Mass shootings

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(02-19-2018, 03:41 PM)BmorePat87 Wrote: Serious question, does being voted your school's teacher of the year by the middle schoolers make you more of an expert than other teachers? 

Absolutely not.  Nor does being shot at make you anymore of an expert on gun control legislation.

[Belsnickel]

(02-19-2018, 03:44 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: It has been interesting to see some (note to others I said some, not all or most) people who scoffed at the idea of government overreach by rightwingers under Obama are now making the same argument with Trump in office.

Yeah, there has been an executive power grab for a long time. With each POTUS it just gets worse and worse.

[*bfine32*]

(02-19-2018, 03:41 PM)BmorePat87 Wrote: Serious question, does being voted your school's teacher of the year by the middle schoolers make you more of an expert than other teachers? 

Nope. It does mean you are more respected and depending on the criteria used to vote it very well could.

WTS, if someone asked me what made one's opinion more important than another's on children's mentality, I'd point to being teacher of the year as a pretty good reason; which is what I did. 

[BmorePat87]

(02-19-2018, 03:44 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: This is all completely speculatory, thankfully, but I don't think it would go as neat and clean as you suggest.

And I don't think it would be as large as you have, but I appreciate the fact that our back and forth's aren't toxic. 

[*bfine32*]

(02-19-2018, 03:44 PM)GMDino Wrote: Why does a made up award make this teacher an expert on any particular topic other than what they teach?

Doesn't even mean I don't agree with some her of post....it means she carries no extra weight other than he agrees with her.

Why would you call FLA teacher of the year a "made up award"? Seems kinda disrespectful. 

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(02-19-2018, 03:54 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Why would you call FLA teacher of the year a "made up award"? Seems kinda disrespectful. 

Because she disagrees with him, it's really that simple.  If she agreed with him the award would be super important.

[fredtoast]

(02-19-2018, 02:32 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: If you have any evidence that these children are being coerced into doing something they don't want to do, then I will agree with you. As of right now, everything points to them choosing to speak out in response to the events that occurred. If evidence is laid out that they are being used, then I will denounce the user, but if it is their choice to make their statements and take their actions then I have zero issued with it. People deal with grief in different ways, and some of those children may be putting so much into this because it is a way for them to focus their grief and anger.

I believe it is actually good for them to think that they are doing something to effect a change.  It will help them get over the feeling of helplessness they experienced when a gunman was hunting them.

[BmorePat87]

(02-19-2018, 03:45 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: Absolutely not.  Nor does being shot at make you anymore of an expert on gun control legislation.

I don't think those kids are experts in gun policy either. 

(02-19-2018, 03:53 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Nope. It does mean you are more respected and depending on the criteria used to vote it very well could.

WTS, if someone asked me what made one's opinion more than another's on children's mentality, I'd point to being teacher of the year as a pretty good reason; which is what I did. 

Fair. I'd make the argument that their experience and education is more important, but this is purely subjective and I was just looking for opinions. End of the day, it seems like we're inundated with experts on every side.

I appreciate the responses, guys. 

[GMDino]

(02-19-2018, 03:54 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Why would you call FLA teacher of the year a "made up award"? Seems kinda disrespectful. 

(02-19-2018, 03:56 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: Because she disagrees with him, it's really that simple.  If she agreed with him the award would be super important.

If only people got irony on this board....

[BmorePat87]

(02-19-2018, 03:54 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Why would you call FLA teacher of the year a "made up award"? Seems kinda disrespectful. 

(02-19-2018, 03:56 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: Because she disagrees with him, it's really that simple.  If she agreed with him the award would be super important.

It was actually just teacher of the year at her middle school, not Florida Teacher of the Year. Within the school it is often just students voting. The FL Teacher of the Year requires each school to send a nominee to their superintendent who then goes through a whole process to determine who represents their district the best. The state then does the same thing with each district nominee, narrowing it down to 5 finalists before selecting one. 

