(08-30-2024, 01:08 PM)NotBigzo Wrote: Where you getting this from big dog? 

Honestly I've read so much and heard so much I can't remember. It could have been someone in this thread I'm quoting as a "source" now for all I know. But for some reason it stuck as noteworthy. 

(08-30-2024, 01:10 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Lapham indicated it on Sirius Radio yesterday for one source. He said they had settled on a number, but then "something" happened. It has to be when he gets his money

Thanks B, I figured it had to be someone I thought was legit since it stuck with me.

(08-30-2024, 01:07 PM)bfine32 Wrote: We heard rumors/speculation and if those are true I'd say it's too rich. He wants to be the highest paid WR in the NFL. He can't use "next contract" logic, because Lamb signed after Jefferson for less and Lamb is every bit the WR JaMar Chase is.

Yep over the past 2 seasons, Lamb has 3108 yards.
Chase has 2262 yards.

Yes, Chase played in 6 less games, but availability is also important.
Their target differential over the past 2 years?

Lamb - 337
Chase - 279

Lamb has gone from 16th to 6th to 2nd in total receiving yards year over year.
Chase has gone from 4th to 17th to 12th.

I think it makes total sense that Chase should get under Jefferson and Lamb. He flat out hasn't been as productive.
He hasn't been as productive as ASB or AJ Brown either. ASB makes just above $30 mill APY and AJ Brown makes $32 mill APY.
Or Tyreek Hill, who makes $30 mill APY.

I'd look to offer him around $30-32 mill APY with $15-18 mill guaranteed per year. He likely will not have to worry about the WR2 stealing as many targets from him after this season with Higgins likely departing, so he'll get a better share and be more productive. He likely will end up being in the 3-5 range consistently if/when that happens.


If he wants to land another really big contract somewhere, he should want to sign only a 3-year deal so he can sign one more mega-deal in his late 20's.
So maybe a $96 mill, 3-year deal with $52 mill guaranteed.

Or what he can do is deal with it this year and become a Top-3 WR production-wise to justify getting $35+ mill APY in that next contract during next offseason's negotiations.

Now might be a good time to revisit the details of the JJ contract to see where or what might be the hold up (as if we really know).

The deal pays $88.743 million fully guaranteed at signing. The practical guarantee is $95.743 million, since it can be avoided only if he’s cut after one year.

It’s far more likely he’ll definitely be paid $125.743 million over four years, since $14.257 million of his year-four pay becomes fully guaranteed after only two years. (In all, $110 million is guaranteed for injury at signing.)

It’s the biggest contract ever given to a non-quarterback, with no back-end fugazi numbers aimed at pumping up the new-money average.

Here’s the cash flow: $38.063 million in year one, $69.993 million through two years, $95.743 million through three years, $125.743 million through four years, and $159.743 million through five years.

Through two years, four years, and five years, it’s the highest cash flow ever for a non-quarterback. Through three years, it’s second.

Inside the Justin Jefferson deal - NBC Sports

I'm thinking it has to do with cashflow. And with Burrow's cash flow..... I'm not defending MB but this has to be a challenge for the family business as Lil Jo Jo Brown, and Betty Brown watch their inheritance get wiped out... Paul Brown IV college fund canceled. 

This is the business. Not a tax write off like it is for other Owners. They have guaranteed more than the 1st year more now then they have before so I'd think that wouldn't be the final sticking point. 

I hope Chase retires a Bengal. I also hope he can avoid injuries and earn his big pay day. The issue we have is we have no idea the offer nor the terms so hard to blame Chase or FO until we know the facts.

I will say if the team was being cutthroat, they would be fining Chase $50,000 a day because he is healthy and passed 3 physicals. It appears they are allowing him to participate in team meetings and walk thru sessions. They could tell him to go home until you are ready to participate in all drills (glad they are not doing this).

It appears to me both sides are trying to work through it amicably.

The Bengals supposedly had been working on Tee Higgins contract for the last year and a half. They should have already had a plan or some type of currency in reserve for Tee's contract. That didn't happen! They tagged him.
Bottom line, they need to pay one of our WRs. Tee and Chase are both #1's on most NFL teams. Let's get at least one of these guys signed to a long term deal.

(08-30-2024, 02:11 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: I hope Chase retires a Bengal. I also hope he can avoid injuries and earn his big pay day. The issue we have is we have no idea the offer nor the terms so hard to blame Chase or FO until we know the facts.

