Grope a dope: Trump is on the ropes now

[*PhilHos*]

(10-09-2016, 03:29 PM)GMDino Wrote: Correction:

Admitting you did deplorable things because you are a star and can get away with it.

Also who got away with a crime in your example?

Uh, Hillary Clinton. Unless I'm mistaken and she IS going to be arrested.



Sent from my SPH-L710T using Tapatalk

[*PhilHos*]

(10-09-2016, 03:30 PM)wildcats forever Wrote: How about making horribly sexist and deplorable comments a stand alone issue, instead of comparing them to something else? Does another's actions excuse Trump, letting him off the hook?

It does NOT let Trump off the hook. He needs to take responsibility for his actions. However, Hillary commits a crime or two and I don't see any on her side of the aisle taking the moral high ground.

Nope, it's okay for Hillary to commit a crime yet those same people think trump should drop out of the race.

Personally, i don't think either should still be candidates but this is what we have. Two lying, self-absorbed assholes who are only in this race for themselves. What's worse is that there are people who support them and defend they're indefensible words and deeds.

Sent from my SPH-L710T using Tapatalk

[Dill]

(10-09-2016, 03:24 PM)PhilHos Wrote: Just so we're all on the same page, making horribly sexist and deplorable comments is worse than committing a crime and getting away with it?

Sent from my SPH-L710T using Tapatalk

Depends on the crime.

But Groping women against their will is a crime, isn't it? If Trump is to be believed, he has gotten away with it.
We on the same page about that? Or is this still about a little locker room banter?

[*wildcats forever*]

(10-09-2016, 03:45 PM)PhilHos Wrote: It does NOT let Trump off the hook. He needs to take responsibility for his actions. However, Hillary commits a crime or two and I don't see any on her side of the aisle taking the moral high ground.

Nope, it's okay for Hillary to commit a crime yet those same people think trump should drop out of the race.

Personally, i don't think either should still be candidates but this is what we have. Two lying, self-absorbed assholes who are only in this race for themselves. What's worse is that there are people who support them and defend they're indefensible words and deeds.

Sent from my SPH-L710T using Tapatalk

We do have a Hillary Clinton sub-forum for those who wish to comment on her. This (Donald Trump topic) thread is in the Donald Trump sub-forum.

[Millhouse]

(10-09-2016, 03:13 PM)Dill Wrote: This doesn't sound very "moderate." 

Clinton "bringing in 100 of thousands of refugees yearly"--that's what they say in the bubble, neither factual reality nor proposed.

Which socialistic policies would you do away with--social security, medicare, welfare, the GI bill, public schools?

She already said she wants to bring over 100,000 refugees in yearly, which is way more than what Obama has done. Not just Syrian, but from all over the world. And the socialistic policies I am referring to is her proposed free college Bernie plan and plugging away with Obamacare that is failing more and more for anyone that isnt rich or poor. 

[*PhilHos*]

(10-09-2016, 03:45 PM)Dill Wrote: Depends on the crime.

But Groping women against their will is a crime, isn't it? If Trump is to be believed, he has gotten away with it.
We on the same page about that? Or is this still about a little locker room banter?

Like I said, Trump's comments are indefensible. I just wish those that condemn Trump would do so for Hillary in regards to her own indefensible failings (and I recognize that there are those, like me, that are critical of both Trump AND Hillary).

Sent from my SPH-L710T using Tapatalk

[*bfine32*]

(10-09-2016, 02:55 PM)Matt_Crimson Wrote: Pretty much this..... and any guy that says "well I haven't" is either lying or missing the point that every one in their life time has said something either degrading about women, or something that's racist or homophobic or some type of other "insulting/vile/unbelievable" slur or comment about SOMETHING etc.....  No one is innocent, no one is Jesus, no one is perfect or squeaky clean and it's really sad to see people taking this "greater than thou" approach as if they've never done anything wrong in their life.

