(03-28-2021, 02:40 PM)Clark W Griswold Wrote: Only way I see him signing with the Bengals is if he finds that no other teams want him as a starter.

We should have someone hit him in the knee with a club.

Then sign him while he is injured.

Those Kerrigan's are tough.  They recover quickly from something like that.

Evans back was good to see. I thought he showed better and continues to improve.

(03-29-2021, 11:04 AM)3wt Wrote: Been trying to stay balanced in my thinking, but I'll go ahead and vent.

I still believe that Lawson was the better DE and we should have just signed him.

We blew the opportunity to sign a solid guard with no injury/ performance issues when we let Zeitler sign with someone else.   While I'm sensitive to the fact that he may just not have wanted to come here, and wanted to play for a more competitive team.   But he and Reiff were the sweet spot we needed to insure a solid improvement to the OL

I'm also sensitive that there are some really good interior O linemen in the upcoming draft.   But I have no confidence we will draft them, preferring to sign the best tackle available in the 2nd round.  While that IS a priority, I believe there is more tackle depth in the 3rd/ 4th round and the biggest concern on the O line is the interior at this point.

I think it is too late to find a really reliable upgrade at guard in free agency at this point.  They keep dicking around signing mediocre players.   In my opinion either sign a really good end (Kerrigan - whose ship has sailed) or resign one of your upcoming challenging players (I'm thinking Bates).

We'll see.   But my gut tells me two things:

1. We missed the boat in getting our O-line and D-line upgraded.  And
2. We should have moved on from Anarumo.  The smell out there says that the players don't like the guy and are all wishing he was gone.
   

I realize I am spouting from a pretty ignorant position.

But I had the same gut about weapons of mass destruction in the Bush administration.

I'll have to disagree with you on some opinions. First, Zeitler didn't want to come here. I do agree that they both would've been nice upgrades on the right side. But, you can't force a player to come back to Cincy if he has a bad taste about it. 
2nd, I believe the opposite, with Hendrickson being better as the numbers play it out with no injury history like Lawson ( and I like Lawson). But, 13.5 sacks is 13.5 sacks, something only Dunlap has gotten to for the Bengals. 
3rd, there aren't any IOL out there to get as upgrades, and only a few throughout the process. No one is jumping at the bit to sign Trai Turner these days. 
Lastly, there were several players who have signed and even came in for recruiting visits solely because of Anarumo and playing for him in the past. So, I don't know where your information is coming from? Maybe you can shed some evidence of the specific players not liking him? 

(03-29-2021, 06:47 PM)JerseyDD09 Wrote: I'll have to disagree with you on some opinions. First, Zeitler didn't want to come here. I do agree that they both would've been nice upgrades on the right side. But, you can't force a player to come back to Cincy if he has a bad taste about it. 
2nd, I believe the opposite, with Hendrickson being better as the numbers play it out with no injury history like Lawson ( and I like Lawson). But, 13.5 sacks is 13.5 sacks, something only Dunlap has gotten to for the Bengals. 
3rd, there aren't any IOL out there to get as upgrades, and only a few throughout the process. No one is jumping at the bit to sign Trai Turner these days. 
Lastly, there were several players who have signed and even came in for recruiting visits solely because of Anarumo and playing for him in the past. So, I don't know where your information is coming from? Maybe you can shed some evidence of the specific players not liking him? 

Nice post Jersey. I don't understand not liking Hendrickson over Lawson, I like a guy who can rush the passer AND finish.

Lou is good with the Secondary. Just wish he was the Secondary coach, but hey, bringing in Hobby and now Golden coaching the
Linebackers we might suddenly go from a terrible front to a good one. We have lots of youth at LB, but lots of talent for once.

Hobby working with Hendrickson, Hubbard, Ogunjobi, Reader, Tupou etc could be a muchly underrated hire.

Word is patriots are in talks to try and move up into the top 5

(03-30-2021, 10:04 AM)XenoMorph Wrote: Word is patriots are in talks to try and move up into the top 5

If we get a package like Miami you have to take it.

