Trump Loyalists

[oncemoreuntothejimbreech]

https://www.yahoo.com/news/trump-loyalists-pay-little-heed-revelations-rocking-dc-163255492.html

Quote:Trump loyalists pay little heed to revelations rocking DC
Associated Press
STEVE PEOPLES, BILL BARROW and THOMAS BEAUMONT 3 hours ago

NEW YORK (AP) — President Donald Trump's loyal backers say they don't know, don't believe or don't care about the explosive revelations that forced the Justice Department to appoint a special counsel to investigate possible collusion between Russia and the Republican campaign.

From the quiet streets of New York's working-class Staten Island to small-town Denison, Iowa, and even smaller Rutledge, Georgia, Trump may be as popular today as when he was elected. Voters are standing with a president who tweeted on Thursday that he is the target of "the single greatest witch hunt of a politician in American history!"


The tumult that began last week with the firing of FBI Director James Comey has consumed Washington, roiling the White House and putting congressional Republicans on the defensive.

Not so in Trump strongholds.

"I tuned it out," said 44-year-old Michele Velardi, a mother of three sons, during a break from her job at a Staten Island hair salon. "I didn't want to be depressed. I don't want to feel that he's not doing what he said, so I just choose to not listen."

A few blocks away, die-hard Trump supporter Joseph Amodeo, 19, incorrectly praised the president for raising New York's minimum wage, something enacted by Democrats in the Legislature. The college student had little understanding of the Trump administration's deepening political struggles, but he offered a stern message to Trump's critics.

"If you're wishing for him to fail, you're basically wishing for the pilot of the plane to crash," Amodeo said. "You just gotta stick by him and hopefully he does things that benefit everyone."

Such support isn't necessarily representative of voters nationwide.

A Quinnipiac University poll showed that 61 percent of those in the United States believe Trump is dishonest. Wall Street soured on the new administration — for a day at least — as the stock market on Wednesday had its worst day of the Trump presidency. And in Washington, some Democrats raised the prospect of impeachment amid reports that Trump asked Comey to end the investigation of Trump's first national security adviser, Michael Flynn.


What Motivates Donald Trump Loyalists

Several months have passed since Donald Trump won the presidential election. Despite early days marked by turmoil, there remains a strong core of Trump supporters. WSJ's Gerald F. Seib examines three concerns these loyalists have: trade deficits, the national debt, and money spent on foreign aid. Photo: AP

Yet there was little evidence of significant cracks among Trump's most passionate supporters.

In Denison, Iowa, 60-year-old Mark Feller said he would support Trump's 2020 re-election without question, despite concerns over what Feller described as chaos in the Oval Office. The furniture dealer doesn't believe reports that the president asked Comey to back off his investigation before firing him.

"If it were true, it would bother me. But I don't think it's true," Feller said.

In a rural area outside Des Moines, Iowa, John Strathman said he would give Trump a passing, albeit unimpressive, grade at the four-month mark in his presidency. He would like see Trump become "more polished at the art of politics." But the 65-year-old retired Defense Department employee's decision on whether to continue supporting Trump has little to do with the Russia scandal riling Washington.

He wants to see Trump follow through on his conservative policy promises.

"If he doesn't govern like a conservative and looks more like a Democrat, then I'll have to re-evaluate," Strathman said.

In Rutledge, Georgia, a town of about 800 people in a county that gave Trump nearly 70 percent of the vote, Doug Foy suggested Trump shouldn't presume the support is unshakable, even if he's not turning his back on the president yet. In particular, Foy, 53, who runs a tree removal service, would be concerned if Trump pressured Comey to drop the investigation.

"I'm not a politician, so I don't know just what they should do," he said. "I don't know if they should pursue impeachment or anything like that."

But his son, 27-year-old Robbie Foy, said he hasn't paid close attention to the news in recent days. He's not backing off his initial reasons for supporting the president. Chief among them: his sustained disdain for Trump's opponent, Democrat Hillary Clinton.

