The Left At It Again

[*bfine32*]

(03-13-2016, 09:40 PM)BmorePat87 Wrote: I don't think anything I said was hypocritical or trying to paint him in a bad light.

Of course you don't think anything you said is hypocritical. You most likely think you are making great points; but that doesn't change what you are actually saying.

[GMDino]

(03-13-2016, 09:42 PM)Sovereign Nation Wrote: I think it was inferred and I do remember seeing one quote from someone that said Bfine supported Trump, even though he has been on record saying repeatedly that he doesn't support him.

Was I asking you?  

[BmorePat87]

(03-13-2016, 09:46 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Of course you don't think anything you said is hypocritical. You most likely think you are making great points; but that doesn't change what you are actually saying.

That he could have still talked after kicking out the protestors from a private event, or, in response to claims of disguised attendees being why he couldn't do what I suggested, that he have better security so that he could?

I still don't see how suggesting he expel protestors with better security and just talk is overly critical or hypocritical. Maybe you could shed some light instead of just giving a generic response. 

[Sovereign Nation]

(03-13-2016, 09:40 PM)BmorePat87 Wrote: I don't think anything I said was hypocritical or trying to paint him in a bad light. Instead of whining about people "silencing" him, maybe he could have just talked. He should get a handle on his own events, because there will be more like this if he doesn't tone down the rhetoric.

As I have said, When will Bernie Sanders be asked to denounce the people who did this?

It seems as if everyone has certain rules they want Trump to follow, but they don't extend those rules to the other candidates.

Trump was criticized for not pledging support for the winner of the GOP nomination right away.  He later makes the pledge and now that he is the front runner, the GOP is talking about not backing him.

Trump has had to denounce David Duke and the KKK.  While Sanders doesn't have to denounce BLM or Thomas Dimassimo.

Instead of blaming Trump, why not actually look at the people that decided to go to his rally with the intent to disrupt it and cause a scene.

[Sovereign Nation]

(03-13-2016, 09:48 PM)GMDino Wrote: Was I asking you?  

No, but when has that ever stopped someone from responding?

[BmorePat87]

(03-13-2016, 09:57 PM)Sovereign Nation Wrote: As I have said, When will Bernie Sanders be asked to denounce the people who did this?

It seems as if everyone has certain rules they want Trump to follow, but they don't extend those rules to the other candidates.

Trump was criticized for not pledging support for the winner of the GOP nomination right away.  He later makes the pledge and now that he is the front runner, the GOP is talking about not backing him.

Trump has had to denounce David Duke and the KKK.  While Sanders doesn't have to denounce BLM or Thomas Dimassimo.

Instead of blaming Trump, why not actually look at the people that decided to go to his rally with the intent to disrupt it and cause a scene.

If anyone was wearing Bernie gear and acting out in violence, he should. I haven't seen that yet. I have seen Trump supporters assault protestors and Trump condone it.

I guess we're assuming the protestors were Bernie supporters, but their actions should only be denounced if they're violent. Simply protesting a Trump rally isn't bad.

[*bfine32*]

(03-13-2016, 09:54 PM)BmorePat87 Wrote: That he could have still talked after kicking out the protestors from a private event, or, in response to claims of disguised attendees being why he couldn't do what I suggested, that he have better security so that he could?

I still don't see how suggesting he expel protestors with better security and just talk is overly critical or hypocritical. Maybe you could shed some light instead of just giving a generic response.

The hypocrisy comes for blaming him for having his voice silenced through coercion. The security is provided by the venue, but I find it 2 funny that you suggest his security is to blame.

Just so we are clear and don't accidentally confuse you with a hypocrite again: Do you think Trump and his security should be more forceful with these "protester"?

He canceled the event out of fear for the safety of those in attendance. Folks are having a hard time blaming this on Trump; but they are still trying real hard.

