Welcome to Londonistan

[Benton]

(05-08-2016, 04:58 AM)StLucieBengal Wrote: People afraid of being called an islamaphobe if they didn't vote for him.   Same reason people flooded to vote for Obama.   

(05-09-2016, 02:19 AM)StLucieBengal Wrote: I was making the connection to voting for Obama because he was black.  It's the token vote, and if they can guilt you into that through fear of being called a racist or such.   

Uh...

You know...

Voting booths don't have windows for a reason.

And you can't just toss "token" out there to imply the racially unearned aspect. There wasn't a "token" vote as if he was elected because we have a quota to fill.

[Rotobeast]

(05-09-2016, 07:13 AM)GMDino Wrote: Or they liked his policies or they didn't like his opponents.

But that wouldn't feed into the racial fear you are trying to push.

To put it another way:  I do not know a single person, not one, who said they voted for Obama just so people wouldn't think they were racist.  However Iknow several who said they would never vote for a "****** for president".

Meanwhile no one has to know who you voted for at all.  Secret ballot and all that.  But they felt bold enough to share their "feelings" on the matter.

I have heard people say, what Lucie described.
But they also added..."But I'm only really voting for the white half".
Oh.....irony...
That's actually a step up in civility, for my area.
I fully expected the derogatory response Dino posted, across the board here.

[StLucieBengal]

(05-09-2016, 10:37 AM)Benton Wrote: Uh...

You know...

Voting booths don't have windows for a reason.

And you can't just toss "token" out there to imply the racially unearned aspect. There wasn't a "token" vote as if he was elected because we have a quota to fill.

Obama campaign just called anyone a racist who challenged them.    Does anyone believe that bill Clinton is a racist?  Because the tide turned in the primary when they labeled him a racist for attacking his positions.    

Obama has ridden his race to win both elections and now gets away with anything because the media doesn't want to be called racist.    

Who wants to be called a racist for not voting for Obama?   And against an old white guy it was easy in the general.   

[Benton]

(05-09-2016, 12:50 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: Obama campaign just called anyone a racist who challenged them.    Does anyone believe that bill Clinton is a racist?  Because the tide turned in the primary when they labeled him a racist for attacking his positions.    

Obama has ridden his race to win both elections and now gets away with anything because the media doesn't want to be called racist.    

Who wants to be called a racist for not voting for Obama?   And against an old white guy it was easy in the general.   

I'm making an assumption here that you didn't vote for Obama. Twice. If that's incorrect, I apologize in advance.

That said, when you walked out of the booth, with a Mitt-sized smile on your face, did anyone... ANYONE... point at you — specifically you — and shout "RACIST!"? Anyone?

I'll tell you what, I voted for Obama once out of two times (one out of three if you count the primaries). Not once did anyone come running up to me screaming "racist." Voting in those two (three if you count the primaries) in one county and covering elections for the AP in another county... not once did anyone call anyone else a racist. Some people bloviated about one candidate or against another, but the only racially tinged thing I heard in all that time was at the polls close to my house when a lady old enough to have been courted by Nixon was waiting in line and turned to a guy about the same age and said "It's time we got that ****** out of the White House."

So, no, I'm not really getting where anyone gets called a racist for not voting WHEN NO ONE SEES YOU VOTE.

[StLucieBengal]

(05-09-2016, 01:00 PM)Benton Wrote: I'm making an assumption here that you didn't vote for Obama. Twice. If that's incorrect, I apologize in advance.

That said, when you walked out of the booth, with a Mitt-sized smile on your face, did anyone... ANYONE... point at you — specifically you — and shout "RACIST!"? Anyone?

I'll tell you what, I voted for Obama once out of two times (one out of three if you count the primaries). Not once did anyone come running up to me screaming "racist." Voting in those two (three if you count the primaries) in one county and covering elections for the AP in another county... not once did anyone call anyone else a racist. Some people bloviated about one candidate or against another, but the only racially tinged thing I heard in all that time was at the polls close to my house when a lady old enough to have been courted by Nixon was waiting in line and turned to a guy about the same age and said "It's time we got that ****** out of the White House."

So, no, I'm not really getting where anyone gets called a racist for not voting WHEN NO ONE SEES YOU VOTE.

I am sure you are shocked to find out that I didn't vote for that joke either time.    And ofc no one is going to rail you out of the booth.   But how many times do people toss out racist when you disagree with anything he does.....   It happens constantly here ....   This is exactly the type of nonsense I am referring.     

The only reason he isn't railed a failure like Carter is because he is black.   If he was white then he would be the biggest modern era presidential failure.   