(03-30-2021, 10:04 AM)XenoMorph Wrote: Word is patriots are in talks to try and move up into the top 5

Gotta link?  Would love to see the rumors

ETA: Would kind of hate going all the way down to 15 though. Even for future 1st rounders I don't anticipate NE drafting high going forward.

(03-30-2021, 10:10 AM)BurnsBengal Wrote: Gotta link?  Would love to see the rumors

ETA: Would kind of hate going all the way down to 15 though. Even for future 1st rounders I don't anticipate NE drafting high going forward.

Agreed. They’re not an ideal trade partner for us. If they get a decent QB those picks could be end of the round. They won 7 games with a terrible Cam and a ton of starters opting out.

At 15 it’s probably likely Sewell, Chase, Pitts, Slater, Smith, and Waddle are all gone, too.

(03-30-2021, 10:22 AM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Agreed. They’re not an ideal trade partner for us. If they get a decent QB those picks could be end of the round. They won 7 games with a terrible Cam and a ton of starters opting out.

At 15 it’s probably likely Sewell, Chase, Pitts, Slater, Smith, and Waddle are all gone, too.

I'll probably be in the minority on this one, but if you tell me I get one of those guys, or I get Bateman, or Darrisaw from VTech plus I'm getting 2 future firsts as well as more picks this season, I am all in on that trade.

Taylor should be in a win or be gone year, most everyone agrees he is in over his head. So if you get a new coach and give him four first round picks in two drafts, that is a great starting point.

Here's one link to this:

https://stripehype.com/2021/03/28/cincinnati-bengals-could-be-trading-back-with-new-england-patriots/

(03-29-2021, 06:47 PM)JerseyDD09 Wrote: I'll have to disagree with you on some opinions. First, Zeitler didn't want to come here. I do agree that they both would've been nice upgrades on the right side. But, you can't force a player to come back to Cincy if he has a bad taste about it. 
2nd, I believe the opposite, with Hendrickson being better as the numbers play it out with no injury history like Lawson ( and I like Lawson). But, 13.5 sacks is 13.5 sacks, something only Dunlap has gotten to for the Bengals. 
3rd, there aren't any IOL out there to get as upgrades, and only a few throughout the process. No one is jumping at the bit to sign Trai Turner these days. 
Lastly, there were several players who have signed and even came in for recruiting visits solely because of Anarumo and playing for him in the past. So, I don't know where your information is coming from? Maybe you can shed some evidence of the specific players not liking him? 

I think where his information is coming from is the #24 and #27 ranked defenses in the NFL the past 2 seasons.  This is a make or break season for both Taylor and Lou.  I truly think Lou is about as good of a DC as Jim Turner was a good OL coach.   If Lou's defense fails like it has the past 2 seasons then both need to be on the first flight out of town at the end of the season. 

(03-29-2021, 06:47 PM)JerseyDD09 Wrote: I'll have to disagree with you on some opinions. First, Zeitler didn't want to come here. I do agree that they both would've been nice upgrades on the right side. But, you can't force a player to come back to Cincy if he has a bad taste about it. 
2nd, I believe the opposite, with Hendrickson being better as the numbers play it out with no injury history like Lawson ( and I like Lawson). But, 13.5 sacks is 13.5 sacks, something only Dunlap has gotten to for the Bengals. 
3rd, there aren't any IOL out there to get as upgrades, and only a few throughout the process. No one is jumping at the bit to sign Trai Turner these days. 
Lastly, there were several players who have signed and even came in for recruiting visits solely because of Anarumo and playing for him in the past. So, I don't know where your information is coming from? Maybe you can shed some evidence of the specific players not liking him? 

Where is this information that Zeitler didn't want to come here?

In a way, the Bengals getting Zeitler back would have been poetic and an admission of the problematic roster-building lately. But Zeitler was apparently out of their price range, so now they will instead have to face him twice a year in the AFC North.


