I Hope Reds.com Joking on Trading Puig or Roark this Month.

[kevin]

The Reds are so close to First Place. If this team trades players like Puig or Roark for the usual crap they get in return, I'm done with this franchise. After years and years of putting the Fans through such awful last place baseball, HOW DARE they break up this team when they finally get near First Place after all these years.

If the Reds trade Puig, forget about it, their season is over. He is to this team what bringing in Dave Parker was. You can't replace what Puig is doing in right field, at the plate, on the bases. .....and you can't replace Roark either. He makes the starting rotation a solid staff. You can't count on Wood, and if Wood does get in here pitching well, Roark is not the odd man out. Castillo, Gray, Disco, Roark and Wood is the type staff that can get you to the play-offs and beyond.

Yet REDS.COM story today is maybe trading Puig. HOW DARE THEY even consider that. After all these years of putting the Fans through such Awful. Stinking, Lousy, Boring, Pointless, LAST PLACE baseball. Now that the team is just starting to get good May, June into July. The Fans deserve more than 2 good months after years of losing....Adding Roark was like adding Billingham or Fred Norman. Adding Puig has been like adding Dave Parker. .....REDS FANS should be VERY UPSET if Reds get STUPID and CHEAP and make these trades, SELLING OUT THE FANS.

Now some might come on here and give reasons to go cheap and plan for years down the road. Pete Rose, Lou Piniella or Sparky Anderson would say THE REDS are close to FIRST PLACE NOW. NOW is THE CHANCE. NOW is THE TIME. Years down the road are hopes and pipe dreams. Even Reds big draft pick superstar just got all injured in minors. The REDS find themselves near First Place NOW....NOW is the Time....Trading key players would just be stupid....Fans should boycott this team if they make these trades this month, because they will send Reds back in Last Place, when they could have been First Place.

1968 Bengals

[Yojimbo]

It was a fan email question to a MLB writer who responded not going to happen unless the team collapses in the next 3 weeks. Also predicted that the team would be buyers if they are near contention at the end of the month. Settle down, don’t be part of 85% who only read headlines.


“Do you think the Reds will sell high on Yasiel Puig or keep him and try to re-sign him?
-- Tim T.

Unless the Reds take a big nosedive after they return from the All-Star break, I can’t see them selling Yasiel Puig -- or anybody. Despite being at the bottom of the National League Central as of Friday, they are 41-44 and only 3 1/2 games out of first place. There isn’t a second-place team in another division that's that close. With ownership being as competitive as it is and the front office trying to create a winning culture under manager David Bell, waving a white flag and selling would highly irritate a win-starved fanbase.

At the least, I could see president of baseball operations Dick Williams and general manager Nick Krall standing pat. But if the Reds are still contending, they should be buyers. They could use additional bullpen help and perhaps another bat.”

https://www.mlb.com/reds/news/inbox-what-is-reds-plan-for-yasiel-puig-at-deadline

[kevin]

(07-06-2019, 11:23 AM)Yojimbo Wrote: It was a fan email question to a MLB writer who responded not going to happen unless the team collapses in the next 3 weeks. Also predicted that the team would be buyers if they are near contention at the end of the month. Settle down, don’t be part of 85% who only read headlines.


“Do you think the Reds will sell high on Yasiel Puig or keep him and try to re-sign him?
-- Tim T.

Unless the Reds take a big nosedive after they return from the All-Star break, I can’t see them selling Yasiel Puig -- or anybody. Despite being at the bottom of the National League Central as of Friday, they are 41-44 and only 3 1/2 games out of first place. There isn’t a second-place team in another division that's that close. With ownership being as competitive as it is and the front office trying to create a winning culture under manager David Bell, waving a white flag and selling would highly irritate a win-starved fanbase.

At the least, I could see president of baseball operations Dick Williams and general manager Nick Krall standing pat. But if the Reds are still contending, they should be buyers. They could use additional bullpen help and perhaps another bat.”

https://www.mlb.com/reds/news/inbox-what-is-reds-plan-for-yasiel-puig-at-deadline

Thank You. That is good to hear.  That is good to hear.  