[Benton]

(05-09-2016, 02:33 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: I am sure you are shocked to find out that I didn't vote for that joke either time.    And ofc no one is going to rail you out of the booth.   But how many times do people toss out racist when you disagree with anything he does.....   It happens constantly here ....   This is exactly the type of nonsense I am referring.     

The only reason he isn't railed a failure like Carter is because he is black.   If he was white then he would be the biggest modern era presidential failure.   

To the bold, agreed. But it's got nothing to do with elections any more than saying we only elect white guys because someone tosses out something racist. It makes no sense.

As far as the last part, the country's improved. I don't like a lot of what he's done, but it's a far cry from a failure.

[fredtoast]

(05-09-2016, 02:33 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote:     

The only reason he isn't railed a failure like Carter is because he is black.   If he was white then he would be the biggest modern era presidential failure.   

I am not going to act like Obama was a great President, but this is a ridiculous statement.

We did nto get into any stupid wars or have our economy collapse.  That doesn't dousn like a great accomplishment, but it puts him in front of a lot of modern era Presidents.

[GMDino]

(05-09-2016, 02:33 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: I am sure you are shocked to find out that I didn't vote for that joke either time.    And ofc no one is going to rail you out of the booth.   But how many times do people toss out racist when you disagree with anything he does.....   It happens constantly here ....   This is exactly the type of nonsense I am referring.     

The only reason he isn't railed a failure like Carter is because he is black.   If he was white then he would be the biggest modern era presidential failure.   

1) That's not racist at all. 


2) That is an opinion...not a fact Luvnit, Lucy.

[StLucieBengal]

(05-09-2016, 03:00 PM)YCfredtoast Wrote: I am not going to act like Obama was a great President, but this is a ridiculous statement.

We did nto get into any stupid wars or have our economy collapse.  That doesn't dousn like a great accomplishment, but it puts him in front of a lot of modern era Presidents.

During the Obama term:  

1. Egypt falls into the hands of the Muslim Brotherhood.  With his blessing.   

2. Libya falls with his blessing 

3. Had a chance to back the moderates in Iran to overthrow their leader.... He stayed quiet and didn't support the rebels.   The one place we could have seen positive change.   

4. He gave Iran the path to nuclear weapons.   

5 doesn't back up Ukraine when they are attacked even though we had an agreement to do so when they got rid of their nukes under Clinton.   

6. Arms isis.   

7. And we are still at war in new countries now.   

Just a few of his greatest hits.    The Middle East is on fire because of his repeated decisions.  

[StLucieBengal]

(05-09-2016, 03:03 PM)GMDino Wrote: 1) That's not racist at all. 


2) That is an opinion...not a fact Luvnit, Lucy.

Hey sorry if the truth bothers you.   He gets a pass because he is the first black president.   But the reality is he is easily one of the worst.   

[StLucieBengal]

(05-09-2016, 02:50 PM)Benton Wrote: To the bold, agreed. But it's got nothing to do with elections any more than saying we only elect white guys because someone tosses out something racist. It makes no sense.

As far as the last part, the country's improved. I don't like a lot of what he's done, but it's a far cry from a failure.

What is better because of Obama policies?   

[GMDino]

(05-09-2016, 05:54 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: Hey sorry if the truth bothers you.   He gets a pass because he is the first black president.   But the reality is he is easily one of the worst.   

In reality that is an opinion...not a fact.

You seem to get those two things messed up...a lot.

The only person giving or taking credit from him due to race is...uh...you.

[fredtoast]

(05-09-2016, 05:53 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: During the Obama term:  

1. Egypt falls into the hands of the Muslim Brotherhood.  With his blessing.   

2. Libya falls with his blessing 

3. Had a chance to back the moderates in Iran to overthrow their leader.... He stayed quiet and didn't support the rebels.   The one place we could have seen positive change.   

4. He gave Iran the path to nuclear weapons.   

5 doesn't back up Ukraine when they are attacked even though we had an agreement to do so when they got rid of their nukes under Clinton.   

6. Arms isis.   

7. And we are still at war in new countries now.   

Just a few of his greatest hits.    The Middle East is on fire because of his repeated decisions.  

Actually Obama will go down in history because he kept us out of all these international conflicts.  Why should we be wasting US tax dollars and lives of our soldiers all over the world?

[fredtoast]

(05-09-2016, 05:56 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: What is better because of Obama policies?   

Peaceful negotiation of Iran arms treaty.

Not wasting millions of dollars enforcing federal anti-marijuana laws. 

Not wasting billions of dollars invading and occupying foreign countries.

[Benton]

(05-09-2016, 05:53 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: During the Obama term:  
 
 

2. Libya falls with his blessing 

 
6. Arms isis.   

7. And we are still at war in new countries now.   

Just a few of his greatest hits.    The Middle East is on fire because of his repeated decisions.  