The school based one is certainly a big honor at that level, but Lucie was incorrect in suggesting this was THE Florida Teacher of the Year. 

[GMDino]

(02-19-2018, 03:44 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: I love your, "I'm defeated but I'm gonna act like I'm not" routine.  Please don't bother denying, if it wasn't true you'd actually try addressing points being made.


This is all completely speculatory, thankfully, but I don't think it would go as neat and clean as you suggest.


It has been interesting to see some (note to others I said some, not all or most) people who scoffed at the idea of government overreach by rightwingers under Obama are now making the same argument with Trump in office.



Nah, it's so unlikely to happen to you it's not even worthy of consideration.  Most tragically in this current shooting was how easily preventable it was.  The school, by policy, never reported this kids threats or other criminal acts because "muh school to prison pipeline".  The FBI screwed the pooch but not even investigating it and local law enforcement and the kid's neighbors never seemed to have moved forward in dealing with this kids criminal conduct.

If *I* said the sky was "blue" you would take apart each sentence to tell me the sky is not "blue" but rather the refraction of light makes it appear that way and that my statement implies it is always blue which is hyperbole.  Followed by an explanation of why your experience with the sky make you a much better expert than anyone who disagrees with you.

It's tiring and its useless for *me* to have a discussion with you because you think you "know" me.  

So continue your discussion with some who cares.

You know it all...have at it.  

[*bfine32*]

(02-19-2018, 04:06 PM)GMDino Wrote: If only people got irony on this board....

I think you misspelled hypocrisy and we get it. 

[GMDino]

(02-19-2018, 04:09 PM)BmorePat87 Wrote: It was actually just teacher of the year at her middle school, not Florida Teacher of the Year. Within the school it is often just students voting. The FL Teacher of the Year requires each school to send a nominee to their superintendent who then goes through a whole process to determine who represents their district the best. The state then does the same thing with each district nominee, narrowing it down to 5 finalists before selecting one. 

The school based one is certainly a big honor at that level, but Lucie was incorrect in suggesting this was THE Florida Teacher of the Year. 

And does she have more/better insight than the second place finisher? What if she teaches gym?  Is that better than teaching history?

Again she says some things I agree with in general.  But that's gonna get lumped in with all the other people I read about too.

[GMDino]

(02-19-2018, 04:11 PM)bfine32 Wrote: I think you misspelled hypocrisy and we get it. 

A little from column A...a little from column B.

[Belsnickel]

For the weary White House, Florida shooting offered a ‘reprieve’ from scandals

Quote:“For everyone, it was a distraction or a reprieve,” said one White House official, speaking anonymously to reflect internal conversations. “A lot of people here felt like it was a reprieve from seven or eight days of just getting pummeled.”

They really need to tighten up their messaging in the White House. I know what was intended here, and I truthfully do not judge them for it. This is going to be a bad soundbite, though.

[Belsnickel]

One of the interesting things in all this, talking about the FBI an everything, is what could the FBI actually have done? A lot of times there are warning signs and things are sent to law enforcement, but with current laws the FBI is limited in its authority as to what it can do. If the person has not committed a crime, are they able to detain them? They can't prevent them from purchasing a firearm. The laws regarding making threats often require very specific things to be said in order to be indicted.

I'm not sitting here saying that we should be stripping people of their civil liberties because of mere suspicion, I am just genuinely curious what people think law enforcement could have done to prevent these mass shootings that they had tips about.

[fredtoast]

(02-19-2018, 06:25 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: One of the interesting things in all this, talking about the FBI an everything, is what could the FBI actually have done? A lot of times there are warning signs and things are sent to law enforcement, but with current laws the FBI is limited in its authority as to what it can do. If the person has not committed a crime, are they able to detain them? They can't prevent them from purchasing a firearm. The laws regarding making threats often require very specific things to be said in order to be indicted.

