Afghanistan

[BFritz21]

Yeah, and I heard we're just leaving tanks, guns, and whatever else, so it's going to be hell.

The Taliban is rapidly taking over.

This is what you get when Americans vote with emotion and elect a leader with dementia.

[fredtoast]

(08-15-2021, 10:14 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Most likely belongs in PnR, but I'm not allowed in there because....

Coming from someone who has seen the immediate results of a female child mutilated and her family slaughtered for simply trying to walk to school. And have also seen close friends lose their lives in hopes of providing a brighter future. This is most likely one of the saddest days in my life.

It is personal for you.  I realize that makes it tough.  But there are people getting killed by their government all over the world.  It would bankrupt the United States to be PERMANENTLY responsible for protecting all those people all over the world.

[fredtoast]

(08-15-2021, 10:44 PM)BFritz21 Wrote:  This is what you get when Americans vote with emotion and elect a leader with dementia.

I know.  BUt at least Trump is out of office now.  Under his agreement we would have had full withdrawal by May first.  Biden refused to do that and kept our troops there longer, but it was a lost cause no matter when we withdrew.


BOTH Democrats and Republicans realized that the United States can't be responsible for Afghanistan FOREVER.

[BFritz21]

(08-15-2021, 10:50 PM)bfine32 Wrote: No need to make it bias. The previous administration ordered the withdraw, the current administration executed it.  

Was the previous administration going to have a plan or were they just going to leave all the tanks and guns for the Taliban to take?

[fredtoast]

(08-16-2021, 12:42 AM)BFritz21 Wrote: Was the previous administration going to have a plan or were they just going to leave all the tanks and guns for the Taliban to take?

Since neither administration wanted the Taliban to take over I assume they would have left all the weapons for the Afghanis to fight with.  So many people are complaining about us withdrawing our troops.  Can you imagine what they would be saying if we took all the weapons with us?

[Arturo Bandini]

It'a global fail of the US Army and Intelligence and every administration since Bush's lies to invade countries not involved in 9.11 and not acting against those who dit it : Saudi Arabia.

[Belsnickel]

I'm surprised this hasn't been started, already. The Taliban has taken over control of the Afghani government once again after the withdrawal of US and coalition troops. On the bright side, a deal was struck that prevented a militaristic conquering of the capital which could have killed so many more. On the downside, Afghanistan has defeated another global power. Just curious about everyone's thoughts on all of this.

Personally, I blame the administrations all the way back to G.W. Bush. None of them were able to clearly define objectives and set an end goal. They were unable to create an effective exit strategy.

[Arturo Bandini]

So all the equipments of the 300K afghan army are now with the Talibans ...

Time will tell.

[CKwi88]

(08-16-2021, 07:27 AM)Belsnickel Wrote: I'm surprised this hasn't been started, already. The Taliban has taken over control of the Afghani government once again after the withdrawal of US and coalition troops. On the bright side, a deal was struck that prevented a militaristic conquering of the capital which could have killed so many more. On the downside, Afghanistan has defeated another global power. Just curious about everyone's thoughts on all of this.

Personally, I blame the administrations all the way back to G.W. Bush. None of them were able to clearly define objectives and set an end goal. They were unable to create an effective exit strategy.

I was also surprised at no topic, but I think that it can be attributed to the fact that it is pretty much agreed that this is an embarassment. While both the GOP and the Dems are already rushing to point fingers, this is a Vietnam-esque snafu that should really cause the nation as a whole to really reflect on what a disaster the last 20 plus years have been. While I'm sure that this will taint the Biden administration, the fact is that this is a collective failure that spans the last four administrations. 

It needed to end and in that regard I respect the Biden administration's decision to (not publicly) essentially admit defeat and rip off the band aid so to speak. It was time.

What a sad waste of time, money and more importantly lives. Equally for our military as well as the tens of thousands of innocent lives that this conflict has ended and the many more innocent lives that will be ruined as the Taliban retakes control.

[Au165]

It was a “war” that was never going to be won, history there has shown us this. You can’t just go in and force a government on a group that set in tribalism that doesn’t want it. No exit strategy was ever going to work because in the end the Taliban bribed high ranking members of the military and many others just deserted their ranks, which is why it only took 9 days or whatever it was. The Taliban never left, they were always there and as long as they were there this was always the end result.

