California Passes SB 277 Forcing All Children To Get Vaccinated

[Belsnickel]

(05-19-2015, 02:31 PM)Benton Wrote: I used to know several people from southeast Asia. According to them, it's fairly common in some of their cultures to have kids and have them reared by the grandparents. One girl I knew had three kids, all back home. I was pretty surprised; I thought we were the only culture that had kids and dumped them off on our parents (at least, that seems to be the trend the last couple decades). She said it wasn't so much dumping off, it was just expected. You have kids, you go work to support the family (grandparents and kids included), then when you retire, you raise your grand kids.

That's actually very efficient if you think about it. A shame that our society could never make it work in the way that they do.

[SteelCitySouth]

(05-19-2015, 02:49 PM)Nebuchadnezzar Wrote: Zieg Heil there Adolf.

Stop it. I have no issues with Jewish people following our new child rearing rules here in the US.

[Benton]

(05-19-2015, 02:51 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: That's actually very efficient if you think about it. A shame that our society could never make it work in the way that they do.

Agreed. It's weird we're moving to that but for the opposite reasons.

Those cultures tend to put the family unit above the individual, so it makes sense for the parent to sacrifice spending time with their own kid to help provide for the family, while the grandparent sacrifices the "retired" years to rear a child.

On the flip side, our culture favors individual needs first, so we seem more and more ok with a parent leaving the child with the grand parents to have a successful career/go to college/graduate high school/have killer parties/whatever.

Personally, I see some strengths in it. My stepson is eight years older than my daughter. I didn't have the patience then, or the wisdom that comes with those eight years to be as good of a parent. Not that I failed him, but I wasn't as good of a parent to him as I am to my daughter because I lacked the skills that came with more time, more money, more life. On the flip side, my parents weren't the greatest. They had issues. But now, as grand parents, I see them as good role models.

[Belsnickel]

(05-19-2015, 03:10 PM)Benton Wrote: Agreed. It's weird we're moving to that but for the opposite reasons.

Those cultures tend to put the family unit above the individual, so it makes sense for the parent to sacrifice spending time with their own kid to help provide for the family, while the grandparent sacrifices the "retired" years to rear a child.

On the flip side, our culture favors individual needs first, so we seem more and more ok with a parent leaving the child with the grand parents to have a successful career/go to college/graduate high school/have killer parties/whatever.

Personally, I see some strengths in it. My stepson is eight years older than my daughter. I didn't have the patience then, or the wisdom that comes with those eight years to be as good of a parent. Not that I failed him, but I wasn't as good of a parent to him as I am to my daughter because I lacked the skills that came with more time, more money, more life. On the flip side, my parents weren't the greatest. They had issues. But now, as grand parents, I see them as good role models.

Exactly. There also is the work culture that exists that prevents this from happening. We live to work here, and as a result people work well into the retirement years of other cultures. Combine that with how we value needs and you will never be able to make it work in the way they do.

[StLucieBengal]

(05-19-2015, 01:26 PM)SteelCitySouth Wrote: This is quite do-able.  First we need to remove our misguided perception that children should be raised by the parents.  Once this thought is accepted we can then create whole communities where children, once born, are housed, raised, educated and overall cared for by those that want to do this as a job.  The children are not able to step foot into the adult society until they have reached certain age/standards.  Otherwise the rest of the adult population never encounters a child in society.

As for the old...Euthanasia....It's for the good of our time at McDonald's.

Yes the government should decide. After all the gov always knows best ... And parents can live their own lives with zero responsibility. And then kids are raised to know the gov with always see their needs met. And without the gov, their lives would be chaos.

[StLucieBengal]

(05-19-2015, 02:51 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: That's actually very efficient if you think about it. A shame that our society could never make it work in the way that they do.

Yeah such shame mothers have to stop working to care for their child. Taking care of their responsibilities or maintaining a proper family is such a terrible thing....

[StLucieBengal]

(05-19-2015, 02:51 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: That's actually very efficient if you think about it. A shame that our society could never make it work in the way that they do.

You know what else is efficient.... Mother raising children and running the family. Being the CEO of the family is the most important job.

[GMDino]

(05-19-2015, 03:58 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: Yeah such shame mothers have to stop working to care for their child.   Taking care of their responsibilities or maintaining a proper family is such a terrible thing....

Yes...a man should never do that. Women should.

[Benton]

(05-19-2015, 04:01 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: You know what else is efficient.... Mother raising children and running the family.   Being the CEO of  the family is the most important job.

