Golden has ALOT to fix

[ERIC1]

(03-27-2025, 09:52 AM)WeezyBengal Wrote: It's insane the depth you can go with your fanhood. 

My father in law is a huge Bengals fan. I'd consider him the bigest fan I know, emotionally attached to the team. Been a fan for 40 years. He watches every game, but isn't nearly as in depth as we are around here.

When I start talking to him about roster depth, cap structure, organizational issues, etc. His eyes just gloss over. He has no clue. 

We are like the 5% that are actually in the weeds. 

I have a been a fan since the teams inception..Perhaps when you father has eyes "glassed over" it because he just enjoys the team and does not want to play pretend GM, Coach or Salary Cap Expert..I think the people on this Board are pretty cool with their love and passion  for the team.  Yet, there is another whole world out there..That Being said...time for some spring golf and Pappy..Have a great day

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(03-27-2025, 09:43 AM)WeezyBengal Wrote: This is the biggest thing IMO. 

The talent just isn't there and the front office has done nothing about it. 

You saying Trey Hendrickson, BJ Hill, Dax Hill, Myles Murphy, DJ Turner, Kris Jenkins, McKinnley Jackson, Ossai, Jordan Battle are not
talented to me is a little insulting. These guys need coached up and could be more than fine to get us to being a decent Defense IMO.

[lone bengal]

I think we're putting to much faith in Golden and this dead cat bounce has made some fans delusional. Were going to see some fluff article soon about how are new offensive line coach can fix our guard problem when it's really more about terrible drafting and I kind of feel the same way on defense. They could literally just rewrite the same article they did for Jim Turner and Frank Pollack and just change the name. One player I do believe can benefit from a new scheme is Cam -Britt Taylor. There were so many plays last season were everyone was in the same defense and he was doing something completely different.

[sandwedge]

(03-29-2025, 11:17 AM)lone bengal Wrote: I think we're putting to much faith in Golden and this dead cat bounce has made some fans delusional. Were going to see some fluff article soon about how are new offensive line coach can fix our guard problem when it's really more about terrible drafting and I kind of feel the same way on defense. They could literally just rewrite the same article they did for Jim Turner and Frank Pollack and just change the name. One player I do believe can benefit from a new scheme is Cam -Britt Taylor. There were so many plays last season were everyone was in the same defense and he was doing something completely different.

That doesn't seem like a scheme problem, that seems more like a player that isn't that bright.

[lone bengal]

(03-29-2025, 11:47 AM)sandwedge Wrote: That doesn't seem like a scheme problem, that seems more like a player that isn't that bright.

Haha was debating on writing that but was trying to be somewhat positive. Guess he's shown flashes of being good the year prior. He was awful in zone this season and I know they ran it last year so not sure what happened to him. 

[sandwedge]

(03-29-2025, 11:55 AM)lone bengal Wrote: Haha was debating on writing that but was trying to be somewhat positive. Guess he's shown flashes of being good the year prior. He was awful in zone this season and I know they ran it last year so not sure what happened to him. 

He started off good last year, but then he took to running his mouth and it seem to start the downslide. 

[SunsetBengal]

(03-29-2025, 02:43 PM)sandwedge Wrote: He started off good last year, but then he took to running his mouth and it seem to start the downslide. 

Before Turner got injured, he was feeling rather jocular, wasn't he? Let's hope that they all can stay healthy, injury free, and learn to keep their damn mouths shut for a season.

[sandwedge]

(03-29-2025, 04:50 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Before Turner got injured, he was feeling rather jocular, wasn't he? Let's hope that they all can stay healthy, injury free, and learn to keep their damn mouths shut for a season.

I think it was right after the Chief's loss, he started pounding his chest. Quickly went to crap after that. Which is common when people overvalue themselves.

[Sled21]

(03-29-2025, 02:43 PM)sandwedge Wrote: He started off good last year, but then he took to running his mouth and it seem to start the downslide. 

I was about to say I think a lot of CTB's problems last year were more attitude than talent. That's why Lou benched him a couple of times for inconsistency. If he can be great on one play, he ought not suck on the next. I think his head got too big.

[Sled21]

(03-29-2025, 11:17 AM)lone bengal Wrote: I think we're putting to much faith in Golden and this dead cat bounce has made some fans delusional. Were going to see some fluff article soon about how are new offensive line coach can fix our guard problem when it's really more about terrible drafting and I kind of feel the same way on defense. They could literally just rewrite the same article they did for Jim Turner and Frank Pollack and just change the name. One player I do believe can benefit from a new scheme is Cam -Britt Taylor. There were so many plays last season were everyone was in the same defense and he was doing something completely different.