Trumps desire to leave was one of the few things I supported him on.

[masonbengals fan]

While I support the idea of leaving, I can't help but think it should have went better than what we are witnessing.

[Belsnickel]

(08-16-2021, 09:12 AM)masonbengals fan Wrote:

While I support the idea of leaving, I can't help but think it should have went better than what we are witnessing.

It should have, but it was never planned well enough to happen better. This was destined from the beginning.

[BFritz21]

(08-16-2021, 03:38 AM)fredtoast Wrote: Since neither administration wanted the Taliban to take over I assume they would have left all the weapons for the Afghanis to fight with.  So many people are complaining about us withdrawing our troops.  Can you imagine what they would be saying if we took all the weapons with us?

We were training the Afghan forces to take over and defend themselves, so do you think we were using our own guns to train them?  

We supplied them with their own.

They'd probably be saying "good thing we didn't leave all those weapons for the Taliban!"

[*Nately120*]

With all this talk of ISIS and Antifa and border caravans of rapist illegals I feel like the taliban sort of got left in the dust for a while.  Still, wasn't this withdrawal sort of inevitable?  Bush and Obama were the warhawk sort of "keep 'em over there" types and with the GOP going from that to culture war stuff focused on the USA it didn't seem like the 2020 election had a candidate that was going to really double-down on the war over there.


The interest in fighting off the taliban got lost in the shuffle of rigged elections, vaccination and lockdown stuff, and cancel culture.  We're focused on ourselves now...America first.

[Truck_1_0_1_]

(08-15-2021, 10:44 PM)BFritz21 Wrote: Yeah, and I heard we're just leaving tanks, guns, and whatever else, so it's going to be hell.

The Taliban is rapidly taking over.

This is what you get when Americans vote with emotion and elect a leader with dementia.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't Trump sign a deal to release 5,000 captured, Taliban prisoners and signed a ceasefire that would expire during Biden's time as president and not his?

[CarolinaBengalFanGuy]

(08-16-2021, 11:00 AM)Truck_1_0_1_ Wrote: Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't Trump sign a deal to release 5,000 captured, Taliban prisoners and signed a ceasefire that would expire during Biden's time as president and not his?

That would depend on if he signed it before or after the election if he knew it was going to be Biden’s time.

[Belsnickel]

(08-16-2021, 10:41 AM)Nately120 Wrote: With all this talk of ISIS and Antifa and border caravans of rapist illegals I feel like the taliban sort of got left in the dust for a while.  Still, wasn't this withdrawal sort of inevitable?  Bush and Obama were the warhawk sort of "keep 'em over there" types and with the GOP going from that to culture war stuff focused on the USA it didn't seem like the 2020 election had a candidate that was going to really double-down on the war over there.


The interest in fighting off the taliban got lost in the shuffle of rigged elections, vaccination and lockdown stuff, and cancel culture.  We're focused on ourselves now...America first.

I think that once Osama bin Laden was killed the general public lost their investment in the war in Afghanistan. Americans in general were not in this for the regime change/nation building that the government went into the region with as their intentions. Because of that, the political viability of the war just continually declined. The War on Terror was about vengeance the way it was branded, and once Americans had that there was no longer a point.

[*Nately120*]

(08-16-2021, 11:35 AM)Belsnickel Wrote: I think that once Osama bin Laden was killed the general public lost their investment in the war in Afghanistan. Americans in general were not in this for the regime change/nation building that the government went into the region with as their intentions. Because of that, the political viability of the war just continually declined. The War on Terror was about vengeance the way it was branded, and once Americans had that there was no longer a point.

Right, Toby Keith ain't writing no sing-along fist-pumping song about the intricacies of nation building and the gradual installation of self-sufficient democracies in foreign nations. 

[Arturo Bandini]

(08-16-2021, 11:00 AM)Truck_1_0_1_ Wrote: Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't Trump sign a deal to release 5,000 captured, Taliban prisoners and signed a ceasefire that would expire during Biden's time as president and not his?

Dude who took control of the Kabul capitol  yesterday was freed with those 5000 people. They all went straight to taliban army.

[Arturo Bandini]

(08-16-2021, 11:32 AM)CarolinaBengalFanGuy Wrote: That would depend on if he signed it before or after the election if he knew it was going to be Biden’s time.

Doha 02/29/2020