All I've seen was that he got a better offer from Baltimore with more money and more guaranteed money then Cincinnati offered him.

That isn't a not wanting to go somewhere, that's just taking the best offer.

(03-30-2021, 10:09 AM)Murdock2420 Wrote: If we get a package like Miami you have to take it.

Don't think you do. The Patriot's only 3rd round pick is a comp pick, so it's like the 33rd in the 3rd round. Also a 1st round pick 2 years from now (it will probably be a late 1st) does nothing to help Joe Burrow now.

The Dolphins had a bit more luxury to be able to wait for 2023 1st round pick because they were 10-6 last year. The Bengals are much further off and can't afford to wait 2 years from now to get the payoff.

(03-30-2021, 10:33 AM)Murdock2420 Wrote: I'll probably be in the minority on this one, but if you tell me I get one of those guys, or I get Purdue's Moore, or Darrisaw from VTech plus I'm getting 2 future firsts as well as more picks this season, I am all in on that trade.

Taylor should be in a win or be gone year, most everyone agrees he is in over his head. So if you get a new coach and give him four first round picks in two drafts, that is a great starting point.

Here's one link to this:

https://stripehype.com/2021/03/28/cincinnati-bengals-could-be-trading-back-with-new-england-patriots/

Completely agree with you Murdock.  I think if the Patriots come to you with a great deal you have to take it. 

Even if you are trading back to 15, if you can pull in 2 extra 1st round draft picks and maybe a 2or 3 more picks for that you're an idiot not to. 

I completely agree Taylor is in a win or be gone year.  He has to be.  No coach going into the 4th year of their contract and potential being under 10 wins or even around 10 wins gets any respect from a NFL player. 

(03-30-2021, 10:51 AM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Don't think you do. The Patriot's only 3rd round pick is a comp pick, so it's like the 33rd in the 3rd round. Also a 1st round pick 2 years from now (it will probably be a late 1st) does nothing to help Joe Burrow now.

The Dolphins had a bit more luxury to be able to wait for 2023 1st round pick because they were 10-6 last year. The Bengals are much further off and can't afford to wait 2 years from now to get the payoff.

Which is why I think you go after 1st, and 2nd this year.

Then future picks. 

Saw where Alexander went back to the Vikings. 1yr/$1.13m... that's a steal.

I didn't hate the FA CBs they signed, but did Alexander not want to come back to play for Lou? I can't imagine the Bengals wouldn't want him back at that price, or even more than double that price. That seems like he took a low amount to play for Zimmer.

(03-30-2021, 10:57 AM)Murdock2420 Wrote: Which is why I think you go after 1st, and 2nd this year.

Then future picks. 

I can't think of a single 2nd rounder that I would be willing to trade the ability to choose from Sewell/Chase/Pitts.

The Patriots 1st round pick is 15. At that point all three are gone, along with likely Slater/Smith/Waddle. You'll likely have the 3rd best OL or 4th best WR to choose from at 15, and nothing the Patriots have draft pick-wise really is tempting to make that downgrade for.

1 Ronnie Stanley is better than 2 Jonah Williams
1 Julio Jones is better than 2 Tyler Boyds
1 Travis Kelce is better than 2 Jermaine Greshams

At some point if you want to be a great team, you need some great players. Not saying you need a ton of great players, because I don't think any team has that, but you need at least 3-5 truly big time difference makers. The Bengals have borderline 1 right now (Bates, who I would love to see take another small step forward and cement that status) and they are in position to potentially get another one of those right now. At 15 that is much less likely.


- - - - - - -
EDIT: Worth noting that the last time the Bengals traded back with the Patriots, the Patriots got Chandler Jones (a guy who is on pace to be a HoF candidate) and the Bengals got Kevin Zeitler after David DeCastro (a guy on pace to be a borderline HoF candidate) was taken just a couple picks ahead of them.

The pick they got to trade down? Was used on Brandon Thompson.

David DeCastro
or
Kevin Zeitler + Brandon Thompson

Who would you have rather had?