I wouldn't be too quick to dismiss what new coaching can bring to the table. Cody Ford has always been a so-so 3rd string player, so to speak. Last year he stepped up playing several line positions and was flat out solid. That's got to be coaching. Volson (yes I know everyone wants an upgrade, including me) has the strength and talent to be a starting guard if he learns to pick up stunts, etc. A new coach can (and I say can, not will) fix that. You never know, a new coach with a different view on techinique could fix some guys.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(03-30-2025, 01:51 PM)Sled21 Wrote: I wouldn't be too quick to dismiss what new coaching can bring to the table. Cody Ford has always been a so-so 3rd string player, so to speak. Last year he stepped up playing several line positions and was flat out solid. That's got to be coaching. Volson (yes I know everyone wants an upgrade, including me) has the strength and talent to be a starting guard if he learns to pick up stunts, etc. A new coach can (and I say can, not will) fix that. You never know, a new coach with a different view on techinique could fix some guys.

Agree. Coaching is a big deal. I like what I have heard of Peters, he had the least talented OL in the league to deal with on the Pats.

This is a more talented OL for sure. Mims is a great talent, Orlando ain't no slouch, Ted is solid and same with Lucas Patrick and we can 
add another talent easily. Who knows about Volson, I am about done with the guy, but he is our second most athletic OL if he can get his
head out of his ass on stunts like you say.

Matt Lee is a very good pass protecting IOL, just needs to gain some muscle and he is about as technically sound as it gets.

[007BengalsFan]

(03-27-2025, 01:27 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: You saying Trey Hendrickson, BJ Hill, Dax Hill, Myles Murphy, DJ Turner, Kris Jenkins, McKinnley Jackson, Ossai, Jordan Battle are not
talented to me is a little insulting. These guys need coached up and could be more than fine to get us to being a decent Defense IMO.

Hendrickson is great.  Hill is above average but nothing special.  The rest of those guys havent done much of anything. In their defense, most of the rest are young and could turn out to be really good football players.  At this point however, I dont see the defense having a lot of talent.  I would say our talent level is below average.  If our season started today with the current roster, I wouldnt expect Golden to have a good defense.  IMO, this defense still needs 3 or 4 additional guys for us to see real improvement.  I do think this will be addressed in the draft and ultimately I expect to see some good improvement from the defense this coming season so I am hopeful

[reuben.ahmed]

(03-26-2025, 01:40 PM)basballguy Wrote: I see threads like this and i'm reminded that no matter how much I think otherwise, I'm just a casual fan.  Never would I get bored and just go watch tape of Bengals players.

casual fan is me learning the yankes are using torpedo bats to hit 100 homeruns and still not interested in watching a full baseball game

[HarleyDog]

(03-26-2025, 01:40 PM)basballguy Wrote: I see threads like this and i'm reminded that no matter how much I think otherwise, I'm just a casual fan.  Never would I get bored and just go watch tape of Bengals players.

PornHub would'nt let that happen.

[falsestart]

I can't help but think about what transpired on this D last year. I was on the side of getting rid of Lou all year. I bring up one name on this D that really got me to thinking Lou was a big part of the problem. Dax Hill. I look back at his time in Cincinnati and think to myself, what a total waste of a talented player. First off he is drafted to replace a pretty good safety Jessie Bates. So basically he was used in dime packages and on special teams in year one. Year two seen him take over the starting roll at safety. Actually i would consider that as his rookie year sort of. With the loss of Bell and basically running out a career back up lining up next to him you got what you should of expected, a blah year. Lou had no trouble pointing the finger in the secondary at safety. Blaming miscommunication as the prime reason everything failed. We go out resign Bell and pick up Stone and Lou claims that those issues are fixed. Dax moves to corner in year 3 and becomes our best cover corner coming out training camp. Meanwhile the miscommunication in the secondary seems to have gotten even worse after the change. Dax ends up blowing his knee out and is out for the season. The D continued to go down hill after that. I often wondered what would have happened if he just would have stuck with Hill and Battle, after coming on his rookie year. I think their second year together in the secondary could have been a great year to grow into something special. But it was not to be. I look it at as a total waste of a player by a coach. Now there is talk of using Dax in the slot. Another position change in year 4 and not quite sure where Dax will eventually end up. He will probably be gone after this year for I don't think the Bengals will pick up his fifth year unless he somehow has a pro bowl caliber season. Could the same fate be in store for Murphy. Could be unless Goldin can save him.

