Posts: 7,811
Threads: 91
Reputation:
21123
Joined: Nov 2015
Mood: None
(03-07-2023, 10:39 PM)007BengalsFan Wrote: There are too many good TEs in this draft to use a 1st round pick on Mayer. Given his subpar 40 time at the combine he may be there in the 2nd round when the Bengals pick
I said if, but we lose Hurst it will be more pressing also I'm not thrilled with what might be out there at tackle at our pick, I actually think we go CB especially if we sign Hurst
Posts: 1,717
Threads: 10
Reputation:
9156
Joined: Apr 2020
Mood: None
(03-08-2023, 12:22 AM)Essex Johnson Wrote: I said if, but we lose Hurst it will be more pressing also I'm not thrilled with what might be out there at tackle at our pick, I actually think we go CB especially if we sign Hurst
I think good CBs are hard (and usually expensive) to land in free agency. I wouldnt mind a CB with the first round pick. That is a good value pick vs what it would take to land a good free agent. I wouldnt mind the 1st being used on just about any position on defense depending who we re-sign. Im just not a fan of taking a TE or RB with a 1st round draft pick unless you are getting a Travis Kelce or Barry Sanders and I dont think Mayer is Kelce.
I would be more disappointed with the Bengals using a 1st round draft pick on Mayer than I was when they used the 2nd round draft pick on Drew Sample. It seems a big waste of an opportunity.
Posts: 7,811
Threads: 91
Reputation:
21123
Joined: Nov 2015
Mood: None
(03-08-2023, 12:56 AM)007BengalsFan Wrote: I think good CBs are hard (and usually expensive) to land in free agency. I wouldnt mind a CB with the first round pick. That is a good value pick vs what it would take to land a good free agent. I wouldnt mind the 1st being used on just about any position on defense depending who we re-sign. Im just not a fan of taking a TE or RB with a 1st round draft pick unless you are getting a Travis Kelce or Barry Sanders and I dont think Mayer is Kelce.
I would be more disappointed with the Bengals using a 1st round draft pick on Mayer than I was when they used the 2nd round draft pick on Drew Sample. It seems a big waste of an opportunity.
We disagree on need for a TE and Mayer especially if Hurst not signed. Will be a interesting FA and draft..
Posts: 1,117
Threads: 44
Reputation:
5880
Joined: Mar 2017
Mood: None
If it makes you happier Brad, Malik said if Mayer is there, he's a Bengal
Posts: 10,553
Threads: 1,295
Reputation:
38637
Joined: May 2015
Location: Robbing Grandmas Of The Covid Vaccine In Northern Kentucky-Greater Cincinnati
Mood: None
(03-08-2023, 11:00 PM)WVUHomer Wrote: If it makes you happier Brad, Malik said if Mayer is there, he's a Bengal
The Yahoo mock that was emailed to me has us taking Mayer! Like I said, they noted that it's because of his poor 40 time.
I think it will be pretty big for us.
Posts: 6,276
Threads: 106
Reputation:
45077
Joined: May 2016
Mood: None
(03-08-2023, 11:00 PM)WVUHomer Wrote: If it makes you happier Brad, Malik said if Mayer is there, he's a Bengal
Mike Brown is reading the board and Brad got him excited for the Cincinnati-area boy.
Posts: 1,873
Threads: 117
Reputation:
11829
Joined: May 2015
Mood: None
I posted this in the TE thread but I believe it applies to this conversation as well. I am getting more and more onboard with waiting until the mid to late part of this draft and going after Brenton Strange...
The more I watch and research Brenton Strange the more I like him. He is extremely athletic and is an exceptional blocker. While the following are simple analytics consider them:
Hayden Hurst Brenton Strange
6'5" height 6'4"
250 weight 253
4.67 40 4.70
1.59 10 yd split 1.57
31.5" vertical 36"
10' broad jump 10'4"
7.19 3 cone 7.25
4.37 20 yd shut. 4.46
3 receiving TD* 10
12.8 yds per rec.* 10.7
* stats taken from 3 latest seasons as Hurst played 3 and Strange played 4.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RXueOhlfuhg
Strange has become lost in a very good class of TEs. Above the posted is a highlight video but watch how he makes himself visible to the QB when the QB is in trouble and watch his pure athletic ability, the football IQ he displays, and that he appears to be a pretty natural receiver.
Posts: 18,041
Threads: 454
Reputation:
112551
Joined: May 2015
Location: Nashville, TN
Mood: None
(03-09-2023, 01:08 PM)OSUfan Wrote: I posted this in the TE thread but I believe it applies to this conversation as well. I am getting more and more onboard with waiting until the mid to late part of this draft and going after Brenton Strange...
The more I watch and research Brenton Strange the more I like him. He is extremely athletic and is an exceptional blocker. While the following are simple analytics consider them:
Hayden Hurst Brenton Strange
6'5" height 6'4"
250 weight 253
4.67 40 4.70
1.59 10 yd split 1.57
31.5" vertical 36"
10' broad jump 10'4"
7.19 3 cone 7.25
4.37 20 yd shut. 4.46
3 receiving TD* 10
12.8 yds per rec.* 10.7
* stats taken from 3 latest seasons as Hurst played 3 and Strange played 4.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RXueOhlfuhg
Strange has become lost in a very good class of TEs. Above the posted is a highlight video but watch how he makes himself visible to the QB when the QB is in trouble and watch his pure athletic ability, the football IQ he displays, and that he appears to be a pretty natural receiver.