"Trump's not in it for the money. He's got plenty of money," the younger Foy said. Clinton, he added, "was in it for herself."

For many of the Trump faithful, even six months from the 2016 election, their fierce opposition to Clinton remains fresh. Trump isn't perfect, they say, but he's far better than what the alternative would have been.

The attitude was prevalent on the streets of Staten Island, where Trump beat Clinton last fall by nearly 17 percentage points. That's even as Clinton defeated Trump in the state of New York by 22 points.

State Assemblyman Ron Castorina, who represents Staten Island, refers to his community as "Trump Country." He blamed Trump's problems on what he calls irresponsible media coverage that's "damaging the country as a whole."

Trump supporters like him, he says, aren't giving up on their president.

"Not only have I not heard of anyone turning their backs, I've seen people become more in solidarity with the president because they feel he's getting a raw deal," Castorina said.

Indeed, inside Staten Island's Cabinet Plant, store co-owner Paul Lopa, 41, said there's "nothing right now big enough" that could shake his support in Trump.

"I think he's going more and more into the right direction," Lopa said.

Down the street, Andrew Ottrando, a 56-year-old truck driver, said, "The Comey stuff is a joke."

Could anything persuade him to abandon Trump?

"If he gases his own people, yeah I would be against him," Ottrando said, saying afterward that he was only joking.

___

This story has been corrected to reflect that Mark Feller of Denison, Iowa, is a furniture dealer, not a furniture maker.

Interesting

[Mike M (the other one)]

(05-18-2017, 06:03 PM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: https://www.yahoo.com/news/trump-loyalists-pay-little-heed-revelations-rocking-dc-163255492.html


Interesting

Not really.
It's no different than Hillary backers. Each group has their diehards, but notice which group of diehards whines the loudest?

Trump for 2020!!

[oncemoreuntothejimbreech]

(05-18-2017, 06:55 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: Not really.
It's no different than Hillary backers. Each group has their diehards, but notice which group of diehards whines the loudest?

Trump for 2020!!

Interesting.

You're already supporting Trump's re-election without knowing your options?

[GMDino]

(05-18-2017, 06:55 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: Not really.
It's no different than Hillary backers. Each group has their diehards, but notice which group of diehards whines the loudest?

Trump for 2020!!

Notice which group ignores reality and facts and is pretending these things aren't really happening? Or didn't you read the article?

[Mike M (the other one)]

(05-18-2017, 07:05 PM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: Interesting.

You're already supporting Trump's re-election without knowing your options?

Sure. I think he will get the economy kicking and get stuff done and I want to see the wall thru. (I got a bet riding on it hahaha). If the economy is kicking good, then it really won't matter who his opponent is.

(05-18-2017, 07:13 PM)GMDino Wrote: Notice which group ignores reality and facts and is pretending these things aren't really happening? Or didn't you read the article?

Oh yea? Like that Comey obstruction of Justice thing?
If it truly was an Obstruction, then it's Comey's job to report it immediately to the DOJ, he did not. So if it is true, then Comey will be prosecuted as well. Comey is backing himself into a corner where his options go from losing job to losing much more.

He's a weasel and we all know it, so nothing he says really holds much weight anymore, the only ones trying to make it into something is the Lefties in the Media. It's all they got. It's like the Birther thing with Obama, it will be talked about and hashed about for his entire term, but nothing will get done.

Onto the Russia thing, all major politicians have connections with Russia, and other strong countries. It's the nature of the business. A phone call back and forth is not a big deal, what is discussed is, but we never heard what was really discussed so until then, it's just more smoke.

[GMDino]

(05-18-2017, 07:38 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: Sure. I think he will get the economy kicking and get stuff done and I want to see the wall thru. (I got a bet riding on it hahaha). If the economy is kicking good, then it really won't matter who his opponent is.



