(06-20-2015, 10:45 AM)fredtoast Wrote: Funny how the same people who claim the supporting cast does not matter were the same ones saying that the only reason dalton was so good in '13 was because he had the best receivers in the league.
Good QBs need good receivers. Favre wanted out of Green Bay because they would not re-sign his top receivers. In 2013 Brady was a below average QB when Gronk was out with injury.
People who don't understand how a QB needs receivers just does not understand how the NFL works.
The quality of the team matters a lot. But the Bengals have provided Dalton with a better supporting cast than most QBs get.
He's got a very good OL, certainly a top 5 line.
He's got a pretty good running game, top 10 easily.
He's got AJ Green as a #1 and believe me you can do much worse.
He's got RBs who are good receivers. Hill, Bernard and Burkhead are all good at catching the ball out of the backfield.
Sanu is a good slot guy and unfortunately he had to fill the #1 spot for a few games.
Gresham played decently last year. He'll never be a Rob Gronkowski or Jimmy Graham.
What Dalton doesn't have is a top notch coaching staff and he doesn't have good #4, 5 or 6 receivers. How Tate remains with this team baffles me. And I swear the Bengals used a Weegie board when deciding to sign Little.
(06-21-2015, 11:49 AM)BengalChris Wrote: The quality of the team matters a lot. But the Bengals have provided Dalton with a better supporting cast than most QBs get.
He's got a very good OL, certainly a top 5 line.
He's got a pretty good running game, top 10 easily.
He's got AJ Green as a #1 and believe me you can do much worse.
He's got RBs who are good receivers. Hill, Bernard and Burkhead are all good at catching the ball out of the backfield.
Sanu is a good slot guy and unfortunately he had to fill the #1 spot for a few games.
Gresham played decently last year. He'll never be a Rob Gronkowski or Jimmy Graham.
What Dalton doesn't have is a top notch coaching staff and he doesn't have good #4, 5 or 6 receivers. How Tate remains with this team baffles me.
Dalton had a poor running game in 2013 when he had his best season. In 2014 he ended up with a good running game, but no receivers.
(06-21-2015, 11:56 AM)fredtoast Wrote: Dalton had a poor running game in 2013 when he had his best season. In 2014 he ended up with a good running game, but no receivers.
That is true, won't argue that at all.
But, overall, the weapons are there and have been there. The talent surrounding Dalton is definitely better than average overall. It changes each year as guys come and go, but his supporting cast hasn't been bad and not nearly as bad as some Dalton homers claim it's been.
The knock on Dalton is largely the same knock the whole team gets and that's it doesn't show up at key times.
Whenever I read the excuses I just think of the Cleveland tape and go "yeah right". Matt Ryan would love to have our OL, running game and defense to play with. He's only had great receivers and little else.
(06-21-2015, 03:21 PM)BengalChris Wrote: That is true, won't argue that at all.
But, overall, the weapons are there and have been there. The talent surrounding Dalton is definitely better than average overall. It changes each year as guys come and go, but his supporting cast hasn't been bad and not nearly as bad as some Dalton homers claim it's been.
The knock on Dalton is largely the same knock the whole team gets and that's it doesn't show up at key times.
Whenever I read the excuses I just think of the Cleveland tape and go "yeah right". Matt Ryan would love to have our OL, running game and defense to play with. He's only had great receivers and little else.
I would agree on paper heading into 2014 AD had very good weapons. By week #1 after losing Jones, he had good weapons. By week #2 after losing Eifert, he had average weapons overall. Keep in mind Hill was non-existent the first half of 2014 as well.
Once AJ, Gresham, Wright and others were hurt (like Smith) he ended up with a below average cast of players in my opinion. By the playoff game, he had the worst skilled WR and TE group in the NFL. Some may say the injuries in 2014 were an excuse, I say when you add up the stats of players lost and insert those who played, it was a fact our group was very weak.
Free Agency ain't over until it is over.
First 6 years BB - 41 wins and 54 losses with 1-1 playoff record with 2 teams Browns and Pats
(06-11-2015, 12:46 PM)jj22 Wrote: I know this might get slammed. But they just need to let Dalton throw. He's a gunslinger (sure he lacks the arm that some like Farve have so he doesn't get away with the turnovers Farve and other's have gotten away with over their careers) and probably is less effective when he's playing scared to death to turn the ball over. Besides we saw last season it didn't really do much for him, and never let him get into a rhythm.
Sure I thought cutting his attempt would help, but it didn't. So they need to move on and let him throw. At least he'll get the yards and td's.
Folks would be surprised at how many "elite" qb's have far surpassed Daltons INT's high of 20 multiple times over their career. But because they are perceived to have strong arms they keep their elite status and get excused. Get called gunslingers etc....
Folks on this board even slam Dalton for his high INT's while claiming some of these other qb's are better even though over their careers they have far surpassed 20 int multiple times. Big Ben, Eli, Cutler..... The list goes on. Many of which has far surpassed Daltons Int high. Many multiple times over their careers.
(06-24-2015, 12:53 AM)Stormborn Wrote: Not quite the solution based on last year. We finishesd with more rushes than passes and his interception to attempt ratio still went up.
