough we have to deal with US citizens who are criminals why should we be dealing with other countries law breakers as well?

The only law they broke is being here.  If we make them citizens they aren't "lawbreakers" anymore.

Not saying I agree to make 16 million people instant citizens, but the logic is flawed.  Probably due to personal bias based on what has been shown to be a lack of understanding on things like the DACA program and it's participants.