Oh yea? Like that Comey obstruction of Justice thing?
If it truly was an Obstruction, then it's Comey's job to report it immediately to the DOJ, he did not. So if it is true, then Comey will be prosecuted as well. Comey is backing himself into a corner where his options go from losing job to losing much more.

He's a weasel and we all know it, so nothing he says really holds much weight anymore, the only ones trying to make it into something is the Lefties in the Media. It's all they got. It's like the Birther thing with Obama, it will be talked about and hashed about for his entire term, but nothing will get done.

Onto the Russia thing, all major politicians have connections with Russia, and other strong countries. It's the nature of the business. A phone call back and forth is not a big deal, what is discussed is, but we never heard what was really discussed so until then, it's just more smoke.

The amazing thing is your argument is almost word for word (minus "weasel") from FOX news on XM radio this afternoon.

Almost word for word.

Question though:  Do all major politicians lie and "forget" about their connections with Russia?  

Reality...not your friend apparently.

[oncemoreuntothejimbreech]

(05-18-2017, 07:38 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: Sure. I think he will get the economy kicking and get stuff done and I want to see the wall thru. (I got a bet riding on it hahaha). If the economy is kicking good, then it really won't matter who his opponent is.



Oh yea? Like that Comey obstruction of Justice thing?
If it truly was an Obstruction, then it's Comey's job to report it immediately to the DOJ, he did not. So if it is true, then Comey will be prosecuted as well. Comey is backing himself into a corner where his options go from losing job to losing much more.

He's a weasel and we all know it, so nothing he says really holds much weight anymore, the only ones trying to make it into something is the Lefties in the Media. It's all they got. It's like the Birther thing with Obama, it will be talked about and hashed about for his entire term, but nothing will get done.

Onto the Russia thing, all major politicians have connections with Russia, and other strong countries. It's the nature of the business. A phone call back and forth is not a big deal, what is discussed is, but we never heard what was really discussed so until then, it's just more smoke.

It's been 4 months and you're already supporting his re-election based upon something that hasn't even happened.

Under the right circumstances, I could support Trump's re-election, but I'll cross that bridge when I get there.

[SunsetBengal]

To all the ones giddy lately. What if the Independent Investigator finds no criminal wrongdoing, on Trump's part? Going to accept him then?

[Belsnickel]

(05-18-2017, 08:34 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: To all the ones giddy lately. What if the Independent Investigator finds no criminal wrongdoing, on Trump's part? Going to accept him then?

I don't expect wrongdoing on Trump's part, and I don't want them to find any with his campaign. Eithed would be bad for the country. I will still consider him to be an incompetent POTUS and his decisions to be horrible.

[Matt_Crimson]

(05-18-2017, 08:34 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: To all the ones giddy lately.  What if the Independent Investigator finds no criminal wrongdoing, on Trump's part?  Going to accept him then?

If there's no wrong doing found on Trump's part you can bet that conservatives are not going to let this relentless witch hunt go. Liberals are pretty much hoping at this point that there's something there because if nothing is found this is going to backfire tremendously.

[Aquapod770]

(05-18-2017, 08:34 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: To all the ones giddy lately.  What if the Independent Investigator finds no criminal wrongdoing, on Trump's part?  Going to accept him then?

Nope. It'll get dragged out as long as possible, or "he was payed off by the Russians!!!!#@#!@#!@#!" 


Either way I'd like this crap to get resolved. Doubt it will though. 

[Benton]

(05-18-2017, 07:38 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: Sure. I think he will get the economy kicking and get stuff done and I want to see the wall thru. (I got a bet riding on it hahaha). If the economy is kicking good, then it really won't matter who his opponent is.



Oh yea? Like that Comey obstruction of Justice thing?
If it truly was an Obstruction, then it's Comey's job to report it immediately to the DOJ, he did not. So if it is true, then Comey will be prosecuted as well. Comey is backing himself into a corner where his options go from losing job to losing much more.