Th only reason any of this is relevant is because Trump got caught. Truth is, only reason anyone's offended by this is because it was a man talking about a woman. If Hillary Clinton was caught making such remarks, people would have laughed and moved on. What I find hilarious is people are asking Donald Trump for a "real" apology. How ridiculous. How about we all just start throwing out the many sins we've committed on to the table and start apologizing to everyone because.... well..... we should apparently because.... ummm... it's offensive and stuff.

You underestimate the awesomeness of many on this board. Unlike me and other racist, white-supremacist, bigoted,rapist they have never had an impure thought or gasp shared it with a friend.

From jump, I have said what Trump said sounds bad; however, I've heard others on this board (many feigning outrage now) say or indicate just as bad if not worse in jovial conversation. 

[*bfine32*]

(10-09-2016, 03:45 PM)Dill Wrote: Depends on the crime.

But Groping women against their will is a crime, isn't it? If Trump is to be believed, he has gotten away with it.
We on the same page about that? Or is this still about a little locker room banter?

Again, link to him doing something against a woman's will. Do you have a link or do you just feel you have the need to make this up?

[BmorePat87]

(10-09-2016, 05:28 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Again, link to him doing something against a woman's will. Do you have a link or do you just feel you have the need to make this up?

lol, Trump's the one who claims to grope and kiss women against their will, not Dill. If it's a lie, Trump made it up, not Dill. 

[*bfine32*]

(10-09-2016, 06:51 PM)BmorePat87 Wrote: lol, Trump's the one who claims to grope and kiss women against their will, not Dill. If it's a lie, Trump made it up, not Dill. 

Where did he say against their will? Just quote the transcript, give a time hack in a vid, ect...

[BmorePat87]

(10-09-2016, 06:56 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Where did he say against their will? Just quote the transcript, give a time hack in a vid, ect...

Trump: "Yeah that's her with the gold. I better use some Tic Tacs just in case I start kissing her. You know I'm automatically attracted to beautiful... I just start kissing them. It's like a magnet. Just kiss. I don't even wait. And when you're a star they let you do it. You can do anything."

Bush: "Whatever you want."
Trump: "Grab them by the p***y. You can do anything."

Of course, anyone with Trump's shriveled orange balls in their mouths will just say it was consensual. 

[*bfine32*]

(10-09-2016, 07:12 PM)BmorePat87 Wrote: Trump: "Yeah that's her with the gold. I better use some Tic Tacs just in case I start kissing her. You know I'm automatically attracted to beautiful... I just start kissing them. It's like a magnet. Just kiss. I don't even wait. And when you're a star they let you do it. You can do anything."

Bush: "Whatever you want."
Trump: "Grab them by the p***y. You can do anything."

Of course, anyone with Trump's shriveled orange balls in their mouths will just say it was consensual. 

That Trump sure does say some classless things; not classy like you. 

As I have asserted folks are just embellishing, but of course we can just assume it was against their will because......

If I were in the assuming business; I'd assume someone would have lodged a complaint if he continually did this against folk's will.

But hey; we've already got the torches lit, seems like a waste not to use them.

[6andcounting]

Kissing someone who "lets you do it" = literally rape

[GMDino]

(10-09-2016, 05:28 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Again, link to him doing something against a woman's will. Do you have a link or do you just feel you have the need to make this up?

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/jul/20/donald-trump-sexual-assault-allegations-jill-harth-interview

Quote:A woman at the centre of sexual assault allegations against Donald Trump has spoken for the first time in detail about her personal experience with the billionaire tycoon who this week became the Republican nominee for president.


Jill Harth, a makeup artist, has stayed quiet for almost 20 years about the way Trump pursued her, and – according to a lawsuit she instigated – cornered her and groped her in his daughter’s bedroom.

After Trump mounted his campaign for the White House, details emerged of the 1997 complaint, in which Harth accused him of “attempted ‘rape’”.

