DC/OL wish list

[ERIC1]

(01-16-2025, 06:41 PM)samhain Wrote: I don't necessarily despise the Golden hire. I'm just not convinced that it's the hire that makes this a championship defense.

Also don't love that it plays into the idea Willie Anderson spoke of when it comes to coaches and hiring staff; ie most of the time these guys just hire their friends. Familiarity means more than just about anything, especially here.

Golden has a fine defense at ND. He also has a roster with talent. Even in a down year, ND is going to have the horses to go up against just about anyone outside of the elite. He's not getting that here. The scheme and the execution will have to make up for a likely talent deficiency. They aren't going to have the cap for major retooling. There are only so many draft picks that will be day 1 starters.

On top of talent, it sure seems like there was a culture issue on defense last year. Poor discipline and lack of communication were pretty apparent. Being out of shape and unfocused are issues that go beyond just the talent deficit. Is bringing in a guy that worked under the guy that lost the culture going to change it for the better? Also no idea, but I think the question is fair.

...we can find fault with most any pick..if ..in fact...its golden we are getting one of the best defensive coordinators in college..pretty impressive

[M.W.]

(01-06-2025, 09:46 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: We definitely need some nastiness on both sides of the ball, but especially on Defense.

Maybe Burfict for LB coach???

Or is he like permanently banned from the NFL?

[*bfine32*]

(01-16-2025, 05:28 PM)J24 Wrote: Why fire Lou to just hire is understudy? Doesn't make much sense to me but who knows what this organization is thinking?

Because the understudy may be better, just like Golden, Vance Joseph was an understudy here until he left for a DC job, just as Golden did.

ho would you rather have Paul Gunther or his understudy Vance Joseph?

[ERIC1]

(01-16-2025, 06:57 PM)Isaac Curtis: The Real #85 Wrote: I'd much prefer someone with a track record as an NFL DC. Saleh, Allen, and Eberflus were my top 3. 

Golden is a bit above meh. 

Then again, we don't need s championship level D. Just stop being toothless.

Bengals fans ..including myself...overly think some things at times...the majority of nfl team fans would be elated to land one of he top collegiate defensive coordinators..

[J24]

(01-16-2025, 06:31 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Hey, I am not for Golden either as my top pick, but our Linebackers were much better with him here and he actually has been great at ND.

Better resume' than Lou had before he came here.

I think Golden can be a good D coordinator and I thought Lou was a good D coordinator. My problem isn't with either guy.

My problem is the team thought they needed a change at the Coordinator position but then they decide to hire someone with a similar philosophy? It doesn't make much sense to me?

I'd you are going to make a change than make a damn change.  

[jj22]

Have to hope for Golden then. FO just doesn't know how to aspire any confidence in a fanbase.

This smells of not wanting to pay for a proven DC.

Graham has never helped a team to a winning record. I'd rather chance it that Golden can do better even though we have nothing to go by.

I've lost all hope in a Oline coach hire that would move the needle. We'd probably get one from a fired coaching staff off a team with a bad oline.

[Frank Booth]

(01-16-2025, 07:09 PM)jj22 Wrote: Have to hope for Golden then. FO just doesn't know how to aspire any confidence in a fanbase.

This smells of not wanting to pay for a proven DC.

Graham has never helped a team to a winning record. I'd rather chance it that Golden can do better even though we have nothing to go by.

I've lost all hope in a Oline coach hire that would move the needle. We'd probably get one from a fired coaching staff off a team with a bad oline.

well yea those are the bargain bin boys

[SunsetBengal]

(01-16-2025, 06:52 PM)ERIC1 Wrote: Wow..I did not realize that it was necessary to be a " We"..stick to the issue at hand...why would al golden be a bad choice....thanks....me

I don't hate the guy, he's plenty experienced. Two stints as a HC at the college level, two stints as a DC at the college level, 5 years of position coaching in the NFL. I think that he would have been a great selection around the time Lou was hired. Now that we're trying to rejuvenate the defense to take advantage of Burrow's prime years, I guess I'm just looking for someone whose made more of a splash at the highest level of the game than 3 short stints as a position coach.

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(01-16-2025, 06:41 PM)samhain Wrote: I don't necessarily despise the Golden hire.  I'm just not convinced that it's the hire that makes this a championship defense.  

Also don't love that it plays into the idea Willie Anderson spoke of when it comes to coaches and hiring staff; ie most of the time these guys just hire their friends. Familiarity means more than just about anything, especially here.  

Golden has a fine defense at ND. He also has a roster with talent.  Even in a down year, ND is going to have the horses to go up against just about anyone outside of the  elite.  He's not getting that here.  The scheme and the execution will have to make up for a likely talent deficiency.  They aren't going to have the cap for major retooling.  There are only so many draft picks that will be day 1 starters.  

On top of talent, it sure seems like there was a culture issue on defense last year.  Poor discipline and lack of communication were pretty apparent.  Being out of shape and unfocused are issues that go beyond just the talent deficit. Is bringing in a guy that worked under the guy that lost the culture going to change it for the better?  Also no idea, but I think the question is fair.