He's a weasel and we all know it, so nothing he says really holds much weight anymore, the only ones trying to make it into something is the Lefties in the Media. It's all they got. It's like the Birther thing with Obama, it will be talked about and hashed about for his entire term, but nothing will get done.

Onto the Russia thing, all major politicians have connections with Russia, and other strong countries. It's the nature of the business. A phone call back and forth is not a big deal, what is discussed is, but we never heard what was really discussed so until then, it's just more smoke.

I don't think most politicians have staff members that have openly accepted payments from Russia for work completed.

[Benton]

(05-18-2017, 08:34 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: To all the ones giddy lately. What if the Independent Investigator finds no criminal wrongdoing, on Trump's part? Going to accept him then?

Trumps problems, in my opinion are ethically related, not criminal. I don't think he will receive any criminal charges. Now, an ethics probe would expose quite a bit, but that's not criminal.

[hollodero]

(05-18-2017, 08:34 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: To all the ones giddy lately.  What if the Independent Investigator finds no criminal wrongdoing, on Trump's part?  Going to accept him then?

Given what I believe to know, I think it's highly unlikely Mr. Mueller ends up empty handed. Maybe Trump himself did no wrong, Pence also knew nothing about anything ever, so ok, could be. If that's the outcome, I would consider Trump cleared of that suspicion. I still would think he's completely unfit for high office both intellecually and character-wise, though.

But since you asked, please allow me. What if Mr. Mueller does find criminal wrongdoing on Trump's part. Would you accept that, or would the deep state conspiracies or Hillarys Emails being cooked up yet again. Would you turn away from Trump if he gets prosecuted, or would you keep defending him?

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(05-19-2017, 12:24 AM)hollodero Wrote: Given what I believe to know, I think it's highly unlikely Mr. Mueller ends up empty handed. Maybe Trump himself did no wrong, Pence also knew nothing about anything ever, so ok, could be. If that's the outcome, I would consider Trump cleared of that suspicion. I still would think he's completely unfit for high office both intellecually and character-wise, though.

I'm mortally sick of condemnation by opinion, so in my case, no.

Quote:But since you asked, please allow me. What if Mr. Mueller does find criminal wrongdoing on Trump's part. Would you accept that, or would the deep state conspiracies or Hillarys Emails being cooked up yet again. Would you turn away from Trump if he gets prosecuted, or would you keep defending him?

If there's proof then there's proof.  Maxine Waters caterwauling and Dem finger crossing aren't sufficient.  Neither are anonymous sources. 

[hollodero]

(05-19-2017, 02:05 AM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: If there's proof then there's proof.  Maxine Waters caterwauling and Dem finger crossing aren't sufficient.  Neither are anonymous sources. 

Well, that technically doesn't answer my question, but alright. Sure Democrats' opinions aren't sufficient, no one reasonable says otherwise. I would argue there are a little more indications for possible wrongdoing of at least Trump aides then just dubious sources and wishful thinking, though. Among other things see: Flynn, Michael.

[Dill]

(05-18-2017, 07:38 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: Sure. I think he will get the economy kicking and get stuff done and I want to see the wall thru. (I got a bet riding on it hahaha). If the economy is kicking good, then it really won't matter who his opponent is.

Onto the Russia thing, all major politicians have connections with Russia, and other strong countries. It's the nature of the business. A phone call back and forth is not a big deal, what is discussed is, but we never heard what was really discussed so until then, it's just more smoke.

The economy won't be kicking good. It's not clear Trump can get any legislation passed. If he does, we will find out that tax cuts for the rich do not bring back jobs. And walls do not create them.

All major politicians (and their "teams") do not have repeated contacts with Russian diplomats and spies during an election in which Russia interfered with our election. And then deny those contacts.

Not all American politicians are unable to criticize Russia. Trump is unable.

