Texas Governor Is Pissed At Biden's Border Policies

[Belsnickel]

(04-03-2021, 07:39 PM)masonbengals fan Wrote: What are we arguing. Our southern border is currently a mess. We all agree. Our disagreement lies in the fact some people see it as the conservative media's fault for sensationalizing it where in I say the people in charge should hold the blame. The media holds the blame for a lot of things in this country but they don't make policy changes. Politicians do. Biden is the boss. The big guy. The buck stops with him. He can & should implement the changes needed whatever they may be to fix it. I wish him success. You can call it an open border or not I don't care what you call it. Whatever the term used it's a freaking mess.

Here's the deal, though. Trying to claim that Biden has implemented open border policies is a lie. The right wing media and politicians have been using this talking point for years in an attempt at fear mongering. If we want to have a legitimate conversation about the border issues, drop the term. Acknowledge the actual policy changes. Acknowledge that the lie from right-wing media has made it throughout Latin America and is what is fueling such a push of immigrants to our border right now. They think it is open because that is what right-wing media is telling them. That is not a Biden administration policy and he doesn't get blame for that. He does get blame for the over crowded centers of unaccompanied minors. He gets blame for anything his policy choices cause. I am only saying that if it isn't a result of his policy choices then he doesn't get blame. Being POTUS doesn't mean you shoulder the failures of others.

(04-03-2021, 08:16 PM)masonbengals fan Wrote: https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/opinion/op-eds/biden-stands-down-at-the-border

This pretty much sums it up. Looks to me like terminating the remain in Mexico policy was the major factor along with the pause on deportations.

I don't think the media made those changes.

Still not an open border policy, but I know that's not what you want to hear. The push in immigrants coming up happened before that. Why? Because the media in Latin America told them it was an open border. There are articles that have been shared on this forum talking about the false promises fed to immigrants by the media south of the border and coyotes seeking to profit on the situation. People are absolutely being turned away in droves, but that's not the narrative being told in a rag like the Washington Examiner, which is part of the problem.

Stop reading propaganda.

[*Nately120*]

(04-03-2021, 05:03 PM)BFritz21 Wrote: Yes.

Even Joe Biden?

[NATI BENGALS]

(04-03-2021, 07:12 PM)masonbengals fan Wrote: I'm not even going to bother. Your right, it all Trumps fault. Him, his minions or the right wing media. Anybody other than the people currently in charge and those who voted for them.

So Biden’s response: “You cannot let people who are sick, no matter where they come from, no matter what their status, go uncovered,” former Vice President Joe Biden said.

You disagree and think we need to just let the sick and needy die and or just live in pain and agony? Sweeeet. Usually “conservatives” try to act all christiany. I guess you are a every man for himself, kill or be killed, idgaf about common decency or morals or doing the right thing. Seems like a lot of “conservatives” who used to pretend to be religious are like that these days.

[BigPapaKain]

(04-03-2021, 03:03 PM)BFritz21 Wrote: So all of the photos and videos of the people in the cages Biden built are fake?

What are they saying is going on?

I'd answer you, but since it'll go against your preconceived notions you'll only read a third of what I say and ignore the rest. So why bother.

[BFritz21]

(04-03-2021, 06:04 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: I wasn't referring to his claims, necessarily. I don't know his claims because I'm not watching anything from Fox News, especially from Hannity.


You know how you and others on the right have been saying that the left wanted open borders? How you've been saying it for years because the GOP propaganda machine used that messaging to scare you and your fellow voters into voting against Democrats so the brown people won't get you? Seriously, that's what this messaging is rooted in. Anyway, because that messaging has been so pervasive, it's the messaging that people see in Central and South America. Democratic policies aren't for open borders and they never have been, but because the GOP has spread this misinformation for years it is what not only the Republican voters think, but it is the perception of people living in other countries that want to come here, thus making the border crisis even worse. Seriously, there have been policies that raised the refugee numbers and got rid of some of the restrictions on visas that the Trump administration put in place, but there is in no way an "open border."

This might be the greatest post that I've ever seen in the politics forum!  And it's the typical Democrat ideology of it's always someone else's fault!

You're blaming this on Republicans?!  Seriously?!  Is this a real post?!

[BFritz21]

(04-04-2021, 01:14 AM)BigPapaKain Wrote: I'd answer you, but since it'll go against your preconceived notions you'll only read a third of what I say and ignore the rest. So why bother.

Exactly.  You can't answer so you just attack me.

Do you know what ad hominem is?

[Tiger Teeth]

(04-03-2021, 03:03 PM)BFritz21 Wrote: About things happening in their states that none of us are near?  Absolutely.  

So all of the photos and videos of the people in the cages Biden built are fake?

What are they saying is going on?

What is WHO saying?  It seems the only credible source for you would be FOX News.  So why don't you tell ALL of us why we're wrong and you are, pardon me, way right.