For comparison, Drew Sample:
height - 6'4"
weight - 255 lb
40 - 4.71
10 split - 1.64
vert - 33.5"
broad - 9'7"
3-cone - 7.15
shuttle - 4.31
YPR - 10.6
TDs - 5
Zac Taylor 2019-2020: 6 total wins
Zac Taylor 2021-2022: Double-digit wins each season, plus 5 postseason wins
Patience has paid off!
Sorry for Party Rocking!
Posts: 1,717
Threads: 10
Reputation:
9156
Joined: Apr 2020
Mood: None
(03-08-2023, 10:42 PM)Essex Johnson Wrote: We disagree on need for a TE and Mayer especially if Hurst not signed. Will be a interesting FA and draft..
We won every game when Hurst was out with his injury including the K.C. game where he got injured in the 1st quarter. So yes we disagree that Hurst or Mayer is some great need. When Hurst was out with his injury we didnt have our #1 TE in Hurst or #2 Drew Sample. We didnt need either of them to win games. The problem we did see however is what happens when you dont have quality Offensive linemen and depth. You can't win without them. Depth at TE meant nothing, depth on the Oline did. Using the 1st round draft pick on a TE would be a complete waste with the other more important needs this team has.
Posts: 1,873
Threads: 117
Reputation:
11829
Joined: May 2015
Mood: None
(03-09-2023, 01:31 PM)ochocincos Wrote: For comparison, Drew Sample:
height - 6'4"
weight - 255 lb
40 - 4.71
10 split - 1.64
vert - 33.5"
broad - 9'7"
3-cone - 7.15
shuttle - 4.31
YPR - 10.6
TDs - 5
"...makes himself visible to the QB when the QB is in trouble and watch his pure athletic ability, the football IQ he displays, and that he appears to be a pretty natural receiver."
This would be the major difference in comparing Sample to Hurst and Strange.
Posts: 24,731
Threads: 616
Reputation:
227480
Joined: May 2015
Location: Jackson, OH
Mood:
If the Bengals do go TE in the 1st, I sure as hell hope that it's Darnell Washington. With his blend of size and athleticism displayed at the combine, and when you watch his footage as a blocker, this guy could become the Bengals all-time great at TE. Red Zone nightmare for the next 12 years.
Yes, please.
Volson is meh, but I like him, and he has far exceeded my expectations
-Frank Booth 1/9/23
Posts: 7,421
Threads: 266
Reputation:
30357
Joined: May 2015
Mood: None
(03-09-2023, 03:59 PM)007BengalsFan Wrote: We won every game when Hurst was out with his injury including the K.C. game where he got injured in the 1st quarter. So yes we disagree that Hurst or Mayer is some great need. When Hurst was out with his injury we didnt have our #1 TE in Hurst or #2 Drew Sample. We didnt need either of them to win games. The problem we did see however is what happens when you dont have quality Offensive linemen and depth. You can't win without them. Depth at TE meant nothing, depth on the Oline did. Using the 1st round draft pick on a TE would be a complete waste with the other more important needs this team has.
Really? Never thought about that Hurst W/L stuff. I know they sure didn't seem urgent in upgrading TE depth last year.
This one kind of feels like the Gresham draft. Which was a year 20 TEs were drafted.
4 times 2 have gone in the first since 2000
2 times 3 have gone in the first since 2000
Maxed out at 24 total TEs drafted in one year since 2000. Hit 20 total only two more times since 2000.
There were 20 invited to the combine this year it looks like.
Posts: 3,420
Threads: 238
Reputation:
14190
Joined: Oct 2016
Mood: None
(03-09-2023, 09:08 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: If the Bengals do go TE in the 1st, I sure as hell hope that it's Darnell Washington. With his blend of size and athleticism displayed at the combine, and when you watch his footage as a blocker, this guy could become the Bengals all-time great at TE. Red Zone nightmare for the next 12 years.
Yes, please.
I could not have stated it better. The Bengals need a TE that will make defenses pay when they give
Chase and Higgins double coverage
At 6'7 JB can throw it where only Washington
Can grab it. Washington can be a real difference maker on those 3rd and whatever situations
The Bengals haven't had a true difference maker
At TE since who...Dan Ross?
Posts: 12,764
Threads: 128
Reputation:
82439
Joined: May 2015
Mood: None
(03-10-2023, 10:52 AM)impactplaya Wrote: I could not have stated it better. The Bengals need a TE that will make defenses pay when they give
Chase and Higgins double coverage
At 6'7 JB can throw it where only Washington
Can grab it. Washington can be a real difference maker on those 3rd and whatever situations
The Bengals haven't had a true difference maker
At TE since who...Dan Ross?
COULD be a real difference maker. There is still a ton of projection for Darnell Washington as a receiver. Washington has 2 less catches in his 27 game career than Luke Musgrave in his 20 game career.
