Terrorist act in Orlando

[Belsnickel]

(06-13-2016, 11:29 PM)tigerseye Wrote: Terrorist kills 49 or 50. To bad no one had a concealed gun to take that guy down and save perhaps everybodys life but his.(we will never know unfortunately)

I don't know the laws in Florida, but I know here in Virginia that if you are imbibing at a bar and carrying concealed then you are doing so unlawfully. And that is a restriction I am in complete agreement with. Not to say that someone couldn't have been armed there, or shouldn't, but if you've taken a drink your firearm should be locked away.

(06-13-2016, 11:41 PM)GMDino Wrote: http://www.towleroad.com/2016/06/report-orlando-shooter-regular-gay-nightclub-pulse-ga/

Maybe another closeted guy who rather that live his life felt too threatened and turned it into anger?

I heard there was a coworker that said he had claimed ties to Hezbollah, Al Qaeda, and IS. Which is interesting because Hezbollah is an enemy of the other two because of the Shi'ia/Sunni issues. If this is true it is evidence that shows he was less of a devout extremist and more of a mentally troubled individual. But I'm not sure how much credibility this has as I haven't looked into it beyond hearing it on the radio.

[Griever]

(06-14-2016, 10:19 AM)Belsnickel Wrote: I don't know the laws in Florida, but I know here in Virginia that if you are imbibing at a bar and carrying concealed then you are doing so unlawfully. And that is a restriction I am in complete agreement with. Not to say that someone couldn't have been armed there, or shouldn't, but if you've taken a drink your firearm should be locked away.


I heard there was a coworker that said he had claimed ties to Hezbollah, Al Qaeda, and IS. Which is interesting because Hezbollah is an enemy of the other two because of the Shi'ia/Sunni issues. If this is true it is evidence that shows he was less of a devout extremist and more of a mentally troubled individual. But I'm not sure how much credibility this has as I haven't looked into it beyond hearing it on the radio.

from waht ive seen those are true, and was the cause of one of his FBI investigations

[GMDino]

I started a thread over on Facebook about the shooter which resulted in a great conversation that I will make a different thread about.

But what I was saying there was I hope this shooter's legacy is he was a closeted homosexual.

Not because that is wrong or that being gay is wrong.  But because he will be forever remembered as someone who didn't like them being allowed to be themselves when is religion/politics/family told him he could not.


I want to start a campaign that he did this because his culture made him hate himself.

[*bfine32*]

(06-14-2016, 09:58 AM)Griever Wrote: facts usually are

Dang 2 for 2. I'm gonna leave you alone; you're on fire.

[BigPapaKain]

(06-14-2016, 10:19 AM)Belsnickel Wrote: I don't know the laws in Florida, but I know here in Virginia that if you are imbibing at a bar and carrying concealed then you are doing so unlawfully. And that is a restriction I am in complete agreement with. Not to say that someone couldn't have been armed there, or shouldn't, but if you've taken a drink your firearm should be locked away.


I heard there was a coworker that said he had claimed ties to Hezbollah, Al Qaeda, and IS. Which is interesting because Hezbollah is an enemy of the other two because of the Shi'ia/Sunni issues. If this is true it is evidence that shows he was less of a devout extremist and more of a mentally troubled individual. But I'm not sure how much credibility this has as I haven't looked into it beyond hearing it on the radio.

The radio show I listen to said all that and that he basically started breaking down in school after 9/11, celebrating the attack and every successful attack afterwards no matter the group or person carrying out the attack.

I don't think he was a member of the IS, so much as (and as you put it) a mentally troubled individual. Not that terrorists as a whole aren't mentally unstable.

[Griever]

another question is was he actually alone in the shooting, or were there others involved

[SteelCitySouth]

(06-14-2016, 10:59 AM)Griever Wrote: another question is was he actually alone in the shooting, or were there others involved

I believe that when it's all sorted out we will find evidence that some family member's knew about his plans.  Possibly his current wife, sister(s) and more than likely his father.  Given what we do know of his personality and they way he treated the people around him, his fathers portrayal of him is either  by a man that is completely blind to his son or one that is a compete fabrication.  I am more inclined to believe the latter.

[Rotobeast]

(06-14-2016, 09:12 AM)GMDino Wrote: Trained officers were on the scene.  He managed to get away, go inside and take hostages.

How is John Wayne in a dark club (or a dozen of them) going to make it any better?

Full disclosure:  I am not against concealed carry.  I am not against owning weapons.  I don't understand the need for the biggest and the fastest shooting when you are out to dinner at Denny's with your grandmother but if that is what turns you on go for it.

I just do not believe that everyone having a gun makes any situation any safer.

I don't know the layout of the club and ect...
I will not sit here and ramble about hypotheticals, except for that maybe the bouncers or bartender should have been trained and packing (providing it's legal in FL).

It's a scenario that we both wish we could change, even though we have different ideas on how to do so.

[GMDino]

http://ncronline.org/blogs/ncr-today/florida-bishop-orlando-attack-sadly-religion-often-breeds-contempt-lgbt-people

Quote:Florida bishop on Orlando attack: Sadly, religion 'often breeds contempt' for LGBT people


In the wake of the terrorist attack on a gay Orlando nightclub, St. Petersburg, Fla., Bishop Robert Lynch lamented the role religion has played in breeding contempt for the LGBT community.


“Sadly it is religion, including our own, which targets, mostly verbally, and also often breeds contempt for gays, lesbians and transgender people,” Lynch wrote on his blog Monday. “Attacks today on LGBTmen and women often plant the seed of contempt, then hatred, which can ultimately lead to violence.”