I'm not sitting here saying that we should be stripping people of their civil liberties because of mere suspicion, I am just genuinely curious what people think law enforcement could have done to prevent these mass shootings that they had tips about.

This.

Kids are immature.  They joke about school shootings all the time.  FBI can not arrest someone for that.  And if they tried to take away his guns based on just some internet comments the NRA army would have exploded.

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(02-19-2018, 04:10 PM)GMDino Wrote:

If *I* said the sky was "blue" you would take apart each sentence to tell me the sky is not "blue" but rather the refraction of light makes it appear that way and that my statement implies it is always blue which is hyperbole.  Followed by an explanation of why your experience with the sky make you a much better expert than anyone who disagrees with you.

Incorrect.  You seem to take comfort in this notion as you routinely spout gibberish that I can easily disprove.  I've said it before, it remains true, you are the St. Lucie of the left, you spout inanities with the firm conviction of truth.  You constantly contradict yourself and don't realize it.  You disparage others for their "expert" opinion all the while trusting in the opinion of a blogger.  The most amusing and frustrating thing about you is you completely lack any comprehension as to how much you are the exact image of what you claim to hate, a blinkered ideologue who completely discounts any opinions that do not completely line up with your own.

Quote:It's tiring and its useless for *me* to have a discussion with you because you think you "know" me.  

Thankfully, I don't know you.  But you go on telling yourself this, it's not like I have this issue with the vast majority of the other posters on this board, both now and historically.  Maybe it's not me, it's you?

Quote:So continue your discussion with some who cares.

You know it all...have at it.  

It's both sad and predictable that you would take use this tactic.  In the years I have posted on this, and the other, board, have I ever been proven incorrect about a LEO or gun related issue?  Have I ever been caught in a lie on either subject.  Has anyone shown me to be completely devoid of factual, life based, information on either subject?  You have an agenda, that agenda allows no counter point.  You hold as truth what agrees with you and discount as amateur or invalid that which does not.  like I said, you're Lucie without the bigoted statements, which, sadly, is barely an improvement.

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(02-19-2018, 06:25 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: One of the interesting things in all this, talking about the FBI an everything, is what could the FBI actually have done? A lot of times there are warning signs and things are sent to law enforcement, but with current laws the FBI is limited in its authority as to what it can do. If the person has not committed a crime, are they able to detain them? They can't prevent them from purchasing a firearm. The laws regarding making threats often require very specific things to be said in order to be indicted.

I'm not sitting here saying that we should be stripping people of their civil liberties because of mere suspicion, I am just genuinely curious what people think law enforcement could have done to prevent these mass shootings that they had tips about.

(02-19-2018, 06:48 PM)fredtoast Wrote: This.

Kids are immature.  They joke about school shootings all the time.  FBI can not arrest someone for that.  And if they tried to take away his guns based on just some internet comments the NRA army would have exploded.

One thing would be to actually investigate it and see what breaks off.  You'd be surprised how many crimes are discovered during the course of investigating something completely unrelated.  It's very possible an investigation would have revealed nothing actionable, it's also possible it would have.  We'll never know now.  Another thing that could have been done is the school could have actually reported this kids criminal behavior to the police.  They did not due to a left leaning policy about not reporting criminal activity by students that did not involve violence.  Succumbing to the "school to prison pipeline" trope they did not involve law enforcement when this kid brought ammunition to school or made criminal threats against other students.  If any of the myriad violations of the penal code, that this kid was reported to have committed, were reported to law enforcement than this shooting would likely not have occurred.  Hard to pass a NICS check when you got a criminal threats conviction on your record.

[Vas Deferens]

(02-19-2018, 07:00 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: Hard to pass a NICS check when you got a criminal threats conviction on your record.

Are NICS checks always necessary to buy an AR, or are there 'loopholes' or whatever the term is for gun shows / private sales or whatever?  I get that it would have been a roadblock or stop the sale in a licensed transaction through a physical, reputable store, but wonder about the other (supposedly legal albeit non traditional) avenues.