[Sovereign Nation]

(03-13-2016, 10:03 PM)BmorePat87 Wrote: If anyone was wearing Bernie gear and acting out in violence, he should. I haven't seen that yet. I have seen Trump supporters assault protestors and Trump condone it.

I guess we're assuming the protestors were Bernie supporters, but their actions should only be denounced if they're violent. Simply protesting a Trump rally isn't bad.

Oh, so now they have to wear Bernie gear?  Funny how Duke didn't have Trump gear and has even been critical of Trump.

Trump supporters have kicked out protesters that haven't been as peaceful as the media has portrayed.  That black girl that Heimbach pushed?  An earlier video shows her grabbing signs from people and ripping them up, before everyone told her to leave.

The protesters are Bernie supporters and Sanders has condoned the violence that has been reported upon. 

[Bengalholic]

In the words of Doc Holliday, Trump's hypocrisy "knows no bounds"...





When one of Trump's supporters does something stupid/violent (during his own event)...it's because they “obviously love the country".

http://www.nytimes.com/politics/first-draft/2016/03/13/donald-trump-says-he-may-pay-legal-fees-of-accused-attacker/

[Sovereign Nation]

(03-13-2016, 10:21 PM)Bengalholic Wrote: In the words of Doc Holliday, Trump's hypocrisy "knows no bounds"...





When one of Trump's supporters does something stupid/violent (during his own event)...it's because they “obviously love the country".

http://www.nytimes.com/politics/first-draft/2016/03/13/donald-trump-says-he-may-pay-legal-fees-of-accused-attacker/

So this man attacked a Bernie Supporter at a Bernie rally?  Or was the incident at a Trump rally?

Either way, the attack was deplorable.  It was a sucker punch, much in the vein of the knockout game that is a favorite pass time of some youths in this country.

[*bfine32*]

(03-13-2016, 10:21 PM)Bengalholic Wrote: In the words of Doc Holliday, Trump's hypocrisy "knows no bounds"...





When one of Trump's supporters does something stupid/violent (during his own event)...it's because they “obviously love the country".

http://www.nytimes.com/politics/first-draft/2016/03/13/donald-trump-says-he-may-pay-legal-fees-of-accused-attacker/

Credit given for another attempt to blame Trump for these recent activities. I think they call that the two wrongs make a right fallacy. But keep your mind open.

[BmorePat87]

(03-13-2016, 10:04 PM)bfine32 Wrote: The hypocrisy comes for blaming him for having his voice silenced through coercion. The security is provided by the venue, but I find it 2 funny that you suggest his security is to blame.

He is responsible for his actions just as all of us are. He made the decision to not talk. I also suggested he merely pay for better security than what was there if he wasn't able to control it. Do you disagree that he would need that in the future given what is happening at his rallies? 

Quote:Just so we are clear and don't accidentally confuse you with a hypocrite again: Do you think Trump and his security should be more forceful with these "protester"?

If someone is at a private event and refuses to leave when asked to, then the appropriate amount of force needed to evict them is justified. He paid for the venue (I assume). It was his event. No one has the right to be there and protest. It's not like it was in public.

Quote:He canceled the event out of fear for the safety of those in attendance. Folks are having a hard time blaming this on Trump; but they are still trying real hard.

He has said that he thinks protestors should get hurt and the result has been unprovoked assault by his supporters on protestors. It's fair to say he doesn't give a shit about the safety of anyone but himself. I think he canceled it because it was clear that the protestors outnumbered his followers, and he wouldn't be able to just have them pushed around and punched as they were escorted out. 

I'll say this about Trump. I think he is condoning violence and hatred. I think he likes it because every time a protestor is taken out, his followers see it as an attack on their way of life. 

[BmorePat87]

(03-13-2016, 10:20 PM)Sovereign Nation Wrote: Oh, so now they have to wear Bernie gear?  

I think it's unfair to suggest someone is a Bernie supporter unless we know they are. Same with a Trump supporter. Hell, a sign would suffice. 

Quote:Funny how Duke didn't have Trump gear and has even been critical of Trump.