[Belsnickel]

(04-04-2021, 02:35 AM)BFritz21 Wrote: This might be the greatest post that I've ever seen in the politics forum!  And it's the typical Democrat ideology of it's always someone else's fault!

You're blaming this on Republicans?!  Seriously?!  Is this a real post?!

Absolutely it is real, unlike the open border policies that the right has been claiming Democrats have been pushing. You're a part of the problem. When you and others spread lies it has adverse effects like this.

[masonbengals fan]

(04-03-2021, 08:31 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: Here's the deal, though. Trying to claim that Biden has implemented open border policies is a lie. The right wing media and politicians have been using this talking point for years in an attempt at fear mongering. If we want to have a legitimate conversation about the border issues, drop the term. Acknowledge the actual policy changes. Acknowledge that the lie from right-wing media has made it throughout Latin America and is what is fueling such a push of immigrants to our border right now. They think it is open because that is what right-wing media is telling them. That is not a Biden administration policy and he doesn't get blame for that. He does get blame for the over crowded centers of unaccompanied minors. He gets blame for anything his policy choices cause. I am only saying that if it isn't a result of his policy choices then he doesn't get blame. Being POTUS doesn't mean you shoulder the failures of others.


Still not an open border policy, but I know that's not what you want to hear. The push in immigrants coming up happened before that. Why? Because the media in Latin America told them it was an open border. There are articles that have been shared on this forum talking about the false promises fed to immigrants by the media south of the border and coyotes seeking to profit on the situation. People are absolutely being turned away in droves, but that's not the narrative being told in a rag like the Washington Examiner, which is part of the problem.

Stop reading propaganda.

 I can't find where I've ever used that term in the discussion. So you must have me confused with someone else. You are the only poster who has repeatedly used that term in this thread & I refuse to post in the Biden/Hitler thread.

 I pointed out actual policy changes in that Examiner article. I realize it's an opinion piece but are those not real policy changes. 

 Who made those policy changes?

 (If you can point me towards some unbiased media these days I'd be happy to start reading it. Because there's very little out there & I'm certainly tired of wading thru the bull from both sides) 

 You seem to be saying that the media's words are what matter. I'm saying Joe & his party's words matter even more.

But only one group has the power to make changes.

[masonbengals fan]

(04-03-2021, 11:18 PM)NATI BENGALS Wrote: So Biden’s response: “You cannot let people who are sick, no matter where they come from, no matter what their status, go uncovered,” former Vice President Joe Biden said.

You disagree and think we need to just let the sick and needy die and or just live in pain and agony?  Sweeeet. Usually “conservatives” try to act all christiany. I guess you are a every man for himself,  kill or be killed,  idgaf about common decency or morals or doing the right thing.  Seems like a lot of “conservatives” who used to pretend to be religious are like that these days.

I had a reply to this all typed out & then realized why bother.  

I wouldn't consider myself a hard right conservative but maybe you do.

But I do honestly try & will continue to try and live as a Christian. But I usually/often fail in that regard. Just got to keep trying.

[NATI BENGALS]

(04-04-2021, 09:09 AM)masonbengals fan Wrote: I had a reply to this all typed out & then realized why bother.  

I wouldn't consider myself a hard right conservative but maybe you do.

But I do honestly try & will continue to try and live as a Christian. But I usually/often fail in that regard. Just got to keep trying.

I would have rather heard you let it rip

Because that's really one of the things I can't comprehend.

I'm agnostic. But I care about my fellow creatures, especially humans. The "religious", generally anti abortion crowd, has a problem with helping people at the border who come to America often seeking help and/or a better life. Why even act like you care about life when you won't even help the ones knocking down your front door looking for a good life?

[BigPapaKain]

(04-04-2021, 02:38 AM)BFritz21 Wrote: Exactly.  You can't answer so you just attack me.

Do you know what ad hominem is?

An observation made from previous interactions and your own admissions hardly counts as an attack, but if having your own tendencies thrown back at you comes off as an attack, you might want to rethink how you interact with people.

[GMDino]

(04-04-2021, 02:38 AM)BFritz21 Wrote: Exactly.  You can't answer so you just attack me.

Do you know what ad hominem is?

Is that something republicans are afraid will be in the bathroom with them?

[masonbengals fan]

(04-04-2021, 10:15 AM)NATI BENGALS Wrote: I would have rather heard you let it rip

Because that's really one of the things I can't comprehend.

I'm agnostic. But I care about my fellow creatures, especially humans. The "religious", generally anti abortion crowd, has a problem with helping people at the border who come to America often seeking help and/or a better life. Why even act like you care about life when you won't even help the ones knocking down your front door looking for a good life?

Of course I care about other people especially those kids. I'm not heartless. I don't fault anyone trying to get here. I've been to some of these countries. I've seen the poverty.  Luxury hotels in beautiful places and down the road people living in straw huts & filth. It's not a pretty sight.