Testing is fun and we get to see players showcase their skillset but it always goes back to the tape. I hope Kincaid and Washington go first to let the best TE in the class fall into their hands at 28... Michael Mayer.
I have the Heart of a Lion! I also have a massive fine and a lifetime ban from the Pittsburgh Zoo...
Posts: 24,731
Threads: 616
Reputation:
227480
Joined: May 2015
Location: Jackson, OH
Mood:
(03-10-2023, 11:15 AM)Synric Wrote: COULD be a real difference maker. There is still a ton of projection for Darnell Washington as a receiver. Washington has 2 less catches in his 27 game career than Luke Musgrave in his 20 game career.
Testing is fun and we get to see players showcase their skillset but it always goes back to the tape. I hope Kincaid and Washington go first to let the best TE in the class fall into their hands at 28... Michael Mayer.
Yeah, just imagine what Washington's stats could have been, had he not had to share the role with a phenom like Brock Bowers? Washington's low number of receptions isn't due to a lack of talent on his part, just not enough balls to go around is more like it.
Volson is meh, but I like him, and he has far exceeded my expectations
-Frank Booth 1/9/23
Posts: 12,764
Threads: 128
Reputation:
82439
Joined: May 2015
Mood: None
(03-10-2023, 11:24 AM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Yeah, just imagine what Washington's stats could have been, had he not had to share the role with a phenom like Brock Bowers? Washington's low number of receptions isn't due to a lack of talent on his part, just not enough balls to go around is more like it.
And think of what Luke Musgrave's final year would have been like if he hadn't been injured.
Both of these guys you have to go find tape see what they do as a receiver and project that skill set into the NFL. Michael Mayer there is way less projection dude is polished has a great release package understands defenses and has been the dude in this offense for 2 seasons.
I'm a fan of Washington, Musgrave, and Kincaid but Mayer is the top TE in the class. Prospect fatigue is what we are seeing lately.
I have the Heart of a Lion! I also have a massive fine and a lifetime ban from the Pittsburgh Zoo...
Posts: 3,420
Threads: 238
Reputation:
14190
Joined: Oct 2016
Mood: None
Washington's height and catch radius is what
Makes him my number 1 TE in this draft.
If a player has certain intangibles that you cannot
Simply coach then in some aspects that's a huge
Huge bonus. And it doesn't hurt he comes
From a university that is really a NFL minor league
Football roster. Those Bulldogs get drafted and they are
Ready to produce Day 1. Not year 3.
Posts: 6,276
Threads: 106
Reputation:
45077
Joined: May 2016
Mood: None
Regardless of which player is the best, if the Bengals want a TE in round 1 there is a good possibility Mayer, Musgrave, or Washington make it to pick 28.
Posts: 12,764
Threads: 128
Reputation:
82439
Joined: May 2015
Mood: None
(03-10-2023, 12:05 PM)impactplaya Wrote: Washington's height and catch radius is what
Makes him my number 1 TE in this draft.
If a player has certain intangibles that you cannot
Simply coach then in some aspects that's a huge
Huge bonus. And it doesn't hurt he comes
From a university that is really a NFL minor league
Football roster. Those Bulldogs get drafted and they are
Ready to produce Day 1. Not year 3.
Players produce when they play he has 27 games as a college player. His height and length make him more intriguing as a receiver but because of his size he might be forced inside in a 12 heavy personnel play action offense. His size makes it hard for him to snap off quick breaking routes he will run a ton of in a 11 personnel heavy spread.
I was a Jelani Woods fan last year same type of player but I was also thinking heavy wide zone where a big move blocking TE would be a major weapon... in the offense we seen last year I would lean heavier toward Mayer Kincaid Musgrave and LaPorta... Kraft is interesting because I still havent seen him drop his hips.
Edit: This reminds me of the Faalele argument I had with people last year. Measurements are only part of the info you get on these guys and tape is the most important peice. Michael Mayer has the best tape of any TE in this draft class and up there with any player in the draft class.
I have the Heart of a Lion! I also have a massive fine and a lifetime ban from the Pittsburgh Zoo...
Posts: 1,117
Threads: 44
Reputation:
5880
Joined: Mar 2017
Mood: None
(03-10-2023, 12:13 PM)Synric Wrote: Players produce when they play he has 27 games as a college player. His height and length make him more intriguing as a receiver but because of his size he might be forced inside in a 12 heavy personnel play action offense. His size makes it hard for him to snap off quick breaking routes he will run a ton of in a 11 personnel heavy spread.
I was a Jelani Woods fan last year same type of player but I was also thinking heavy wide zone where a big move blocking TE would be a major weapon... in the offense we seen last year I would lean heavier toward Mayer Kincaid Musgrave and LaPorta... Kraft is interesting because I still havent seen him drop his hips.
Edit: This reminds me of the Faalele argument I had with people last year. Measurements are only part of the info you get on these guys and tape is the most important peice. Michael Mayer has the best tape of any TE in this draft class and up there with any player in the draft class.
A little disappointed you didn't list Durham but its all good lol.
|