I saw what Dave Parker did when he came to Reds, and I'm telling the younger fans Puig is doing as much or more.  Both right fielders very comparable in that they are big men that play good D, great arms in right.  At the plate they give you power and Tony Perez clutch hitting with men on base.  On the bases they are Pete Rose very heads up taking the extra base and more speed than you would thing for big guys. 

The innings Roark eats are huge.  Go into a baseball site where you can pull up last 3 years total, 2016, 17, 18.  Then click on most innings. You will find that in the last 3 years Roark is near the top in most pitched innings with a 3 something ERA.  In 2019 he is eating innings for Reds.  The bullpen needs that.  Yes, maybe we could use more bullpen, who couldn't.  What is making the Reds better in 2019 is Reds finally have starters going deeper into ballgames.  You can not bring the pen in every game in the 3rd or 4th inning as Reds were last few years. 

THANKS....That is good to hear....Reds.com headline was SHOULD REDS TRADE PUIG AT DEADLINE....That was not a good headline to see this Saturday morning with Reds so close to First Place. ....Reds should not be trading anybody.  The chemistry of a team is fragile.  Plus they might get Gennett and Wood going, and there are your extra bat and pitcher, plus guys in minors come September. 

If Reds would make play-offs, and I thought of this in 1990 season. You don't use 5 starters in play-offs. That means your bullpen gets stronger because some starters become bullpen. If Wood comes back, Mahle could end up in pen. If Reds make play-offs, another starter will join Mahle in the pen. Suddenly Reds have plenty of bullpen and no room for more.

As for hitting, Gennett is pretty gimpy still. They should platoon him and ease him back. They have Dietrick and Farmer and others needing playing time. Ervin and Senzel but still need to play Winker now and then. The Reds have great depth if Gennett and Wood start playing more. However not enough depth to trade a Dave Parker type Puig, Reds are not close to being that deep in talent.

[*psychdoctor*]

(07-06-2019, 11:54 AM)kevin Wrote: Thank You. That is good to hear.  That is good to hear.  

I saw what Dave Parker did when he came to Reds, and I'm telling the younger fans Puig is doing as much or more.  Both right fielders very comparable in that they are big men that play good D, great arms in right.  At the plate they give you power and Tony Perez clutch hitting with men on base.  On the bases they are Pete Rose very heads up taking the extra base and more speed than you would thing for big guys. 

The innings Roark eats are huge.  Go into a baseball site where you can pull up last 3 years total, 2016, 17, 18.  Then click on most innings. You will find that in the last 3 years Roark is near the top in most pitched innings with a 3 something ERA.  In 2019 he is eating innings for Reds.  The bullpen needs that.  Yes, maybe we could use more bullpen, who couldn't.  What is making the Reds better in 2019 is Reds finally have starters going deeper into ballgames.  You can not bring the pen in every game in the 3rd or 4th inning as Reds were last few years. 

THANKS....That is good to hear....Reds.com headline was SHOULD REDS TRADE PUIG AT DEADLINE....That was not a good headline to see this Saturday morning with Reds so close to First Place. ....Reds should not be trading anybody.  The chemistry of a team is fragile.  Plus they might get Gennett and Wood going, and there are your extra bat and pitcher, plus guys in minors come September. 

If Reds would make play-offs, and I thought of this in 1990 season.  You don't use 5 starters in play-offs.  That means your bullpen gets stronger because some starters become bullpen.  If Wood comes back, Mahle could end up in pen.  If Reds make play-offs, another starter will join Mahle in the pen. Suddenly Reds have plenty of bullpen and no room for more.

As for hitting, Gennett is pretty gimpy still.  They should platoon him and ease him back. They have Dietrick and Farmer and others needing playing time.  Ervin and Senzel but still need to play Winker now and then.  The Reds have great depth if Gennett and Wood start playing more.   However not enough depth to trade a Dave Parker type Puig,  Reds are not close to being that deep in talent.

Puig will stay and Roark will be traded is my opinion.  Unless Wood has another set back.  

[cinci4life]

(07-06-2019, 03:29 PM)psychdoctor Wrote: Puig will stay and Roark will be traded is my opinion.  Unless Wood has another set back.  