(03-30-2021, 10:22 AM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Agreed. They’re not an ideal trade partner for us. If they get a decent QB those picks could be end of the round. They won 7 games with a terrible Cam and a ton of starters opting out.

At 15 it’s probably likely Sewell, Chase, Pitts, Slater, Smith, and Waddle are all gone, too.

IF we get a big package like Miami did, we should emulate them and trade back up to #7 with Detroit.

At #7, I can still get 1 of Sewell, Chase, Pitts. Unless Detroit is willing, I tell NE to bug off.

(03-30-2021, 11:05 AM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: I can't think of a single 2nd rounder that I would be willing to trade the ability to choose from Sewell/Chase/Pitts.

The Patriots 1st round pick is 15. At that point all three are gone, along with likely Slater/Smith/Waddle. You'll likely have the 3rd best OL or 4th best WR to choose from at 15, and nothing the Patriots have draft pick-wise really is tempting to make that downgrade for.

1 Ronnie Stanley is better than 2 Jonah Williams
1 Julio Jones is better than 2 Tyler Boyds
1 Travis Kelce is better than 2 Jermaine Greshams

At some point if you want to be a great team, you need some great players. Not saying you need a ton of great players, because I don't think any team has that, but you need at least 3-5 truly big time difference makers. The Bengals have borderline 1 right now (Bates, who I would love to see take another small step forward and cement that status) and they are in position to potentially get another one of those right now. At 15 that is much less likely.

I think the reason you make the trade is this team is so void of talent right now.  

There's absolutely 0 depth.  If you can some how pull off an additional pick or 2 this year then that just adds to your roster.  

I agree you need 3-5 great players as difference makers and Bates is above average with potential to be great, so I agree on that.  Otherwise, I dont think there's anyone else on this roster with the exception of Burrow who is a difference maker.  

You need draft picks to find those difference makers because an organization like the Bengals arent bringing those difference makers in through free agency. 

(03-30-2021, 11:05 AM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: I can't think of a single 2nd rounder that I would be willing to trade the ability to choose from Sewell/Chase/Pitts.

The Patriots 1st round pick is 15. At that point all three are gone, along with likely Slater/Smith/Waddle. You'll likely have the 3rd best OL or 4th best WR to choose from at 15, and nothing the Patriots have draft pick-wise really is tempting to make that downgrade for.

1 Ronnie Stanley is better than 2 Jonah Williams
1 Julio Jones is better than 2 Tyler Boyds
1 Travis Kelce is better than 2 Jermaine Greshams

At some point if you want to be a great team, you need some great players. Not saying you need a ton of great players, because I don't think any team has that, but you need at least 3-5 truly big time difference makers. The Bengals have borderline 1 right now (Bates, who I would love to see take another small step forward and cement that status) and they are in position to potentially get another one of those right now. At 15 that is much less likely.

Bates wasn't a first rounder and is arguably our best player on the team.

With how much talent we need on this team and the amount of upgrades we need, getting additional picks in the early part of the draft helps this year (the extra 2nd) but then you are getting two of the top 32 guys in the next two drafts? That is a great value and helps restock a down roster.

It isn't like Sewell or Chase or Pitts is the missing link that takes us from 4 wins to playoffs. We are still going to be probably at best a .500 team next year. So, maybe 2022 is the season they make the jump and if you have two 1st rounders in the draft and the ability to trade the 2023 additional 1st rounder to move up... it absolutely is the smart move.

(03-30-2021, 10:10 AM)BurnsBengal Wrote: Gotta link?  Would love to see the rumors

ETA:  Would kind of hate going all the way down to 15 though.  Even for future 1st rounders I don't anticipate NE drafting high going forward.

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/news/2021-nfl-mock-draft-49ers-land-justin-fields-after-trade-as-qbs-go-1-2-3-4-dolphins-eagles-get-top-wrs/

They are talking to Falcons and Us...   from what i saw somewhere else( cant find that link atm)