The bishop’s comments came a day after a gunman, Omar Saddiqui Mateen, killed at least 49 peopleand injured another 53 early Sunday morning at Pulse, a gay nightclub in Orlando. While the federal investigation into Mateen’s motives is not complete, his father has told media outlets his son had recently expressed anti-gay sentiments.

“Those women and men who were mowed down early yesterday morning were all made in the image and likeness of God,” Lynch said. “We teach that. We should believe that. We must stand for that.”

Lynch, 75, began the blog post saying he wrote “with a heavy heart,” and that a day earlier he could only muster a sympathetic text to neighboring Bishop John Noonan of Orlando. The St. Petersburg bishop offered his prayers for those who died and who are still in recovery. 


In a statement Sunday, New Ways Ministry, a national Catholic LGBT outreach ministry, criticized church leaders that omitted references to the lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender community in their conciliatory statements. 

“The Orlando murders should move all Catholic leaders to reflect on how their silence about homophobic and transphobic attitudes and violence contributes to behaviors which treat LGBT people as less than human and deserving of punishment. This sad moment in our history should become a time when Catholic leaders speak loudly and clearly, with one voice, that attacks on LGBT people must stop,” said its executive director Frank DeBernardo.

Lynch has previously spoken out against anti-gay sentiments and has advocated a greater pastoral response to same-sex couples.
“I do not wish to lend our voice to notions which might suggest that same-sex couples are a threat incapable of sharing relationships marked by love and holiness and, thus, incapable of contributing to the edification of both the church and the wider society,” he wrote in a January 2015 op-ed column following Florida’s legalization of same-sex marriage.

In his blog Monday, the bishop also echoed calls for a ban on the sale of all assault weapons, which he said extended beyond the scope that the Constitution authors envisioned when adding the Second Amendment to the Bill of Rights.

“If one is truly pro-life, then embrace this issue also and work for the elimination of sales to those who would turn them on innocents,” the bishop said.

Lastly, Lynch labeled attempts to bar Muslim people from entering the U.S. as “un-American, even in these most challenging of times and situations.”

“Singling out people for victimization because of their religion, their sexual orientation, their nationality must be offensive to God’s ears. It has to stop also,” he said.

Someone gets it.

[BigPapaKain]

(06-14-2016, 12:21 PM)GMDino Wrote: http://ncronline.org/blogs/ncr-today/florida-bishop-orlando-attack-sadly-religion-often-breeds-contempt-lgbt-people








Someone gets it.

A drop in an ocean.

Still, it's a good sign.

[XenoMorph]

https://investmentwatchblog.com/the-math-that-doesnt-add-up-orlando-shooting/

thought this was a little interesting

[XenoMorph]

(06-14-2016, 11:05 AM)SteelCitySouth Wrote: I believe that when it's all sorted out we will find evidence that some family member's knew about his plans.  Possibly his current wife, sister(s) and more than likely his father.  Given what we do know of his personality and they way he treated the people around him, his fathers portrayal of him is either  by a man that is completely blind to his son or one that is a compete fabrication.  I am more inclined to believe the latter.

I sure a lot of parents live in denial of who their kids truly are  keeping that prefect image of them in their head. 

[Griever]

(06-14-2016, 12:43 PM)XenoMorph Wrote: https://investmentwatchblog.com/the-math-that-doesnt-add-up-orlando-shooting/

thought this was a little interesting

thats why i mentioned about if he was alone or not

[Belsnickel]

(06-14-2016, 11:05 AM)SteelCitySouth Wrote: I believe that when it's all sorted out we will find evidence that some family member's knew about his plans.  Possibly his current wife, sister(s) and more than likely his father.  Given what we do know of his personality and they way he treated the people around him, his fathers portrayal of him is either  by a man that is completely blind to his son or one that is a compete fabrication.  I am more inclined to believe the latter.

You nailed it: http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/orlando-nightclub-massacre/omar-mateen-s-wife-tried-talk-him-out-orlando-attack-n592051?cid=sm_tw&hootPostID=1631d0b4632c0a40025001e8aec55bcf

[Griever]

sounds like she needs some charges brought against her

[SteelCitySouth]

(06-14-2016, 12:47 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: You nailed it: http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/orlando-nightclub-massacre/omar-mateen-s-wife-tried-talk-him-out-orlando-attack-n592051?cid=sm_tw&hootPostID=1631d0b4632c0a40025001e8aec55bcf

This only make me believe even more that his father and possibly his sister(s) were involved as well.  If this report is accurate she should be tried as an accomplice and be held fully responsible for the shootings.

[*bfine32*]

(06-14-2016, 12:58 PM)SteelCitySouth Wrote: This only make me believe even more that his father and possibly his sister(s) were involved as well.  If this report is accurate she should be tried as an accomplice and be held fully responsible for the shootings.

You mean there could be more than one "metally unstable" person or are you suggesting they they may all have an ideology instilled in them?

[SteelCitySouth]

(06-14-2016, 01:06 PM)bfine32 Wrote: You mean there could be more than one "metally unstable" person or are you suggesting they they may all have an ideology instilled in them?

I believe, and could be wrong, that the Father is the real evil.  

[*bfine32*]

(06-14-2016, 01:13 PM)SteelCitySouth Wrote: I believe, and could be wrong, that the Father is the real evil.  

I agree, it is a possibility. I've read where he is a supporter of the Taliban and wants to run for President of Afghanistan. His whole first excuse of "He got mad when he saw gays kissing in Miami" made zero sense.

[XenoMorph]

(06-14-2016, 12:47 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: You nailed it: http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/orlando-nightclub-massacre/omar-mateen-s-wife-tried-talk-him-out-orlando-attack-n592051?cid=sm_tw&hootPostID=1631d0b4632c0a40025001e8aec55bcf

if she knew she is definitely an accomplish... and she wouldn't try to talk him out of something she didn't know about.