Tell that to Jerry Faust.

[ERIC1]

(01-16-2025, 07:30 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: I don't hate the guy, he's plenty experienced. Two stints as a HC at the college level, two stints as a DC at the college level, 5 years of position coaching in the NFL. I think that he would have been a great selection around the time Lou was hired. Now that we're trying to rejuvenate the defense to take advantage of Burrow's prime years, I guess I'm just looking for someone whose made more of a splash at the highest level of the game than 3 short stints as a position coach.

Golden seems to be hitting his stride..If its true...we did good

[Essex Johnson]

(01-16-2025, 02:38 PM)Joelist Wrote: So down to the two worst candidates. Zero successful NFL DC experience. Probably someone with an actual successful track record in the NFL was out of their preferred price range. Leave it to the Bengals...

And why does that matter, we see many NFL DCs flame out with experience, Golden has tons of experience and was a successful LB coach while here and is one of the top college DC in the country.  How did it work out this year with Chargers hiring Minter from Michigan, he had never been a NFL DC either... i don;t see $$ as a problem, the Bengals as i have indicated have paid their coaches better than a majority of the teams

[ERIC1]

(01-16-2025, 10:03 PM)Essex Johnson Wrote: And why does that matter, we see many NFL DCs flame out with experience, Golden has tons of experience and was a successful LB coach while here and is one of the top college DC in the country.  How did it work out this year with Chargers hiring Minter from Michigan, he had never been a NFL DC either... i don;t see $$ as a problem, the Bengals as i have indicated have paid their coaches better than a majority of the teams

Yep....100%

[*bfine32*]

IDC if they bring in Who Dey to be DC. I applaud them seeing that what was in place wasn't working and they chose to make a change.

Many now complaining about who it "might be" are the same folks that said they wouldn't do anything because of "Bengals".

[Nicomo Cosca]

(01-16-2025, 10:36 PM)bfine32 Wrote: I applaud them

We know.

[*bfine32*]

(01-16-2025, 11:02 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: We know.

Ah, so you must have read my post that asserted the 2 things the Bengals should do for next season:

Fire Lou
Fire Frank

[Bengal Dude]

I figured Golden would be the top choice. When Lou was up for the AZ job, I pondered if Golden would be the guy to replace him. Lou had mentioned that Golden helped come up with the 3rd down packages and calls when he was here.

The only downside I see happening is Ohio State destroying the ND defense on Monday, and people are suddenly down on the hire because of one game.

[Au165]

(Yesterday, 02:14 AM)Bengal Dude Wrote: I figured Golden would be the top choice. When Lou was up for the AZ job, I pondered if Golden would be the guy to replace him. Lou had mentioned that Golden helped come up with the 3rd down packages and calls when he was here.

The only downside I see happening is Ohio State destroying the ND defense on Monday, and people are suddenly down on the hire because of one game.

Saban used to say often that in college great players make great teams. The OSU offense is an elite unit with NFL talent all over. I think the two outcomes are if Golden can slow it down he did a great job, if he can't that's when better players win out. ND runs a lot of man coverage and I am not sure they will get away with that on Jeremiah Smith, I could see them running split coverage with man opposite and then a zone scheme with zone matching to smiths side. 

[*Synric*]

(Yesterday, 10:20 AM)Au165 Wrote: Saban used to say often that in college great players make great teams. The OSU offense is an elite unit with NFL talent all over. I think the two outcomes are if Golden can slow it down he did a great job, if he can't that's when better players win out. ND runs a lot of man coverage and I am not sure they will get away with that on Jeremiah Smith, I could see them running split coverage with man opposite and then a zone scheme with zone matching to smiths side. 

It shouldn't be a surprise that Al Golden's defense is similar to Lou Anarumo's so the transition would be easier if they go that direction. 

[*ochocincos*]

Sometimes position coaches leave for other opportunities because the higher ups are already firmly in place and they have no room to advance in the current organization.

I wasn't overly thrilled with the LB performance when Golden was the LB coach, but he's done well at ND as the DC. Maybe DC is his calling.
After seeing Lou's defenses (vastly) underperform for the first 2 years and last 2 years in Cincy, I'm willing to take the gamble on a proven college DC.
Golden has more DC playcalling experience than Anarumo had when he became the DC.

I'd still prefer someone like Eberflus or Dennis Allen because of their NFL DC experience specifically, but the organization is familiar with Golden and he might be a better culture fit than one of these other guys we are clamoring for.
Being in alignment with your coworkers is an important thing too.

That's why you see quite a lot of companies hire people they have worked with in the past, especially in leadership positions, rather than always doing an extensive search and relying solely on the interview process.
As someone who has been interviewing and hiring people for 10+ years, I can say you can't always fully tell how a new hire will be once they get in the door. The interview process will only reveal so much.

[jj22]

My concern is how much of the credit for ND defense goes to Golden or the true defensive mastermind Marcus Freeman.