It is not "smoke" that Trump took the Russian Ambassador and foreign minister into the white house and excluded the American press. We know of the meeting because a TASS journalist slicked his way in to the meeting as well. A coup for the Russian press. And we did hear that Trump told the Russians a secret--one we promised the Israelis we would not tell.  Now we find he was constructing a back channel to Putin AROUND our official channels with their intel precautions. Colossal bad judgment.

ONLY ONE AMERICAN POLITICIAN DENIES THAT RUSSIA INTERFERED WITH THE US ELECTIONS. And that denial obstructs Trump's ability to work with our intel services for our national security. This is unprecedented incompetence. More problems to come there.

Your boy is a Russian asset, played by Putin, whether he knows it or not. 

[Dill]

(05-18-2017, 08:34 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: To all the ones giddy lately.  What if the Independent Investigator finds no criminal wrongdoing, on Trump's part?  Going to accept him then?

Not sure what you mean by "accept him" Sunset.

My complaints about Trump predate the Russian investigation and the Comey firing.

First, he is not knowledgeable enough, not competent enough, and not emotionally mature enough to do the job. The problems he faces now are largely of his own creation. Who told him to tweet that Obama wiretapped him? Who told him to publicly threaten an official he had just fired? He is impulsive, angry and childish. Was it his "business acumen" that told him to  make an unstable, ethically compromised general his National Security Advisor? You cannot name a single president in US history who has floundered like this in his first hundred days.

Second, his character is flawed. Better said, he has a personality disorder. It partly manifest in how he turns all subjects and occasions back to himself, and partly manifest in the bullying, the misogyny. People who support Trump legitimate this behavior. To put this another way, Trump corrupts his supporters, drags down their ethical standards.

Third, and this is minor compared to the others, is his language. The mangled, rambling, incomplete sentences are reminiscent of Palin. The limited vocabulary is always coupled with constant hyperbole--his win was a historic landslide and, as he reminded us in his Liberty commencement address, no president has EVER been persecuted and treated as unjustly as he is now. (See 2 above if your not clear why the guy would be filling commencement speech for students with his own self-pity.)

So even if he is exonerated of criminal wrongdoing--like deliberate collusion with Russia--then no, I am not going to embrace the guy as a fit representative of the United States.  Trump's missteps will continue. This opera is a long ways from over.

[Dill]

(05-18-2017, 08:57 PM)Matt_Crimson Wrote: If there's no wrong doing found on Trump's part you can bet that conservatives are not going to let this relentless witch hunt go. Liberals are pretty much hoping at this point that there's something there because if nothing is found this is going to backfire tremendously.

I don't think so, Matt.

First of all, Flynn is pretty much busted. And many Republican politicians understand that Trump's own actions have brought forth the appointment of a special counsel.  If there are not sufficient grounds for indictment in criminal activity or impeachment, it is at least clear to them that Trump does not know how to manage the Executive.  Nowhere but Fox News will this investigation be called a witch hunt.

Second, there is Trump's fundamental incompetence. The ship is not going to right itself because of a favorable verdict. Over the coming weeks DURING the investigation, new crises will arise from Trump mismanagement. (Foreign policy is a likely area.)  Against all advice he will continue to tweet and fire personnel and mishandle intel and alienate allies--domestic and foreign. (Keep your eyes on the coming trip to the Middle East; Saudi Arabia some new foreign policy goals for our impressionable president, and Trump has a nice speech on Islam ready.)

So over the coming months we will continue to hear talk of impeachment and removal (25th Amendment style) for grounds not yet on the horizon, for massive faux pas Trump has not yet committed or that we have not yet heard about.  As Trump's new blunders soak up all the news space and generate new threads in this forum, his supporters will have little time to crow over his vindication.  By years end some may finally be looking forward to Pence.

[Dill]

(05-19-2017, 12:07 AM)Benton Wrote: I don't think most politicians have staff members that have openly accepted payments from Russia for work completed.

And if elected president, most wouldn't then appoint said staffer to be their NATIONAL SECURITY ADVISER.