I get you're a fan of Communist countries, so I can see why #2 bothers you. I still think it's funny that anyone wanting to come off as pro American considers a country rebelling against a dictator as a bad thing.

#6 is grossly incorrect. They started with (mostly and allegedly) Saudi weapons. We've bankrolled the Saudis long before Obama. And their more recent arms come from Russia Syria.
#7 Not really. We're just continually at war with the same vague terror elements we've been at war with.

The rest is great. Seriously. Not because Iran was "on the path to nuclear weapons" or because Egypt fell into the hands of the Muslim brotherhood. No, it was great because for the first time since Nixon took office, we largely took a step back and said "hey world, it's your problems, fix it." We talked to coalitions, we offered intel and indirect support, but we didn't just barge in and start tossing around embargoes and empty threats of war.

We need to stop playing world police. The majority of your list was a step in that direction. So while I fault him on a lot of things, nothing you've mentioned.

(05-09-2016, 05:56 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: What is better because of Obama policies?   

The economy for one, international relations for another. And while I'm not a fan of what came out of healthcare reform, prices are leveling off for the first time in half a century. But, really, just make it about his race and ignore all that other stuff.

[StLucieBengal]

(05-09-2016, 07:22 PM)Benton Wrote: I get you're a fan of Communist countries, so I can see why #2 bothers you. I still think it's funny that anyone wanting to come off as pro American considers a country rebelling against a dictator as a bad thing.

#6 is grossly incorrect. They started with (mostly and allegedly) Saudi weapons. We've bankrolled the Saudis long before Obama. And their more recent arms come from Russia Syria.
#7 Not really. We're just continually at war with the same vague terror elements we've been at war with.

The rest is great. Seriously. Not because Iran was "on the path to nuclear weapons" or because Egypt fell into the hands of the Muslim brotherhood. No, it was great because for the first time since Nixon took office, we largely took a step back and said "hey world, it's your problems, fix it." We talked to coalitions, we offered intel and indirect support, but we didn't just barge in and start tossing around embargoes and empty threats of war.

We need to stop playing world police. The majority of your list was a step in that direction. So while I fault him on a lot of things, nothing you've mentioned.


The economy for one, international relations for another. And while I'm not a fan of what came out of healthcare reform, prices are leveling off for the first time in half a century. But, really, just make it about his race and ignore all that other stuff.

Obama has done everything possible to destroy Sykes-Picot.... Something that kept the region fighting themselves.   I am pro dictators in the Middle East.  These people need someone with a boot on their necks.    It's all they understand.... The French and Brits knew this and that's why they kept them at each other.   Maybe someday they will evolve.    

We were running guns through Libya.   To al Qaeda who ended up becoming isis.   Same in Syria.   This is not just Obama.... But he was at the wheel.   

Not once has he tried to renew the declaration of war.   Now Kerry is talking about borderless wars.....   He maybe allowed under some bs procedure.  But he needs to renew this war.  This isn't 2001.   

I agree with you on world police.  I would withdraw and let them kill each other.  All they want to do is act like animals in that region anyway.   

Domestically healthcare is a failure.   If he wanted to go single payer then he should have.... The proble was he couldn't even get his own party to go along.....   I don't want single payer but would have actually respected him for pushing to get it done.   Problem was he was too busy telling GOP and moderate democrats that elections have consequences.    He has been so divisive.

[Benton]

(05-09-2016, 07:51 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: Obama has done everything possible to destroy Sykes-Picot.... Something that kept the region fighting themselves.   I am pro dictators in the Middle East.  These people need someone with a boot on their necks.    It's all they understand.... The French and Brits knew this and that's why they kept them at each other.   Maybe someday they will evolve.    

We were running guns through Libya.   To al Qaeda who ended up becoming isis.   Same in Syria.   This is not just Obama.... But he was at the wheel.   

Not once has he tried to renew the declaration of war.   Now Kerry is talking about borderless wars.....   He maybe allowed under some bs procedure.  But he needs to renew this war.  This isn't 2001.   

I agree with you on world police.  I would withdraw and let them kill each other.  All they want to do is act like animals in that region anyway.   

Domestically healthcare is a failure.   If he wanted to go single payer then he should have.... The proble was he couldn't even get his own party to go along.....   I don't want single payer but would have actually respected him for pushing to get it done.   Problem was he was too busy telling GOP and moderate democrats that elections have consequences.    He has been so divisive.

To the bold, then you should be cheering the guy. He allowed the destruction of the pipeline of arms to terrorists*.

But I don't see how you can agree that we don't need to be the world police, and then fault the president for not being the world police. Make up your mind.

And as far a healthcare, I'll say again: things have gotten better for the majority. Costs are leveling off, and some of us (myself included) are actually getting cheaper coverage than we had a few years ago. I'm not happy with Obamacare overall, but it was a start. Which is a lot better than the continual cycle of politicians saying they'll do something eventually.