What does this have to do with anything? He's a former KKK leader who endorsed Trump. Is it fair to suggest Trump has to denounce every awful human who publicly endorses him? No, I'll give the man that. He should take responsibility for the tone of his rallies, though. He is saying things like "I'd like to punch him" or "they'd leave in a stretcher" in response to protestors. 

Quote:Trump supporters have kicked out protesters that haven't been as peaceful as the media has portrayed.  That black girl that Heimbach pushed?  An earlier video shows her grabbing signs from people and ripping them up, before everyone told her to leave.

Whoa, my bad. I didn't realize that young woman ripped a sign. Those older men were definitely justified in shoving her.

What about the dude who sucker punched a protestor in the face as the protestor was being escorted out? Trump said he might pay the guy's legal fees. OK to sucker punch people or not ok?

Quote:The protesters are Bernie supporters and Sanders has condoned the violence that has been reported upon. 

Hey, if they turn out to be Bernie supporters, I'm with you. Bernie should denounce anyone who tries to represent his misguided movement by getting into fights. 

[*bfine32*]

(03-13-2016, 10:50 PM)BmorePat87 Wrote: I think it's unfair to suggest someone is a Bernie supporter unless we know they are. Same with a Trump supporter. Hell, a sign would suffice. 

 

Does this suffice?

[Bengalholic]

(03-13-2016, 10:27 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Credit given for another attempt to blame Trump for these recent activities. I think they call that the two wrongs make a right fallacy. But keep your mind open.

Damn brother, your response leads me to believe that you didn't bother to watch the video or read the article. I don't support Sanders or Trump. Any acts of violence or intimidation from any of their followers is f'd up and ignorant. My post wasn't about 'blame'...it was about the insane hypocrisy that is Donald Trump.

When I see Trump complaining about protesters causing trouble, inciting violence, trying to silence him, etc... and then see him encourage and offer to pay legal fees for his supporters when they act equally stupid (saying their actions are because they love their country)...well, that's incredible hypocrisy, wouldn't you agree. 

And you're right, two wrongs don't make a right...they make two wrongs. 

[*bfine32*]

(03-13-2016, 11:26 PM)Bengalholic Wrote: Damn brother, your response leads me to believe that you didn't bother to watch the video or read the article.

I did watch the Jimmy Dore video and it appears you should be having a discussion with Pat as you two are at opposite ends. Pat suggests Trump and his security should do more while you and your link suggests the do too much. it seems Trump's campaign has a hard time pleasing anyone that is opposed to him;  obviously not saying you are, just in general. 

I look forward to you and Pat discussing your differences on this issue in a genuine and unbiased manner. 

[Benton]

(03-13-2016, 10:27 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Credit given for another attempt to blame Trump for these recent activities. I think they call that the two wrongs make a right fallacy. But keep your mind open.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_dBaaK15NDE

Two wrongs make a right? WTF? He's telling people to get physical. Someone gets physical. Where's the "two wrongs"?

Hint: there's one wrong, it's him telling people to be physical and he'll make it all better.

[*bfine32*]

(03-13-2016, 11:40 PM)Benton Wrote: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_dBaaK15NDE

Two wrongs make a right? WTF? He's telling people to get physical. Someone gets physical. Where's the "two wrongs"?

Hint: there's one wrong, it's him telling people to be physical and he'll make it all better.

So you and Pat are at odds on this issue as well. Why didn't you bring this up with him?

[Benton]

(03-13-2016, 11:44 PM)bfine32 Wrote: So you and Pat are at odds on this issue as well. Why didn't you bring this up with him?

Being obtuse doesn't make you clever or endearing.

[*bfine32*]

(03-13-2016, 11:48 PM)Benton Wrote: Being obtuse doesn't make you clever or endearing.

Do you want to expound or just go with the insults?

Pat has mentioned in this very thread that Trump should do more in the way of security and you have suggested he is doing too much. 

But I blame me.