Insanity defense

[*Nately120*]

(09-29-2020, 12:04 PM)PhilHos Wrote: Oh, I'm sorry that I took offense to you calling me and every other religious person in the world insane.

A main cost of entry to any religion seems to be calling every other religion and its followers wrong though. 

[*Nately120*]

(09-29-2020, 12:09 PM)PhilHos Wrote: "Let he who is without sin, cast the first stone"

With this line it seems like even Jesus himself discounted the Bible. It's interesting stuff. 

Actually a better question would be can let he without sin cast the first stone and judge not lest he be judged get me out of jury duty?

Should christians even be judges?

[fredtoast]

(09-29-2020, 12:04 PM)PhilHos Wrote: Oh, I'm sorry that I took offense to you calling me and every other religious person in the world insane.

Actually I took the opposite position.

I was saying that the insanity defense should NOT be available for a person who did something on God's orders.

[fredtoast]

(09-29-2020, 01:13 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Pretty sure I knew the story. I posed the question to you in an attempt for you to gain some self awareness.

No you did not.

The point of the story was not that Isaac was spared.  It was that Abraham was scared enough of God to commit the murder.

God did not stop Abraham and say "Hey, are you crazy?!? You think I really wanted you to kill your son?!"  In stead he said "Now I know how much you fear me."


This also shows why I get so frustrated with you "question games" tactic.  It allows you to try and  back out of a position when you are proven wrong.  If you really had confidence in your position you would just clearly state it instead of asking silly questions.

[*bfine32*]

(09-29-2020, 06:48 PM)fredtoast Wrote: No you did not.

The point of the story was not that Isaac was spared.  It was that Abraham was scared enough of God to commit the murder.

God did not stop Abraham and say "Hey, are you crazy?!? You think I really wanted you to kill your son?!"  In stead he said "Now I know how much you fear me."


This also shows why I get so frustrated with you "question games" tactic.  It allows you to try and  back out of a position when you are proven wrong.  If you really had confidence in your position you would just clearly state it instead of asking silly questions.

It was an ultimate test of his obedience. 

If you think God is not vain beyond comprehension then you may not "know" the bible as well as you think. 

What have I been "proven wrong " on? 

[oncemoreuntothejimbreech]

(09-29-2020, 06:58 PM)bfine32 Wrote: It was an ultimate test of his obedience. 

If you think God is not vain beyond comprehension then you may not "know" the bible as well as you think. 

What have I been "proven wrong " on? 

This is what Fred responded to with the story of Abraham. . .

(09-28-2020, 06:05 PM)PhilHos Wrote: Any person who believes in God should also know that God would not tell them to commit an action that would break HIS laws, too. You know, something like murdering someone else, for example.

But, also, if God asks you to break human law, He'd expect you to accept the consequences, as well.

God told Abraham to do something to break God’s law and Abraham was going to kill his son because God told him to do it.

[*PhilHos*]

(09-29-2020, 01:18 PM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: So how does armed conflict exempt those from God’s law?

Because soldiers killing other soldiers is not 'murder'

(09-29-2020, 02:08 PM)Nately120 Wrote: A main cost of entry to any religion seems to be calling every other religion and its followers wrong though. 

Saying someone is wrong is not the same as saying someone is crazy.

(09-29-2020, 06:40 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Actually I took the opposite position.

I was saying that the insanity defense should NOT be available for a person who did something on God's orders.

Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight. 

[*Nately120*]

(09-30-2020, 03:29 PM)PhilHos Wrote: Saying someone is wrong is not the same as saying someone is crazy

I guess, but saying that people are following a god that doesn't exist is a little harsher than some sort of almond joy vs mounds. disagreement. 

[fredtoast]

(09-30-2020, 03:29 PM)PhilHos Wrote: Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight. 

Thank goodness you finally understand.

I only had to tell you about three times.

Guess I could have just pointed out that this is a public poll so you can see exactly how I voted.

[*PhilHos*]

(09-30-2020, 07:19 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Thank goodness you finally understand.

