Oh Germany.... You're doing it wrong

[Benton]

(06-12-2016, 10:15 AM)bfine32 Wrote: Fallacy: Two Wrongs Make a Right

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Description of Two Wrongs Make a Right
Two Wrongs Make a Right is a fallacy in which a person "justifies" an action against a person by asserting that the person would do the same thing to him/her, when the action is not necessary to prevent B from doing X to A. This fallacy has the following pattern of "reasoning":

1. It is claimed that person B would do X to person A.
2. It is acceptable for person A to do X to person B (when A's doing X to B is not necessary to prevent B from doing X to A).
   

This sort of "reasoning" is fallacious because an action that is wrong is wrong even if another person would also do it.
It should be noted that it can be the case that it is not wrong for A to do X to B if X is done to prevent B from doing X to A or if X is done in justified retribution. For example, if Sally is running in the park and Biff tries to attack her, Sally would eb jsutified in attacking Biff to defend herself. As another example, if country A is planning to invade country B in order to enslave the people, then country B would be justified in launching a pre-emptive strike to prevent the invasion.
Examples of Two Wrongs Make a Right

1. Bill has borrowed Jane's expensive pen, but found he didn't return it. He tell's himself that it is okay to keep it, since she would have taken his.
2. Jane: "Did you hear about those terrorists killing those poor people? That sort of killing is just wrong." 
   Sue: "Those terrorists are justified. After all, their land was taken from them. It is morally right for them to do what they do." 
   Jane: "Even when they blow up busloads of children?" 
   Sue: "Yes."
3. After leaving a store, Jill notices that she has underpaid by $10. She decides not to return the money to the store because if she had overpaid, they would not have returned the money.
4. Jill is horrified by the way the state uses capital punishment. Bill says that capital punishment is fine, since those the state kill don't have any qualms about killing others.
   
   

Here's the thing: Who gets married in Syria or Germany or Canada isn't my concern. I do not care. That anyone in America does is a shame.

But honestly I don't think most people do. I think most people complaining about the same thing that happens here are just terrified of muslims. You and I have both been on the boards for years. Do you recall the last thread vilifying someone marrying a teenager? I can't.

[StLucieBengal]

(06-12-2016, 12:21 PM)Benton Wrote: Deport people from Georgia? Just moving everyone out of Atlanta will cost billions. And what about Arkansas or Mississippi? And aren't those states in the west?

Oh my heavens, if little rock has fallen, then nowhere is safe.

Well thankfully for them they have citiZenship already.  They can be disgusting.    

Why should any western country let these people in when it's obvious they play fast and loose with western values.    

But like always .... White people bad ... Brown people good .... No matter how many children they rape.  

Adults who rape children are animals.   Why would any western nation allow these animals into their country?     Send them back.    And before you bring up your white couple again.    I think they shoild be jailed since we can't send them anywhere.   

[GMDino]

(06-12-2016, 12:25 PM)Benton Wrote: Here's the thing: Who gets married in Syria or Germany or Canada isn't my concern. I do not care. That anyone in America does is a shame.

But honestly I don't think most people do. I think most people complaining about the same thing that happens here are just terrified of muslims. You and I have both been on the boards for years. Do you recall the last thread vilifying someone marrying a teenager? I can't.

Well if it is brought up that it happens here it gets brushed off as someone trying to make it seem like it is right vs  it really making is seem like we should care more about our own house first.

[GMDino]

(06-12-2016, 12:30 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: Well thankfully for them they have citiZenship already.  They can be disgusting.    

Why should any western country let these people in when it's obvious they play fast and loose with western values.    

But like always .... White people bad ... Brown people good .... No matter how many children they rape.  

Adults who rape children are animals.   Why would any western nation allow these animals into their country?     Send them back.    And before you bring up your white couple again.    I think they shoild be jailed since we can't send them anywhere.   

All of them play fast and loose?

Why can't people be good and people be bad?  No matter what color they are?

And did the couple break the law?

I'll await your facts opinions.

[*bfine32*]

(06-12-2016, 12:25 PM)Benton Wrote: Here's the thing: Who gets married in Syria or Germany or Canada isn't my concern. I do not care. That anyone in America does is a shame.

But honestly I don't think most people do. I think most people complaining about the same thing that happens here are just terrified of muslims. You and I have both been on the boards for years. Do you recall the last thread vilifying someone marrying a teenager? I can't.

Levi Johnston.

I see nothing wrong with someone concerned that increased immigration from a particular culture may have adverse effects on our society; pointing to incidents where it is currently happening.

If I don't care about a subject I usually don't post on it. 

[StLucieBengal]

(06-12-2016, 12:25 PM)Benton Wrote: Here's the thing: Who gets married in Syria or Germany or Canada isn't my concern. I do not care. That anyone in America does is a shame.

But honestly I don't think most people do. I think most people complaining about the same thing that happens here are just terrified of muslims. You and I have both been on the boards for years. Do you recall the last thread vilifying someone marrying a teenager? I can't.

It always come down to this so called fear of Muslims.....  Maybe it's a fear of allowing a culture of people in who think it's ok to rape children, marry children, physically and mentally abuse women, mutilate genitals, and oppress women to the point they need to dress like a ninja. 

Sorry they can't come in until they learn to respect values that we hold dear as a culture.   None of the above is permitted.    