You can only run it so much.
The only true solution is less trips to McDonalds.
Wait... that's Chad. nvm
"The measure of a man's intelligence can be seen in the length of his argument."
(06-20-2015, 12:15 PM)PhilHos Wrote: In point of fact, it is incumbent on the author to make sure his or her writings are clearly understood by his or her readers. Only an incompetent writer blames the reader for not understanding his or her work.
First off, i am a musician. i can sing, play most brass instruments and the piano.
Secondly, It's 'embouchure'. Don't question someone's intelligence and then proceed to misspell words.
Lastly, your analogy still fails. I can play the trumpet but i don't call myself a trumpeter because i don't play professionally. If i did, i would refer to myself as a trumpeter even though I'm not that great a trumpeter (mainly cause i mainly play tuba and my embouchure makes my trumpet sound amateurish).
Yeah, cause that explains why Dalton set franchise records and McCarron was drafted in the 5th round and can't surpass the "struggling" Dalton.
You never mentioned a nickel. Like i said, it's the writer's responsibility to be clear. You weren't. Don't blame me for your poor writing skills.
Make me, Michael Myers.
...lol funny.
I have done this Bengals board stuff since , i don't know.. 2001? I see no need to explain myself nor my board name, avatar, mood, jock strap size, ...nothin'.... If you do not know by now, too bad. I do not participate much in back and forth rhetoric. It serves no purpose for me.. waste of my energy. You are right though, I did spell embouchure incorrectly, and I should be ashamed. Dalton still blows....
(06-13-2015, 04:51 PM)I Junglejuice Wrote: As much as that play will live in infamy, you gotta give him credit.
He is a tough guy and has a will to win that sometimes outshines his physical abilities.
Andy Dalton is not afraid to put his body on the line to make a play
Every time I see your avatar, can't help but think of the cowardly lion on wizard of oz.
The thing is that Dalton only has to catch lighting in a bottle once to have lighting in a bottle. One great season and the trip to the show is lighting in the bottle.
The part that battles me about nearly every fan of every team is people seem to forget that QBs don't play in a vacuum. They can play great, in which case the defense is seemingly awful or they can play terrible in which case the defense seems to be playing great. . It takes two to tango. . Sometimes the defense has a great game and sometimes it's the offense. .
In the immortal words of my old man, "Wait'll you get to be my age!"
Chicago sounds rough to the maker of verse, but the one comfort we have is Cincinnati sounds worse. ~Oliver Wendal Holmes Sr.
(06-25-2015, 10:06 PM)grampahol Wrote: The thing is that Dalton only has to catch lighting in a bottle once to have lighting in a bottle. One great season and the trip to the show is lighting in the bottle.
The part that battles me about nearly every fan of every team is people seem to forget that QBs don't play in a vacuum. They can play great, in which case the defense is seemingly awful or they can play terrible in which case the defense seems to be playing great. . It takes two to tango. . Sometimes the defense has a great game and sometimes it's the offense. .
Great post grampahol, but in my honest IMHO, Dalton needs to be more consistent and the defense. Dalton needs to step up and lead this team. I'm not Dalton homer by any means , but I will back him he is the starting qb for the bengals. I don't approve of some,of decisions he make. Until a better qb is proven I will pull for him do do good. As should all bengals fan.
Leatherface Wrote:I have done this Bengals board stuff since , i don't know.. 2001? I see no need to explain myself nor my board name, avatar, mood, jock strap size, ...nothin'.... If you do not know by now, too bad.
Just jumping on what the other dude said. I honestly never noticed that you're username was "Leatherface" but your avatar was Mike Myers. But, hey, to each his own ...
Leatherface Wrote:I do not participate much in back and forth rhetoric. It serves no purpose for me.. waste of my energy.
But, it's not a waste of your energy to spout nonsensical rhetoric like someone BEING a QB vs them PLAYING the QB position? <_< Child, please.
Leatherface Wrote:You are right though,
More people need to recognize this. Especially if we want a better world to live in.
Leatherface Wrote:I did spell embouchure incorrectly, and I should be ashamed.
Yes. Yes, you should.
Leatherface Wrote:Dalton still blows....
I didn't realize that Dalton played the trumpet. HEEEEEEEEEEEEY OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
(06-21-2015, 11:49 AM)BengalChris Wrote: The quality of the team matters a lot. But the Bengals have provided Dalton with a better supporting cast than most QBs get.
He's got a very good OL, certainly a top 5 line.
He's got a pretty good running game, top 10 easily.
He's got AJ Green as a #1 and believe me you can do much worse.
He's got RBs who are good receivers. Hill, Bernard and Burkhead are all good at catching the ball out of the backfield.
Sanu is a good slot guy and unfortunately he had to fill the #1 spot for a few games.
Gresham played decently last year. He'll never be a Rob Gronkowski or Jimmy Graham.
What Dalton doesn't have is a top notch coaching staff and he doesn't have good #4, 5 or 6 receivers. How Tate remains with this team baffles me. And I swear the Bengals used a Weegie board when deciding to sign Little.
What I cannot wait to see is actually having all of these weapons and healthy on the field at the same time.
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