But where do you draw the line at if not at our border. 

We are the most inviting country in the world as far as immigration & it's something we should all be proud of. 

Are you for unlimited access ? If not where is that line drawn ? 

[NATI BENGALS]

(04-04-2021, 11:00 AM)masonbengals fan Wrote: Of course I care about other people especially those kids. I'm not heartless. I don't fault anyone trying to get here. I've been to some of these countries. I've seen the poverty.  Luxury hotels in beautiful places and down the road people living in straw huts & filth. It's not a pretty sight.

But where do you draw the line at if not at our border. 

We are the most inviting country in the world as far as immigration & it's something we should all be proud of. 

Are you for unlimited access ? If not where is that line drawn ? 

Then what is your problem with Biden's stance on this?

Do you think unaccompanied minors in mass numbers would have better living conditions in mexico?

No I'm not for unlimited access. But if you want to come the right way and you are not a criminal there should be a process to go through to get that done. If you are desperate enough to flee here and show up on our door step, we will have to talk but we should be able to help, if you are a child getting dropped over a wall, we will help.

[Dill]

(04-03-2021, 07:39 PM)masonbengals fan Wrote: What are we arguing. Our southern border is currently a mess. We all agree. Our disagreement lies in the fact some people see it as the conservative media's fault for sensationalizing it where in I say the people in charge should hold the blame. The media holds the blame for a lot of things in this country but they don't make policy changes. Politicians do. Biden is the boss. The big guy. The buck stops with him. He can & should implement the changes needed whatever they may be to fix it. I wish him success. You can call it an open border or not I don't care what you call it. Whatever the term used it's a freaking mess.

No one blames "the conservative media" for drawing people to our border.

But I and others do blame them for repeatedly claiming we have an open border when we don't--while stoking fears about disease-ridden immigrants--and they can count on much of their audience not to sort that out. 

So right wing media is not merely "sensationalizing" troubles at the border. It is actively disseminating disinformation about border policy/issues. 

And that disinformation has an effect on the policy process as the misinformed vote in mass numbers, and tend to remain in the Fox/OANN/NEWSMAX loop where disinformation won't be challenged. 

You understand that even if Biden is "in charge and should hold the blame," Republican opposition in the Senate can prevent him implementing the "changes needed wherever"?  And hope the blame sticks to him? 

[masonbengals fan]

(04-04-2021, 11:59 AM)NATI BENGALS Wrote: Then what is your problem with Biden's stance on this?

Do you think unaccompanied minors in mass numbers would have better living conditions in mexico?

My gripe is Biden brought this onto us by his constant pandering. Just one example below. 

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2021/03/24/_biden_called_for_the_border_surge_and_now_he_owns_it_145471.html

And as a party the rest of the candidates were even worse. Remember Kamala ? The one supposedly in charge now. What a joke. 

I don't remember a mass of unaccompanied minors until just recently. Do you? 

His carelessness cloaked in compassion has exacerbated this whole mess. 

We couldn't agree more on coming here the right way.

[Belsnickel]

(04-04-2021, 12:00 PM)Dill Wrote: No one blames "the conservative media" for drawing people to our border.

I do. The lies perpetuated by the right-wing media have spread throughout Latin America and that message of an "open border" has led to many people coming to the southern border of our country thinking that they will be let in.

[masonbengals fan]

(04-04-2021, 12:00 PM)Dill Wrote: No one blames "the conservative media" for drawing people to our border.

But I and others do blame them for repeatedly claiming we have an open border when we don't--while stoking fears about disease-ridden immigrants--and they can count on much of their audience not to sort that out. 

So right wing media is not merely "sensationalizing" troubles at the border. It is actively disseminating disinformation about border policy/issues. 

And that disinformation has an effect on the policy process as the misinformed vote in mass numbers, and tend to remain in the Fox/OANN/NEWSMAX loop where disinformation won't be challenged. 

You understand that even if Biden is "in charge and should hold the blame," Republican opposition in the Senate can prevent him implementing the "changes needed wherever"?  And hope the blame sticks to him? 

 You apparently didn't read thru the comments posted in earlier in this thread about conservative media drawing immigrants here. 

 Right & Left wing media both are guilty of disinformation. No side has a monopoly on that. 

 I have no doubt Republicans will do/say whatever they can to get back in power just like the current bunch in control. 

[masonbengals fan]

(04-04-2021, 12:24 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: I do. The lies perpetuated by the right-wing media have spread throughout Latin America and that message of an "open border" has led to many people coming to the southern border of our country thinking that they will be let in.

Who deserves the most blame though. Opposition media or our President who stood on stage and said.
 
 "I would in fact make sure that there is, that we immediately surge to the border -- all those people are seeking asylum. They deserve to be heard," Biden said. "That's who we are. We're a nation that says, 'If you want to flee and you're fleeing oppression, you should come.'"