I will say if the team was being cutthroat, they would be fining Chase $50,000 a day because he is healthy and passed 3 physicals. It appears they are allowing him to participate in team meetings and walk thru sessions. They could tell him to go home until you are ready to participate in all drills (glad they are not doing this).

It appears to me both sides are trying to work through it amicably.

Yes agree. That if Chase was being a diva he would be putting the team on blast. But he has been very quiet just doing what he has to in order to apply pressure. 

(08-30-2024, 02:07 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Yep over the past 2 seasons, Lamb has 3108 yards.
Chase has 2262 yards.

Yes, Chase played in 6 less games, but availability is also important.
Their target differential over the past 2 years?

Lamb - 337
Chase - 279

Lamb has gone from 16th to 6th to 2nd in total receiving yards year over year.
Chase has gone from 4th to 17th to 12th.

I think it makes total sense that Chase should get under Jefferson and Lamb. He flat out hasn't been as productive.
He hasn't been as productive as ASB or AJ Brown either. ASB makes just above $30 mill APY and AJ Brown makes $32 mill APY.
Or Tyreek Hill, who makes $30 mill APY.

I'd look to offer him around $30-32 mill APY with $15-18 mill guaranteed per year. He likely will not have to worry about the WR2 stealing as many targets from him after this season with Higgins likely departing, so he'll get a better share and be more productive. He likely will end up being in the 3-5 range consistently if/when that happens.


If he wants to land another really big contract somewhere, he should want to sign only a 3-year deal so he can sign one more mega-deal in his late 20's.
So maybe a $96 mill, 3-year deal with $52 mill guaranteed.

Or what he can do is deal with it this year and become a Top-3 WR production-wise to justify getting $35+ mill APY in that next contract during next offseason's negotiations.

I do feel like there is a little more context to the numbers. But instead of arguing them I will say Chase is a special player with elite traits. Those elite traits are what you pay for. 

This effin' little dweeb. Already making millions and upset because he isn't getting 27 million.
The sports world is clearly upside-down.

(08-30-2024, 01:43 PM)Essex Johnson Wrote: You make some good points but also a bit bias to one side, there are many favorable job arrangements that NFL players have that other professions do not and I think the one that is causing more and more of these contract issues is "guaranteed money", this is something that many daily high risk jobs do not have much of ie fire, police, etc.  To think that  a large portion of a player's contract can be guaranteed to be paid regardless of how a player performs or contract is terminated makes the player seem the cutthroat not the team. 

Fair points, although the unions Firefighters and Police Officers are members of essentially guarantee them employment so long as they don't commit some gross negligence or actions.  And there are causes where teamscan go after players to avoid paying or even recouping guaranteed money in certain circumstances.

(08-30-2024, 01:17 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Not going to argue with that. I just don't see us trading Chase away because of Burrow who is the face of this franchise and wants him here.

There is no doubt Chase has tons more value than any other player in a trade scenario and Tee has done the right things in showing up and 
playing on the Tag. Still, I am wary of Tee's injury history more than Ja'Marr's and Ja'Marr is the more talented Receiver with uncanny chemistry
with Burrow.

While there is no denying Burrow and Chase's friendship, I think Chase needs and wants to play with Burrow more than Burrow needs and wants to play with Chase. Burrow could do just fine with Higgins and the rest of the crew. If Chase were traded somewhere without a top 5 or 10 QB, his numbers would drop drastically. 

(08-30-2024, 01:54 PM)TheFan Wrote: Why does this myth keep getting pushed out? Burrow and Chase don't have some uncanny chemistry. 

Burrow had a better completion % to Higgins in 2021 and 2022 then he did to Chase. Browning had a 64% completion % to Chase in 2023 while Burrow had 63% and 64% in 2021 and 2022 respectively. 

Burrow is a great QB and Chase is a great WR. That's their chemistry. It's no different vs every other great QB/WR combo

BS. You cannot put everything on completion percentage and act like that is all there is to it. Burrow and Chase go way back and Burrow makes throws
to Chase he doesn't to Higgins. Higgins relies on his size which helps him get open, Chase relies on his speed, explosiveness and his chemistry with Joe
much more than Tee does. I don't understand how someone can be a fan of the Bengals and not see these throws and this natural chemistry.

They can read each other's minds. Can Burrow and Tee read each other's minds? Of course but not to the level of Burrow and Chase.