[THE PISTONS]

(03-30-2025, 01:47 PM)Sled21 Wrote: I was about to say I think a lot of CTB's problems last year were more attitude than talent. That's why Lou benched him a couple of times for inconsistency. If he can be great on one play, he ought not suck on the next. I think his head got too big.

Attitude was part of it.

Some of it was in years past he was a 3rd or 4th CB. This year he was the guy. That went to his head. But, he's not a #1 CB at this point in his career play wise.

[THE PISTONS]

(04-01-2025, 01:04 AM)falsestart Wrote: I can't help but think about what transpired on this D last year. I was on the side of getting rid of Lou all year. I bring up one name on this D that really got me to thinking Lou was a big part of the problem. Dax Hill. I look back at his time in Cincinnati and think to myself, what a total waste of a talented player. First off he is drafted to replace a pretty good safety Jessie Bates. So basically he was used in dime packages and on special teams in year one. Year two seen him take over the starting roll at safety. Actually i would consider that as his rookie year sort of. With the loss of Bell and basically running out a career back up lining up next to him you got what you should of expected, a blah year. Lou had no trouble pointing the finger in the secondary at safety. Blaming miscommunication as the prime reason everything failed. We go out resign Bell and pick up Stone and Lou claims that those issues are fixed. Dax moves to corner in year 3 and becomes our best cover corner coming out training camp. Meanwhile the miscommunication in the secondary seems to have gotten even worse after the change. Dax ends up blowing his knee out and is out for the season. The D continued to go down hill after that. I often wondered what would have happened if he just would have stuck with Hill and Battle, after coming on his rookie year. I think their second year together in the secondary could have been a great year to grow into something special. But it was not to be. I look it at as a total waste of a player by a coach. Now there is talk of using Dax in the slot. Another position change in year 4 and not quite sure where Dax will eventually end up. He will probably be gone after this year for I don't think the Bengals will pick up his fifth year unless he somehow has a pro bowl caliber season. Could the same fate be in store for Murphy. Could be unless Goldin can save him.

The defense certainly had what I would call an odd scheme. Maybe overly complex in spots and too simplistic in others.

I'd see no pass rush and also receivers 5 yards open at every level routinely. Our players couldn't be that bad, could they?

[Joelist]

While some of the issues were indeed player based (like the lack of a true NT and bad tackling) and injuries certainly were a factor, the defensive scheme was just too complex and the players could not pick it up. Not only did it cause wrong reactions but if the calls and alignments are too complex it causes hesitation on defense. And when players are hesitating because they need to process how to react then you get wide open receivers.

Why did the defense suddenly improve after Week 12? Most of it was the scheme was simplified which cut that hesitation down a lot and also getting players obviously too gimped to be effective out of there. Part of why Lou had to go was it should not have taken him 12 games to change things.

[007BengalsFan]

(04-01-2025, 04:37 PM)Joelist Wrote: While some of the issues were indeed player based (like the lack of a true NT and bad tackling) and injuries certainly were a factor, the defensive scheme was just too complex and the players could not pick it up. Not only did it cause wrong reactions but if the calls and alignments are too complex it causes hesitation on defense. And when players are hesitating because they need to process how to react then you get wide open receivers.

Why did the defense suddenly improve after Week 12? Most of it was the scheme was simplified which cut that hesitation down a lot and also getting players obviously too gimped to be effective out of there. Part of why Lou had to go was it should not have taken him 12 games to change things.

How quick do you think Lou should have given up on his guys not being able to run his defense?  6 or 7 weeks?  Shouldnt you expect these guys to be able to pick up an NFL defense without needing it to be so simplified?   If Golden's defense is struggling after 6 or 7 weeks should he be blamed for not having a more simple defense too? or should the players be expected to learn what Golden wants them to do in his particular style defense?

[SunsetBengal]

(04-01-2025, 07:34 PM)007BengalsFan Wrote: How quick do you think Lou should have given up on his guys not being able to run his defense?  6 or 7 weeks?  Shouldnt you expect these guys to be able to pick up an NFL defense without needing it to be so simplified?   If Golden's defense is struggling after 6 or 7 weeks should he be blamed for not having a more simple defense too? or should the players be expected to learn what Golden wants them to do in his particular style defense?

Some of the best laid plans fail, simply because they are too overly complicated to be executed properly. Example? Bill Lazor was a mastermind offensive strategist, however his plays were so complicated with so many checks and options that a pretty decent Bengals offense could not run them effectively. Sometimes the best plan is the one that your players can execute to perfection. Let the scheme grow with the team, not the other way around.