Only way Roark goes anywhere is if they fall apart in the next couple of weeks.

[*psychdoctor*]

(07-06-2019, 03:44 PM)cinci4life Wrote: Only way Roark goes anywhere is if they fall apart in the next couple of weeks.

Yankees will make an offer for Roark and Castillo.  Maybe an offer for Iggy.  I do not see Roark as a Red next season.  Especially if Wood can finish the season.  Wood was the critical piece in the trade with the Dodgers.  

[Circleville Guy]

I just don’t see how anyone still has an ounce of faith that Wood will come in and be a productive starter this year. He’s only had about 5 setbacks in the last year. It would be a PR disaster if the Reds trade off assets while in the thick of the race, especially after all of these last place finishes. They’ll have to be at least 7-8 games out of the wildcard race to sell anything. I still think they’ll pickup some relief help.

[*psychdoctor*]

(07-06-2019, 04:10 PM)Circleville Guy Wrote: I just don’t see how anyone still has an ounce of faith that Wood will come in and be a productive starter this year. He’s only had about 5 setbacks in the last year. It would be a PR disaster if the Reds trade off assets while in the thick of the race, especially after all of these last place finishes. They’ll have to be at least 7-8 games out of the wildcard race to sell anything. I still think they’ll pickup some relief help.

Wood starts rehab assignment today.  Hope he does well.   

[samhain]

No chance anyone gets traded unless they tank for the rest of July. If anything, I could see them adding a bat or bullpen arm for the division/wild card race.

[HarleyDog]

(07-06-2019, 06:20 PM)samhain Wrote: No chance anyone gets traded unless they tank for the rest of July.  If anything, I could see them adding a bat or bullpen arm for the division/wild card race

I agree. Their not trading Puig. Starving Reds fans would be upset.

[SunsetBengal]

Perhaps a bit of an overreaction to a fan email, but I can't see the team parting with Puig unless they come out and fall on their faces after the break, just like they've done repeatedly in recent years.  Puig provides much needed "bang for the buck" and helps to put much needed fannies in the seats at GABP.

[Circleville Guy]

(07-06-2019, 04:14 PM)psychdoctor Wrote: Wood starts rehab assignment today.  Hope he does well.   

We shall see! I’ll be surprised if he’s a productive starter this year!

[fredtoast]

(07-06-2019, 04:10 PM)Circleville Guy Wrote:  It would be a PR disaster if the Reds trade off assets while in the thick of the race,

They’ll have to be at least 7-8 games out of the wildcard race to sell anything. I still think they’ll pickup some relief help.

(07-06-2019, 06:20 PM)samhain Wrote: No chance anyone gets traded unless they tank for the rest of July.  If anything, I could see them adding a bat or bullpen arm for the division/wild card race.

(07-06-2019, 07:14 PM)HarleyDog Wrote: I agree. Their not trading Puig. Starving Reds fans would be upset.

Agree with all of this.  If the Reds are close at all and trade away any players the fans should revolt.

[grampahol]

The one thing we're generally not privy to when it comes to trades are how the players who are about to become free agents feel. Of course they want the most money, most players do, but they also want to be in the thick of things in the standings.
If an impending FA wants a gazillion bucks for average performance of course you trade them to get something in return even if it's some minor league player with some promise. Teams don't have unlimited cash to sign every player who thinks he's worth a kings ransom.. I think a lot of fans get caught up in thinking they actually have all the money in the world when in fact they have to work within a certain budget.
If Puig were to come right out to demand a billion dollar contract he'd be on the next plane out and the same for Roark and Wood. If, on the other hand they're reasonable people and actually like playing for the Reds it's a completely different discussion. We as fans don't generally get to sit down with team ownership, the players and their agents.. Mostly we get some pundit's 3rd, 4th and often 5th hand account of what's really going on..
As for Dietrich? Other than some early homerun power he's shown little in actual team value. He gets hit by a lot of pitches to get on base, but you can hardly plan a season around getting hit by pitches.. 

[Murdock2420]

I guess I'm on the opposite side of this discussion.

I'd have no issue with the Reds trading Puig as long as they get a major league ready player in return for him. Not some low A ball guy who might make it, but a player who will help next season.