(08-30-2024, 02:45 PM)Sled21 Wrote: While there is no denying Burrow and Chase's friendship, I think Chase needs and wants to play with Burrow more than Burrow needs and wants to play with Chase. Burrow could do just fine with Higgins and the rest of the crew. If Chase were traded somewhere without a top 5 or 10 QB, his numbers would drop drastically. 

Could be correct honestly, like I just said about their chemistry. I don't think Chase would do as well with another more inaccurate QB.

(08-30-2024, 02:49 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: BS. You cannot put everything on completion percentage and act like that is all there is to it. Burrow and Chase go way back and Burrow makes throws
to Chase he doesn't to Higgins. Higgins relies on his size which helps him get open, Chase relies on his speed, explosiveness and his chemistry with Joe
much more than Tee does. I don't understand how someone can be a fan of the Bengals and not see these throws and this natural chemistry.

They can read each other's minds. Can Burrow and Tee read each other's minds? Of course but not to the level of Burrow and Chase.

It's to the point Burrow has played with Higgins almost as much as he did with Chase. He had 2 years with Chase at LSU. He then had a year at the Bengals with Higgins before Chase got there. There's not this great time period difference.

(08-30-2024, 02:56 PM)Sled21 Wrote: It's to the point Burrow has played with Higgins almost as much as he did with Chase. He had 2 years with Chase at LSU. He then had a year at the Bengals with Higgins before Chase got there. There's not this great time period difference.

That is a good point, but one more year with Chase is something and I personally have seen Burrow try and fit the ball into tiny holes to 
Chase that he didn't try with Tee quite a few times.

(08-30-2024, 02:49 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: BS. You cannot put everything on completion percentage and act like that is all there is to it. Burrow and Chase go way back and Burrow makes throws
to Chase he doesn't to Higgins. Higgins relies on his size which helps him get open, Chase relies on his speed, explosiveness and his chemistry with Joe
much more than Tee does. I don't understand how someone can be a fan of the Bengals and not see these throws and this natural chemistry.

They can read each other's minds. Can Burrow and Tee read each other's minds? Of course but not to the level of Burrow and Chase.

You literally just made all that up in your head. Burrow and Chase can't read each other's mind, that's why they make mistakes at times. What you're describing is what pretty much every Elite QB and WR do with time. Burrow trusting Chase more doesn't mean they have some super power. 

(08-30-2024, 03:00 PM)TheFan Wrote: You literally just made all that up in your head. Burrow and Chase can't read each other's mind, that's why they make mistakes at times. What you're describing is what pretty much every Elite QB and WR do with time. 

If you cannot see it on the field I don't know what to say to you and it is very rare for a college QB and a college WR of the same team 
to go to the NFL and be on the same team again. I don't even know of another duo, let alone one where the QB won the Heisman and a 
National Championship in the same year.

Some of the takes on here are wild

Turning on the team's 1st or 2nd best player to negotiate the best deal possible for himself.

Something each and every one of you would do if you were in his position.

It is highly entertaining. Keep it up!!

As Ocho would say I love all you m'fers!!! Even the guy who called him a little effin dweeb.

(08-30-2024, 03:02 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: If you cannot see it on the field I don't know what to say to you and it is very rare for a college QB and a college WR of the same team 
to go to the NFL and be on the same team again. I don't even know of another duo, let alone one where the QB won the Heisman and a 
National Championship in the same year.

Exactly. And they're doing the same thing all of the other top WRs are. Hill joined the Dolphins and immediately put up back to back 1700 yard seasons. Puka Nacua developed better chemistry with Stafford in one preseason then Chase and Burrow supposedly had? JJ and Cousins in their 2 years? The amount of times Cousins threw up crazy passes that no one else should have to JJ was insane. Stafford and Cupp? Stafford and Johnson? 

QBs trusting their top receiver and throwing them passes they wouldn't other WRs isn't new or unique or special to Burrow and Chase. 

(08-30-2024, 03:10 PM)BengalBob Wrote: Some of the takes on here are wild

Turning on the team's 1st or 2nd best player to negotiate the best deal possible for himself.

Something each and every one of you would do if you were in his position.

It is highly entertaining.  Keep it up!!

As Ocho would say I love all you m'fers!!!  Even the guy who called him a little effin dweeb.

Meh, I'd like to consider myself more of a Tee Higgins type. 

No one has turned on him for trying to negotiate a deal. Some have issue with his method of negotiation.