She said she was quickly inundated with interview requests from major US television networks, but resolved not to speak about the events – until Trump publicly said in May that her claims were “meritless” and his daughter Ivanka gave an interview in which she said her father was “not a groper”.

Harth, who feels she has been publicly branded a liar and believes her business has suffered because of her association with the allegations, decided to speak out about her experience with Trump because she wants an apology.

 Jill Harth's allegations against Trump paint a picture of an entitled narcissist

In an hour-long interview at the Guardian’s New York office on Tuesday, Harth said she stands by her charges against Trump, which run from low-grade sexual harassment to an episode her lawyers described in the lawsuit as “attempted ‘rape’”.


She first met Trump in December 1992 at his offices in Trump Tower, where she and her then romantic partner, George Houraney, were making a business presentation. The couple wanted to recruit Trump to back their American Dream festival, in which Harth oversaw a pin-up competition known as American Dream Calendar Girls. Harth described that meeting as “the highlight of our career”.

But in other ways, it was something of a lowlight: Trump took an interest in Harth immediately and began subjecting her to a steady string of unwanted sexual advances, detailed by Harth in her complaint.


There was the initial leering in that first December meeting in Trump Tower, and the inappropriate questions after her relationship status.
It continued the next night over dinner at the Plaza Hotel’s Oak Room, where at a dinner with beauty pageant contestants she alleges he groped her under the table.

It culminated in January 1993, when Harth and Houraney were visiting his Florida mansion, Mar-a-Lago, to finalize and then celebrate the beauty pageant deal with a party.

After business concluded, Harth and Houraney were on tour of Mar-a-Lago along with a group of young pageant contestants – Trump wanted to “see the quality of the girls he was sponsoring”, Harth recalled – when he pulled her aside into one of the children’s bedrooms.

“He pushed me up against the wall, and had his hands all over me and tried to get up my dress again,” Harth said, “and I had to physically say: ‘What are you doing? Stop it.’ It was a shocking thing to have him do this because he knew I was with George, he knew they were in the next room. And how could he be doing this when I’m there for business?”
[/url]


FacebookTwitterPinterest
 Donald Trump in 1992 at his Mar-a-Lago estate, where Harth says ‘he pushed me up against the wall, and had his hands all over me and tried to get up my dress’. Photograph: Alamy

Speaking as Republicans gathered in Cleveland to formally declare Trump as the party’s candidate in the November general election, Harth said she had been very reluctant to talk after the sexual assault allegations resurfaced, “because honestly, it was painful for me to have to do it again. It was stressful, it gave me anxiety, it definitely wounded my marriage – it wasn’t the death knell, but it wounded it, it was stressful having to handle this.”

She recalled how Trump – who had just gone through a divorce from his first wife, Ivana, and was in a relationship with Marla Maples, who would become his second wife – pursued her and urged her to leave Houraney.

“Trump did everything in his power to get me to leave him. He constantly called me and said: ‘I love you, baby, I’m going to be the best lover you ever had. What are you doing with that loser, you need to be with me, you need to step it up to the big leagues.’

“He was constantly working on me during that time and that took a toll on me. But I moved on. I’m a forgiving type person, OK? I’m a Christian, I moved on.”

‘They tried to get me to say it never happened’

Trump’s decision to run for president brought the question to the fore for her once more. And initially, she said she was inclined to let bygones be bygones.

She concedes she even found herself getting excited at the thought that someone she knew so well was running for president.


A recent Trump rally she attended seemed to confirm her decision to lie low. “‘Don’t worry about it,’ I said, ‘I’m not going to say anything bad, we’ve moved on, we’re friendly,’” Harth recalled in her interview with the Guardian.

When Trump thanked her and gave her a hug, she thought he wouldn’t say anything either.

The interaction, Harth said, reaffirmed her decision to stay quiet. That is, until she saw Trump dismiss media reports referencing her case as “meritless”, or worse.