I only had to tell you about three times.

Guess I could have just pointed out that this is a public poll so you can see exactly how I voted.

Notice only 2 other people voted? 

[oncemoreuntothejimbreech]

(09-30-2020, 03:29 PM)PhilHos Wrote: Because soldiers killing other soldiers is not 'murder'

Explain why it isn’t.

[GMDino]

I used to have long discussions/argument with a friend about religion.  I am Roman Catholic he is not.  He attended (at the time after we graduated college and his divorce) bible study classes led by a relative of his.  I was/am in the process of deprogramming from 16 years of Catholic schooling.

He believes in a strict biblical/literal interpretation of how to get into heaven.  I believe that God is a loving God who wants us to be good to each other as much as possible an understand our faults and failures and doesn't want to punish us if we made mistakes or didn't believe "the right way".

One thing I asked was if I told him tomorrow that God came to me and told me write a new gospel...would he accept it?  His answer was he would have to study it and see where it fit in the with the teaching of the bible and his church.

To me that means he doubts his faith/God if he can't accept NEW words from his God.

That's the way I feel about this subject in this post.  If you accept that God can speak to people in the bible then you should accept that he speaks to people now.  And what He tells people should be taken as the truth.  

Or you think that people are "crazy" because God told them to do something YOU don't think God would tell people to do.

I always also ended the discussion by suggesting that the only way we would know who was right was when we died. 

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(10-01-2020, 03:15 PM)PhilHos Wrote: Notice only 2 other people voted? 

You just got educated!!!!  

[fredtoast]

(10-01-2020, 03:15 PM)PhilHos Wrote: Notice only 2 other people voted? 

I notice you have not voted.

Why not?

Seems like the only reason you posted was to attack me and play your Christian victim card.

Why are you refusing to actually comment on the topic of this thread?

[*PhilHos*]

(10-02-2020, 11:05 AM)fredtoast Wrote: I notice you have not voted.

Why not?

Seems like the only reason you posted was to attack me and play your Christian victim card.

Why are you refusing to actually comment on the topic of this thread?

Why would I if I believe this thread to be a not-so-thinly veiled attack on Christians?

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(10-02-2020, 03:20 PM)PhilHos Wrote: Why would I if I believe this thread to be a not-so-thinly veiled attack on Christians?

Correction, an attack on religious people in general.  It obviously was.  Maybe it was subconscious on his part?

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

BTW, I'd like to point out that the poll is such a lawyer question it's actually painful. It's probably why no one decided to actually answer it.

[fredtoast]

(10-02-2020, 03:20 PM)PhilHos Wrote: Why would I if I believe this thread to be a not-so-thinly veiled attack on Christians?

This is a perfect example of how far some Christians will go to play their victim card.  There are TWO options in the poll and you are saying BOTH are an attack on religion.

No matter how a person votes they are "attaching religion".  No matter which position a person takes you are throwing down your victim card.

This is pathetic.

[*PhilHos*]

(10-02-2020, 03:55 PM)fredtoast Wrote: This is a perfect example of how far some Christians will go to play their victim card.  There are TWO options in the poll and you are saying BOTH are an attack on religion.

No matter how a person votes they are "attaching religion".  No matter which position a person takes you are throwing down your victim card.

This is pathetic.

Did you or did you not say:

(09-28-2020, 02:04 PM)fredtoast Wrote: I say "no" because all religious beliefs have no basis in reality or logic.  Therefore the argument would be that everyone who believes in God is insane. 

I'm sorry that I'm taking your words at face value and when you say that "everyone who believes in God is insane" you are saying that "everyone who believes in God is insane". This right after saying that 'religious beliefs' have no basis in reality or logic. I never would have thought that telling people to be kind to each other was illogical. 

[oncemoreuntothejimbreech]

(10-02-2020, 03:20 PM)PhilHos Wrote: Why would I if I believe this thread to be a not-so-thinly veiled attack on Christians?

Because Christians aren’t the only people who believe in a god. I assume that’s why he referred to religion and not specifically Christianity.