That would be swell. If employers would go along with that and keep middle class salaries in pace with inflation and upper level incomes. But I don't think most companies are going to start tossing out 200-300% raises.

[SteelCitySouth]

(05-19-2015, 03:55 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: Yes the government should decide.  After all the gov always knows best ...  And parents can live their own lives with zero responsibility.  And then kids are raised to know the gov with always see their needs met. And without the gov, their lives would be chaos.

Please tell me you were not taking my suggestion for anything other than what it was.

[StLucieBengal]

(05-19-2015, 04:24 PM)SteelCitySouth Wrote: Please tell me you were not taking my suggestion for anything other than what it was.

Hence my as ridiculous response.

I thought it was funny lol

[StLucieBengal]

(05-19-2015, 04:18 PM)Benton Wrote: That would be swell. If employers would go along with that and keep middle class salaries in pace with inflation and upper level incomes. But I don't think most companies are going to start tossing out 200-300% raises.

Or maybe basic budgeting and not expecting a house or lifestyle like our parents at age 25.

[StLucieBengal]

(05-19-2015, 04:04 PM)GMDino Wrote: Yes...a man should never do that.  Women should.

Run the show at home?

That's Mother Nature who sets that.... Plus the mother is most in tune with her children.

[Belsnickel]

(05-19-2015, 04:18 PM)Benton Wrote: That would be swell. If employers would go along with that and keep middle class salaries in pace with inflation and upper level incomes. But I don't think most companies are going to start tossing out 200-300% raises.

Or even if we decided not to be the only developed western nation to not have paid maternity/paternity leave. That might help with the whole motherhood thing.

[StLucieBengal]

(05-19-2015, 04:54 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: Or even if we decided not to be the only developed western nation to not have paid maternity/paternity leave. That might help with the whole motherhood thing.

Why can't that be negotiated in an employment contract?

I agree that would be proper to have that option.

[Belsnickel]

(05-19-2015, 05:21 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: Why can't that be negotiated in an employment contract?

I agree that would be proper to have that option.

99.9% of employers won't go for it and women don't feel comfortable enough negotiating those things because they are already coming in at a disadvantage since they have a vagina.

I wish I was joking about this, but that's the way of corporate America.

[StLucieBengal]

(05-19-2015, 05:25 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: 99.9% of employers won't go for it and women don't feel comfortable enough negotiating those things because they are already coming in at a disadvantage since they have a vagina.

I wish I was joking about this, but that's the way of corporate America.

Well that's a shame.... But you have to be willing to hear the word No lol and being uncomfortable in any negotiation is reasonable.

Maybe these perks will be added once people start changing jobs because of them.

[StLucieBengal]

http://fortune.com/2015/02/05/paid-parental-leave-costs/

Just looked at the costs.... Seems a few states are already doing it... The problems might be with unionized groups. They already have insane amounts of time off.

A mom should get 90 days and a dad 20-30. At 50% pay.

[Belsnickel]

(05-19-2015, 05:39 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: http://fortune.com/2015/02/05/paid-parental-leave-costs/

Just looked at the costs.... Seems a few states are already doing it...   The problems might be with unionized groups.   They already have insane amounts of time off.  

A mom should get 90 days and a dad 20-30.   At 50% pay.

50% pay? There are 6 countries in the world that do it at 50% pay for paid maternity leave, none pay lower if it is paid. Those six are: Somalia, Libya, Botswana, Nigeria, Central African Republic, and Paraguay.

Now, don't get me wrong, these countries at least have paid maternity leave, so that makes it slightly more shameful that this country doesn't. But I think if we were going to do paid maternity leave, even at a state level, maybe we could do better than those 6 countries.

Edit: My bad, add Cambodia to that list.

[StLucieBengal]

(05-19-2015, 05:47 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: 50% pay? There are 6 countries in the world that do it at 50% pay for paid maternity leave, none pay lower if it is paid. Those six are: Somalia, Libya, Botswana, Nigeria, Central African Republic, and Paraguay.

Now, don't get me wrong, these countries at least have paid maternity leave, so that makes it slightly more shameful that this country doesn't. But I think if we were going to do paid maternity leave, even at a state level, maybe we could do better than those 6 countries.

Edit: My bad, add Cambodia to that list.

Idk the numbers on that so I don't wanna get into the weeds. But there shouldnt be any taxes or gov program to facilitate this .... NJ said it cost $1 a week per employee to run that. Wonder if you could find this yourself then the % could be based on that amount.... Tax free money ofc. This way the employer only loses your time instead time and money.