After the New York Times ran a story in May this year about Trump’s history with women, including an account of Harth’s story, Trump’s campaign even reached out to her to pressure her to take back her account, she told the Guardian on Tuesday.

“His office – and I have it on my voicemails that he called, that they called – they asked me to recant everything when the New York Times article came out. They were trying to get me to say it never happened and I made it up. And I said I’m not doing that,” she recalled. Trump’s office denied this.

She was further upset by an interview Trump’s daughter Ivanka gave in the wake of the New York Times article saying her dad is “not a groper”.

Quote:Nobody was defending me, that's why I'm talking … I went through hell and I still have to relive this again
Jill Harth

“I understand that the girl wanted to defend her dad, being it’s her dad,” she said, “but what did she know? She was 10 years old! She was 10 years old at the time. She didn’t know what her father was about, what he was doing, how he was acting.”

Such statements felt defamatory to Harth, adding insult to injury. That’s when she hired attorney Lisa Bloom to demand that Trump retract his statements that are, as Bloom put it, “effectively calling her a liar”.

“Jill is very clear that she is not a liar,” Bloom said. “And her reputation is important to her. And her living a life free of this kind of stress is important to her. So we’re calling on not only Mr Trump, Ivanka Trump, too.”

The renewed controversy comes as Trump prepares to give his keynote speech in Cleveland on Thursday. It also comes as Roger Ailes, the chairman and CEO of Trump-friendly Fox News, is in the process of being ousted following a sexual harassment suit filed by a former anchor.

When Trump’s office was asked to respond to Harth’s allegations, they highlighted her inconsistency about her views on Trump, forwarding emails from 2015 and as recently as January 2016 in which she expressed friendly feelings about Trump and even asked about a job helping to do his campaign trail makeup.

As Harth wrote in an August 2015 email forwarded by Trump’s campaign: “I also would like to show my support for Donald and his campaign. I am offering my services to do his grooming and getting him perfectly camera ready for photos and Hi-Definition TV. He knows better than anybody how important image is.”

In another email from October 2015, she praised Trump for “doing a tremendous job of shaking things up in the United States” and added: “I am definitely Team Trump!”

Harth said those emails were written months before Trump called her integrity into question. She also defended her action, as a businesswoman who has never been too proud to look for help where she needs it, even if it smacks of opportunism.
Meanwhile the fact that Trump has an army of staffers and family defending him is part of what inspired her to speak out, she said.

“Nobody was defending me, that’s why I’m talking,” Harth said. “You can believe it or not, but I went through hell and I still have to relive this again. And I just, I’m horrified that I have to think about this again.”

Michael Cohen, executive vice-president and special counsel to Donald Trump, responded by email to a Guardian request for comment, saying: “It is disheartening that one has to dignify a response to the below absurd query. Mr Trump denies each and every statement made by Ms Harth as these 24-year-old allegations lack any merit or veracity.

“Hope [Mr Trump’s spokeswoman Hope Hicks] will forward to you under separate e-mail, a series of e-mails documenting Ms Harth’s support of Mr Trump, the race for the White House as well as seeking a job opportunity with the campaign.”

In an earlier phone call, Cohen said Harth had “massive credibility issues”.


[url=https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/jul/20/donald-trump-sexual-assault-allegations-jill-harth-interview#img-2]
FacebookTwitterPinterest
 Harth said of her wish for an apology from Trump: ‘I don’t fully expect one.’ Photograph: Guardian

Speaking in Cleveland at the Republican national convention on Wednesday, Roger Stone, a veteran strategist and longtime Trump adviser, dismissed the allegations, saying: “I have an excellent bullshit detector.”

Stone added: “A verbal agreement is entirely unprovable … So it’s more he said, she said. Sure sounds like bullshit to me.”

Such responses from the Trump camp aren’t new and neither is the lawsuit, which Harth brought forward in 1997. She dropped it weeks later after Trump settled an outstanding business lawsuit from her partner Houraney claiming he broke contract by backing out of the American Dream festival. (Houraney sued for $5m but settled with Trump for a smaller, undisclosed amount.)

