Pro-Choice People: Babies Feel Excruciating Pain During Abortions

[*bfine32*]

(12-20-2018, 08:29 AM)GMDino Wrote: Why?  You are then saying it is okay to kill a living being because of the woman.  What if the father agrees to raise the child by himself? 

When you (universal you) leave the door open for exceptions you (universal you) are no longer standing on the high moral ground of all life is sacred. 

Same as if you support the death penalty.

All life is sacred or it isn't.  

That's not a shot at you per se (because I agree there must be exceptions if it is made illegal again...I just don't think it should be illegal)...it's the fact that a lot of people wanted to deny the choice from women but "allow" them to have the procedure if it meets other people's parameters.  (Which ignores that there are already parameters set up for suck things.)  And then in the next breath say it's "not about controlling a woman's body".

Any time the state tells you what you can and cannot do with your own body it is controlling your body.  From abortion to euthanasia to prostitution.  

(12-20-2018, 02:34 PM)jj22 Wrote: Then you're pro choice.

It is because I realize we live in a secular world. In the case of assault the woman was taken against her will. In the cases of danger to the host her life is in danger.

Everyone says her body, her choice. To me this only holds water if a woman can get pregnant on her own. Outside of that she's opened her body freely to others.

[GMDino]

(12-20-2018, 02:41 PM)bfine32 Wrote: It is because I realize we live in a secular world. In the case of assault the woman was taken against her will. In the cases of danger to the host her life is in danger.

Everyone says her body, her choice. To me this only holds water if a woman can get pregnant on her own. Outside of that she's opened her body freely to others.

You're pro choice...as long as you get to decide when the choice is made. 

[*Nately120*]

(12-20-2018, 02:41 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Everyone says her body, her choice. To me this only holds water if a woman can get pregnant on her own. Outside of that she's opened her body freely to others.

I spose....or maybe the guy discarded his semen in someone else's body.  Intriguing...if I toss an apple core onto your property and a tree grows do you owe me 50% of the apples that grow?

[Mike M (the other one)]

I have no idea why some people on here try to paint others in a bad light just cause their opinions aren't the same.

To me, I am against abortion. Except when there is a crime involved or the danger to the mother/child is very life threatening.

Many in favor of abortion try to use the scientific "clump of cells" or what ever your case may be. It's all part of the cycle of a human being.

But in order to appease both sides, I would legally allow abortions only in the first trimester. After that, it needs to be proven that it's life threatening.

Now what I'm really wondering and waiting on to see if it changes, is when they finally figure out how to tell based on DNA if a person is LGBT or not. Once that's done, people will be testing their babies and possibly aborting the ones that test positive for the LGBT Group. imagine the uproar from the LGBT group or maybe not, who knows, but that I think that's going to play a role in the future if they can figure out it.

[*michaelsean*]

(12-20-2018, 02:31 PM)jj22 Wrote: Thanks to Democrats.

Unless you are trying to sell board members that Republicans are the ones behind "entitlement" programs? Tough sell given the facts out there and available.

If that makes you feel better then sure.  Can't figure out why they don't get rid of all those programs when they have both houses and the presidency but i'm sure there's a good explanation.  

[*michaelsean*]

(12-20-2018, 03:02 PM)GMDino Wrote:

You're pro choice...as long as you get to decide when the choice is made. 

He never said he was pro choice, someone else did.  He stated exactly what he thinks, but it doesn't fit in a particular box and leads to confusion for some.  

[*bfine32*]

(12-20-2018, 03:02 PM)GMDino Wrote:

You're pro choice...as long as you get to decide when the choice is made. 

Nope, the male and female both made the choice to participate in an activity that could lead to the creation of life. No one made that decision for her or if they did (rape) then she should be able to choose or if she can get pregnant by herself.

[*bfine32*]

(12-20-2018, 03:02 PM)Nately120 Wrote: I spose....or maybe the guy discarded his semen in someone else's body.  Intriguing...if I toss an apple core onto your property and a tree grows do you owe me 50% of the apples that grow?

If I invited you to place the core there then perhaps you do. If you did it without my consent; you have no say in the matter.

Do you see it now?

[GMDino]

(12-20-2018, 03:48 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Nope, the male and female both made the choice to participate in an activity that could lead to the creation of life. No one made that decision for her or if they did (rape) then she should be able to choose or if she can get pregnant by herself.

Nope.  You're ok with the woman having the choice within your own specific conditions.  As long as you can decide when she can choose.

They used protection?  Pffft.  Too bad for your luck!  You chose to have sex and sex is to make new life not for fun! 

Plus I dunno if Id leave that decision up to the GOP who don't like all that sciencey stuff though.  I mean who's to say if it's REALLY life threatening?!?!  There could be a miracle if we all just pray hard enough.  Right?