* Ignore the fact that the arms were from this country and pre-Obama we were essentially arming insurgents to fight against... well, us. 

[StLucieBengal]

(05-09-2016, 10:59 PM)Benton Wrote: To the bold, then you should be cheering the guy. He allowed the destruction of the pipeline of arms to terrorists*.

But I don't see how you can agree that we don't need to be the world police, and then fault the president for not being the world police. Make up your mind.

And as far a healthcare, I'll say again: things have gotten better for the majority. Costs are leveling off, and some of us (myself included) are actually getting cheaper coverage than we had a few years ago. I'm not happy with Obamacare overall, but it was a start. Which is a lot better than the continual cycle of politicians saying they'll do something eventually.




* Ignore the fact that the arms were from this country and pre-Obama we were essentially arming insurgents to fight against... well, us. 

Where have I ever championed arms sales and world police  from any administration?  Obama was supposed to stop that stuff.... He hasn't... All he does now is support groups like The Muslim brotherhood to come to power. (The same Muslim brotherhood that was lockstep with hitler btw)  he has allowed Iran to become the regional power by allowing Egypt and others to fall.    

Glad you are loving yourself some Obamacare.   Enjoy my hard earned tax money to subsidize your discounts.   We can discuss if the communal approach for healthcare is good or bad.    Personally I am not concerned with who has coverage or who doesn't ..... In the end we do what we can with what we have .....   Why is it a good thing that Medicaid has expanded?   It's nothing but government Care.... We see how great they treat the vets .....    

On arms dealing .... We should be seeing hearings on who was doing it and bringing charges.... But yet more of the same stuff since Nixon.    Covering up.   

[Benton]

(05-10-2016, 12:44 AM)StLucieBengal Wrote: Where have I ever championed arms sales and world police  from any administration?  Obama was supposed to stop that stuff.... He hasn't... All he does now is support groups like The Muslim brotherhood to come to power. (The same Muslim brotherhood that was lockstep with hitler btw)  he has allowed Iran to become the regional power by allowing Egypt and others to fall.    

Glad you are loving yourself some Obamacare.   Enjoy my hard earned tax money to subsidize your discounts.   We can discuss if the communal approach for healthcare is good or bad.    Personally I am not concerned with who has coverage or who doesn't ..... In the end we do what we can with what we have .....   Why is it a good thing that Medicaid has expanded?   It's nothing but government Care.... We see how great they treat the vets .....    

On arms dealing .... We should be seeing hearings on who was doing it and bringing charges.... But yet more of the same stuff since Nixon.    Covering up.   

To the first, pick a side. Either he has it he hasn't. You can't knock him for stopping guns going through those countries and then fault him for not stopping the guns going through.

To the second, meh. My company has been on anthem for a decade so the only thing your tax dollars (and mine) are subsidizing is corporate tax shelters. And you should care. Part of the reason health care costs are so high is because of those with no coverage getting medical treatment they can't afford, so they never do.

And you'll never see anyone brought up on charges. There aren't that many Oliver North's any more, not very many guys willing to take the fall for the establishment. And the guys that have been in positions of authority since Nixon have plenty of separation so they'll never see any fallout. It's not like dick Cheney is suddenly going to say "yeah, I manipulated multiple public offices and got really, obscenely rich doing it."

[StLucieBengal]

(05-10-2016, 01:04 AM)IBenton Wrote: To the first, pick a side. Either he has it he hasn't. You can't knock him for stopping guns going through those countries and then fault him for not stopping the guns going through.

To the second, meh. My company has been on anthem for a decade so the only thing your tax dollars (and mine) are subsidizing is corporate tax shelters. And you should care. Part of the reason health care costs are so high is because of those with no coverage getting medical treatment they can't afford, so they never do.

And you'll never see anyone brought up on charges. There aren't that many Oliver North's any more, not very many guys willing to take the fall for the establishment. And the guys that have been in positions of authority since Nixon have plenty of separation so they'll never see any fallout. It's not like dick Cheney is suddenly going to say "yeah, I manipulated multiple public offices and got really, obscenely rich doing it."

Under Obama we have been running guns.    That's the problem.   Plus to add we run them to the worst people.   

Well then your group medical coverage is nice for you then.   Now let's get into my area. Where I have to buy for my family I don't get rates based on a large company.    Medical costs are higher for people like me.    Like I said .... If he was any kind of leader he would have gotten his guys to just go single payer.    I don't like it but at Least we could respect him.   Now we have this almost part measure that was a payoff to his bundlers.

Plenty of people who should be up on charges.    Hillary for one.   Susan rice is another.