Houraney met Harth when she was still in high school and though he didn’t witness any of the alleged incidents with Trump, aside from that first meeting in Trump Tower, Houraney has never doubted her. “I know they’re all true,” he said of the allegations. “I knew her way too long to think she could make up stuff like that, It wasn’t in her. She wasn’t capable of making up the things she said in that thing.”
Harth told the Guardian she expected very little from Trump. “I’m not going to get an apology from him. That would be nice, but he – I don’t fully expect one. But he really should have been taught, if you don’t have anything nice to say don’t say anything, OK? Don’t call me a liar.

“He didn’t have to say anything. For once, he should have closed his mouth. He didn’t have to comment. We were on great – not great, I’ll take that back – we were on good terms, friendly terms. He didn’t – he started this. What is happening now is of his own making, OK? I was quiet.”

[BmorePat87]

(10-09-2016, 07:16 PM)bfine32 Wrote: That Trump sure does say some classless things; not classy like you. 

As I have asserted folks are just embellishing, but of course we can just assume it was against their will because......

If I were in the assuming business; I'd assume someone would have lodged a complaint if he continually did this against folk's will.

But hey; we've already got the torches lit, seems like a waste not to use them.

"You've never said anything bad"

"This is embellishing"

"People would come forward more if it were true"

"People just want to find a reason to attack him"


I'm just glad I won't ever have to live with the fact that I sacrificed my integrity to defend this man.

[GMDino]

(10-09-2016, 07:21 PM)6andcounting Wrote: Kissing someone who "lets you do it" = literally rape

Nope.

But:

Quote:Trump: You know I'm automatically attracted to beautiful... I just start kissing them. It's like a magnet. Just kiss. I don't even wait. And when you're a star they let you do it. You can do anything."


Bush: "Whatever you want."



Trump: "Grab them by the *****. You can do anything."

Is at least assault.

But hey...Republican right?

[GMDino]

(10-09-2016, 07:27 PM)BmorePat87 Wrote: "You've never said anything bad"

"This is embellishing"

"People would come forward more if it were true"

"People just want to find a reason to attack him"


I'm just glad I won't ever have to live with the fact that I sacrificed my integrity to defend this man.

Pretty much what I have been saying all day.

I realize that people will still vote for him because he's not Clinton, but their defending him is making lose respect for them.

I never defended Clinton during the Lewinski matter.  Never.  Said he should resign.

But I like Bill Clinton as a politician.

I can see people who refuse to support anyone else still backing him...I can't see how they can defend this.  But then they've defended every other thing he's said so maybe I shouldn't be surprised.

[*bfine32*]

(10-09-2016, 07:27 PM)BmorePat87 Wrote: "You've never said anything bad"

"This is embellishing"

"People would come forward more if it were true"

"People just want to find a reason to attack him"


I'm just glad I won't ever have to live with the fact that I sacrificed my integrity to defend this man.

I should work on my integrity and just say he did this against their will without any proof. Pretty sure he's a witch. 

You worry about your integrity and I'll worry about mine. If there is any proof that he took sexual liberties with anyone once they made it known they were not wanted; then I will put on the cape with the rest of you. 

I've said his remarks were bad, but obviously I condone them because I don't draw unfounded conclusions to them.

[BmorePat87]

I want to apologize. Not everyone who blindly defends Trumps tried to suggest it was consensual.

http://www.npr.org/2016/10/09/497270514/donald-trumps-lone-surrogate-on-tv-struggled-to-defend-him

Rudy acknowledged that what Trump described was assault. He just thinks Trump was lying.

[6andcounting]

(10-09-2016, 07:28 PM)GMDino Wrote: Nope.

But:



Is at least assault.

But hey...Republican right?

If he actually did it and it wasn't consensual.