[*michaelsean*]

(12-20-2018, 04:50 PM)GMDino Wrote: Nope.  You're ok with the woman having the choice within your own specific conditions. As long as you can decide when she can choose.

They used protection?  Pffft.  Too bad for your luck!  You chose to have sex and sex is to make new life not for fun! 

Plus I dunno if Id leave that decision up to the GOP who don't like all that sciencey stuff though.  I mean who's to say if it's REALLY life threatening?!?!  There could be a miracle if we all just pray hard enough.  Right?

Seems we already do that.

[*bfine32*]

(12-20-2018, 04:50 PM)GMDino Wrote: Nope.  You're ok with the woman having the choice within your own specific conditions.  As long as you can decide when she can choose.

They used protection?  Pffft.  Too bad for your luck!  You chose to have sex and sex is to make new life not for fun! 

Plus I dunno if Id leave that decision up to the GOP who don't like all that sciencey stuff though.  I mean who's to say if it's REALLY life threatening?!?!  There could be a miracle if we all just pray hard enough.  Right?

Once the other person (strangely enough you very often) tells me what I am saying that's when I know I am no longer necessary in the discussion. Enjoy telling someone else what they are saying.

[CKwi88]

Want less abortions?

Have more liberal laws and increase education and availability of contraceptives to reduce the amount of unwanted pregnancies.

Abolish the bullshit of "abstinence-only" sexual education and have comprehensive sexual education for our young men and women in school to teach them how to make responsible decisions for their sexual and mental health as potentially sexually active young adults.

Have universal healthcare and fund programs and organizations that provide prenatal and postnatal care to low-income mothers and fathers, or hell, of any financial means.

Have stricter child support laws that don't allow dads to rack up tens of thousands of dollars in child support arrearages, and have child support payments start during pregnancy.

Or...you know...limit access to all of the above while prohibiting abortions based on subjective personal views and turn a blind eye to the unsafe back alley abortions that won't show up on the stat sheets.

[jj22]

(12-20-2018, 03:40 PM)michaelsean Wrote: If that makes you feel better then sure.  Can't figure out why they don't get rid of all those programs when they have both houses and the presidency but i'm sure there's a good explanation.  

I take that as a yes, but no one is buying it.

You can say the same thing about the Wall. Why haven't they passed that. Does that mean Republicans don't care about immigration?

[*michaelsean*]

(12-20-2018, 07:07 PM)jj22 Wrote: I take that as a yes, but no one is buying it.

You can say the same thing about the Wall. Why haven't they passed that. Does that mean Republicans don't care about immigration?

You can take it like you want, but until you show me some evidence that Republicans have tried to abolish the safety nets for children I’m going to believe you make things up that sound right to you. I mean they’ve had ample opportunity to just not fund them. And yet they haven’t. Now I do know Clinton who promised to change welfare as we know it when he ran for office was involved in the largest welfare reform ever but he was a Democrat I think. Libertarians are against welfare. Maybe you were thinking of them.

But if you really believe that Republicans wish to get rid of the programs that assist mothers and their children, I mean really believe that, then there’s really not much I’m going to be able to do to convince you otherwise. But never fear, I still believe you are a right down the middle guy.

[fredtoast]

(12-20-2018, 03:48 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Nope, the male and female both made the choice to participate in an activity that could lead to the creation of life. No one made that decision for her or if they did (rape) then she should be able to choose or if she can get pregnant by herself.

They both made the decision knowing full well that it was impossible for the man to get pregnant.

You cant give the man power over the womans body.

It is interesting that you are no longer anti abortion. You are now only anti abortion when the man wants the baby.

[BFritz21]

(12-21-2018, 01:46 AM)fredtoast Wrote: They both made the decision knowing full well that it was impossible for the man to get pregnant.

You cant give the man power over the womans body.

[fredtoast]

(12-21-2018, 01:54 AM)BFritz21 Wrote:

For the same reason it is vandalism whem someone destroys your property but not when you do it yourself.

[BFritz21]

(12-21-2018, 02:06 AM)fredtoast Wrote: For the same reason it is vandalism whem someone destroys your property but not when you do it yourself.

So you think an unborn child growing in a woman's stomach has the same value as, say, her pair of shoes?

Wow.

Just when you think you've heard it all.........................

[fredtoast]

(12-21-2018, 02:10 AM)BFritz21 Wrote: So you think an unborn child growing in a woman's stomach has the same value as, say, her pair of shoes?

Wow.

Just when you think you've heard it all.........................

No. I believe that a fetus is not entitled to individual rights when it can not survive seperate from another host individual.

[BFritz21]

(12-21-2018, 02:15 AM)fredtoast Wrote: No. I believe that a fetus is not entitled to individual rights when it can not survive seperate from another host individual.

I could not breathe on my own for a few weeks.  Was I not entitled to individual rights?