[GMDino]

(06-12-2016, 12:36 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: It always come down to this so called fear of Muslims.....  Maybe it's a fear of allowing a culture of people in who think it's ok to rape children, marry children, physically and mentally abuse women, mutilate genitals, and oppress women to the point they need to dress like a ninja. 

Sorry they can't come in until they learn to respect values that we hold dear as a culture.   None of the above is permitted.    

Christians?

[StLucieBengal]

(06-12-2016, 12:36 PM)GMDino Wrote: Mormons?

What about them?

[Rotobeast]

(06-12-2016, 12:21 PM)Benton Wrote: Deport people from Georgia? Just moving everyone out of Atlanta will cost billions. And what about Arkansas or Mississippi? And aren't those states in the west?

Oh my heavens, if little rock has fallen, then nowhere is safe.

I have a friend that is related to Sherman.
Maybe we can get something rolling.

[Millhouse]

(06-11-2016, 10:42 PM)GMDino Wrote: If only we could enforce just one culture....

If it is a culture within our modern western democracies that is currently striving for civil liberties for all? Yes. Other cultures that dont can gtfo and go back to their sandpits or jungles or wherever to relish in their 2nd and 3rd world status and keep to themselves. 

[GMDino]

(06-12-2016, 12:46 PM)Millhouse Wrote: If it is a culture within our modern western democracies that is currently striving for civil liberties for all? Yes. Other cultures that dont can gtfo and go back to their sandpits or jungles or wherever to relish in their 2nd and 3rd world status and keep to themselves. 

France?

[Millhouse]

(06-12-2016, 02:37 PM)GMDino Wrote: France?

What about France? 

[Benton]

(06-12-2016, 12:30 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: Well thankfully for them they have citiZenship already.  They can be disgusting.    

Why should any western country let these people in when it's obvious they play fast and loose with western values.    

But like always .... White people bad ... Brown people good .... No matter how many children they rape.  

Adults who rape children are animals.   Why would any western nation allow these animals into their country?     Send them back.    And before you bring up your white couple again.    I think they shoild be jailed since we can't send them anywhere.   

Western values like Georgians'?



Sound more like a case of white people good, brown people bad... Even when they act the same.

[Benton]

(06-12-2016, 12:36 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: It always come down to this so called fear of Muslims.....  Maybe it's a fear of allowing a culture of people in who think it's ok to rape children, marry children, physically and mentally abuse women, mutilate genitals, and oppress women to the point they need to dress like a ninja. 

Sorry they can't come in until they learn to respect values that we hold dear as a culture.   None of the above is permitted.    

In one form or another, you just described a large portion of Americans. Whats your point? That they'll make it more Americaner?

[*bfine32*]

(06-12-2016, 03:19 PM)Benton Wrote: Western values like Georgians'?



Sound more like a case of white people good, brown people bad... Even when they act the same.

Isn't the lady in Georgia facing 3 criminal charges?

Trying to compare our approach to these types of relationships to the Muslim approach is like comparing hormone therapy for a chilld to going to the Dentist for a fluoride treatment. 

[GMDino]

(06-12-2016, 02:49 PM)Millhouse Wrote: What about France? 

I'm trying to figure out which country you are talking about because it certainly isn't america.

[Benton]

(06-12-2016, 03:25 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Isn't the lady in Georgia facing 3 criminal charges?

Trying to compare our approach to these types of relationships to the Muslim approach is like comparing hormone therapy for a chilld to going to the Dentist for a fluoride treatment. 

She was. They got married, no more charges. In Georgia two people of any age can get married. Cuts down on out of wedlock babies.

And its not limited to that. I'm just not posting a dozen links from my phone. The hope is that posting one will inspire the uninformed to do some research.

[*bfine32*]

(06-12-2016, 03:41 PM)Benton Wrote: She was. They got married, no more charges. In Georgia two people of any age can get married. Cuts down on out of wedlock babies.

And its not limited to that. I'm just not posting a dozen links from my phone. The hope is that posting one will inspire the uninformed to do some research.

Oh I missed the part where the charges were dropped.

As I said comparing our stance on such relationship to the Muslim's approach speaks volumes about the outlook of the person doing

EDIT: Damn, I just saw that article is 11 years old. Let me get on that research.

[Millhouse]

(06-12-2016, 03:29 PM)GMDino Wrote: I'm trying to figure out which country you are talking about because it certainly isn't america.

How so, because in the last 50 years we have made a ton of progress in civil liberties for everyone from different skin color to gays & lesbians. And we are still striving to do so. Striving was the key word. We are light years ahead of countries out there that incorporate Sharia Law as actual laws, or any religious law as actual law. And we will always be until they abolish that archaic crap and catch up to the rest of the first world.

[GMDino]

(06-12-2016, 03:53 PM)Millhouse Wrote: How so, because in the last 50 years we have made a ton of progress in civil liberties for everyone from different skin color to gays & lesbians. And we are still striving to do so. Striving was the key word. We are light years ahead of countries out there that incorporate Sharia Law as actual laws, or any religious law as actual law. And we will always be until they abolish that archaic crap and catch up to the rest of the first world.

No doubt we've made strides.  But the fact that we are in the 21st century and still had to have a court case decide if gays could marry and still have elected officials who think gays get killed because they have angered god tells me aren't that far ahead of a lot of places.