The reasoning is kinda simple. Ervin is showing he can start, Senzel is the real deal and Winker is a solid OFer as well. Puig is a damn nice bat to have, but he's gone at the end of the season for free anyways. I'd move him for a piece that allows you to remain in the division hunt next season and let the other 3 guys start in the OF and avoid the platooning and trying to get everyone enough ABs

[Circleville Guy]

(07-14-2019, 10:00 PM)Murdock2420 Wrote: I guess I'm on the opposite side of this discussion.

I'd have no issue with the Reds trading Puig as long as they get a major league ready player in return for him. Not some low A ball guy who might make it, but a player who will help next season.

The reasoning is kinda simple. Ervin is showing he can start, Senzel is the real deal and Winker is a solid OFer as well. Puig is a damn nice bat to have, but he's gone at the end of the season for free anyways. I'd move him for a piece that allows you to remain in the division hunt next season and let the other 3 guys start in the OF and avoid the platooning and trying to get everyone enough ABs

I like the idea more of extending Puig and trading Winker. Winker has less power, less speed and isn’t as good defensively. It would have to be a reasonable deal though.

[*ochocincos*]

I think a more realistic expectation is Puig finishes the year but leaves in the offseason for a more lucrative contract.
The Reds will promote Ervin to play RF full-time. They then have a nice young group of Winker, Senzel, and Ervin for the OF.

As for Roark, I'm not sure on his long-term future. He currently makes $10 mill, which is pretty cheap nowadays for a SP who is 2nd/3rd in a rotation. I'd expect he'll see a pay increase to around $15-20 mill a year. The Reds have Roark, Wood, and DeSclafani all set for FA after this season, so they might want to pay the best of that group. However, Roark is the oldest SP out of that group at 32 years old.

[Circleville Guy]

(07-15-2019, 12:08 PM)ochocincos Wrote: I think a more realistic expectation is Puig finishes the year but leaves in the offseason for a more lucrative contract.
The Reds will promote Ervin to play RF full-time. They then have a nice young group of Winker, Senzel, and Ervin for the OF.

As for Roark, I'm not sure on his long-term future. He currently makes $10 mill, which is pretty cheap nowadays for a SP who is 2nd/3rd in a rotation. I'd expect he'll see a pay increase to around $15-20 mill a year. The Reds have Roark, Wood, and DeSclafani all set for FA after this season, so they might want to pay the best of that group. However, Roark is the oldest SP out of that group at 32 years old.

I agree that is probably what they will do with the outfield but what do you think they should do? If they do go that route, it leaves more money for the pitching but Ervin and Winker are both risky for production. I do want to see Ervin get an extended shot soon though!

[*ochocincos*]

(07-15-2019, 02:55 PM)Circleville Guy Wrote: I agree that is probably what they will do with the outfield but what do you think they should do? If they do go that route, it leaves more money for the pitching but Ervin and Winker are both risky for production. I do want to see Ervin get an extended shot soon though!

Risky for production? You can say that about any young player coming up. You won't know for sure until you put them out there on a longer-term basis. If you give Puig a big contract, what do you do with Ervin/Winker?

Besides, what is bad about Winker? Batting average?
If that's the concern, baseball is moving more towards OPS rather than BA. Winker's career OPS is .831, which is one of the highest on the team. It's not some sub-.700 like Iglesias or Peraza have.

[*psychdoctor*]

(07-15-2019, 03:10 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Risky for production? You can say that about any young player coming up. You won't know for sure until you put them out there on a longer-term basis. If you give Puig a big contract, what do you do with Ervin/Winker?

Besides, what is bad about Winker? Batting average?
If that's the concern, baseball is moving more towards OPS rather than BA. Winker's career OPS is .831, which is one of the highest on the team. It's not some sub-.700 like Iglesias or Peraza have.

The issue I have with Winker is that he tends to hit into double plays.  I cannot find the stats on this, but it seems to be a problem for him.  The game I was at, Winker hit into two DP.  I think his fielding is average to below average compared to Ervin and Puig.  I still like Winker though and he can hit the ball well.