Horrible pick in round 2. Remember when the bengals drafted Sean Brewer in round 3. They thought he sss a perfect TE. Guy smoked 3 packs s day n got a year or two later. This remind me of that pick.
Final thoughts on the TE pick. Things that add value when you evaluate the players and grade them are production and age because both strongly correlate with future success. Junior Sample lacks both as he was unproductive in college and he is 23. And you might knock the age but that just means you haven’t looked at it. It’s why Will Grier is still on the board, he’s 24. It means he probably doesn't have more room to grow. At least a 21 year old with a lack of production has room to grow and get better. With Sample he is what he is. He will be a decent blocking TE that catches 15 balls a year. He’s Kroft. Players rarely outdo their college production. He is a player you can get in the 4th round.
It is such a Bengal move reaching for a want over taking talent.
Thought you jumped on the Cleveland train last night.
(04-27-2019, 07:57 AM)yang Wrote: [ -> ]Yeah, that is pretty much exactly the point. They drafted for what they wanted with no idea of the players value and draft position. It is impossible to claim he was slotted there and you got value. I mean, we can get a blocking TE on the waiver wire or off the practice squad. But even if he turns out to be a Kroft was that worth a 2nd?
There was soooo much talent on the board in the 2nd you want value and an impact player. Many had Layne as the top rated corner in the draft. The dude wowed at the combine with unreal verticals and speed. He had production. He was young with room to grow. And now he is in Pittsburgh and we have to face him the next decade. And they show how a good team fixes as a defense. They traded up and got a LB and fixed their secondary.
We let Thornhill go has all pro safety potential. There was tons of WR’s and the Ravens too Jaylen Edwards who sack Dalton for the next decade because lord knows he is cheap so we’ll keep him.
We gave up Drew Lock for this blocking TE.
If anyone doesn't see how insane this pick was they are just a blind homer.
Everyone out there is calling it the worse pick of the draft.
LMAO....Lock must not be the boy wonder everyone thinks he is....Elway drafted him.
Seriously though....I don't get the hype. I watched him a few times, and I wasn't very impressed. In fact, he looked below average against Kentucky on his home field.
What I find funny in all of this.....if an expert says the kid sucks, "that guy knows his stuff!" If an expert says this kid is a good sleeper pick "that guy's a hack!"
The best part is, our TE coach actually PLAYED TE in the NFL, wanted this kid, but apparently doesn't know his ass from a hole in the ground. He obviously isn't the expert some of these pencil neck geeks on a website somewhere are.
(04-27-2019, 01:25 AM)rfaulk34 Wrote: [ -> ]Yes, it makes perfect sense in hindsight. But before that, you're essentially throwing a pick away and hoping it works out. The NFL of today isn't the NFL of 1999 when RK went in the 2nd round to the Falcons. Think about how the TE position has changed in just the last few years and where it's headed. No one drafts a blocking TE with the 2nd pick today when you can put just about anyone there to do the job, ala, Roland and Fisher.
No one except the Bengals, because Taylor comes from a system where that type of TE is used. There aren't very many teams that use TEs in that way anymore.
I'm not upset they picked him because i think he sucks. I'm not even upset they picked him period.
One thing is for sure. They will never get to see a 2nd round (insert position here), from this draft, inducted into the HOF, because they wasted the pick on a blocking TE that even they say "should be adequate" in the receiving game--who fits their current system.
I don't even know if this guy will work out.
I
do have to say it makes me
feel like when they picked Margus Hunt a while back(Margus was more of a project player so no I'm not comparing it in those terms).
He may have talent, he may contribute, but... 2nd round... WTF?
I'm not gonna bash him or defend the pick now.
It's just a really left field pick.
To deny that would be kind of silly by anyone.
The funny thing is I would have been okay with Hockenson in the 1st(maybe not at high as he went or even at 11)and an O-Lineman, LB, or BPA in the 2nd.
There's no denying that our TE group might be sketchy with just Eifert and UZ.
I just would have preferred a more pass catching skilled TE.
(04-27-2019, 12:55 AM)Bengalholic Wrote: [ -> ]I don't think it's just that Sample is a terrific inline blocker, which will be an important element - and specific need - in Taylor's offense. It's also that he's a very high character and work ethic guy, as well as being a film room junkie and a self proclaimed perfectionist in practice. I think all those things combined made Sample the pick. He fits what Taylor needs from a schematic point of view, but also from a locker room / culture mentality as well.
I can agree that he was picked too high based the on projections. He might have well been there in the 3rd. Hell, he might have still been available in the 4th. But, if Taylor views him as an important cog in his system and wanted to make sure he got him, I personally don't have an issue with them trading back and taking him in the 2nd, even if it's too high for him based on rankings.
While trading back seems to be the biggest gripe obviously The Bengals feel that Sample will give the team a new dynamic they didn't have last year. They also got an extra pick in round four. The total improvement that Sample and the other pick they got in the trade back will determine how this compared to just taking one player. Did they have this pick already penciled in and traded back for value? Smart. I think if we would get the #1 OT at #11 ahead of time we would be ecstatic. I believe having Sample will give the team a new type of threat that opposing defenses will have to adjust to. The third pick is going to shore up the weak linebacking corps. They are knocking it out of the park so far IMO.
(04-27-2019, 08:21 AM)yang Wrote: [ -> ]Final thoughts on the TE pick. Things that add value when you evaluate the players and grade them are production and age because both strongly correlate with future success. Junior Sample lacks both as he was unproductive in college and he is 23. And you might knock the age but that just means you haven’t looked at it. It’s why Will Grier is still on the board, he’s 24. It means he probably doesn't have more room to grow. At least a 21 year old with a lack of production has room to grow and get better. With Sample he is what he is. He will be a decent blocking TE that catches 15 balls a year. He’s Kroft. Players rarely outdo their college production. He is a player you can get in the 4th round.
It is such a Bengal move reaching for a want over taking talent.
You look foolish when you make statements bolded above. Sample was rated by PFF best blocking TE in this draft, better than Irv Smith.
(04-27-2019, 09:20 AM)BengalsRocker Wrote: [ -> ]I don't even know if this guy will work out.
I do have to say it makes me feel like when they picked Margus Hunt a while back(Margus was more of a project player so no I'm not comparing it in those terms).
He may have talent, he may contribute, but... 2nd round... WTF?
I'm not gonna bash him or defend the pick now.
It's just a really left field pick.
To deny that would be kind of silly by anyone.
The funny thing is I would have been okay with Hockenson in the 1st(maybe not at high as he went or even at 11)and an O-Lineman, LB, or BPA in the 2nd.
There's no denying that our TE group might be sketchy with just Eifert and UZ.
I just would have preferred a more pass catching skilled TE.
Oh.....it's way out in left field....like cheap seats left field. LOL.
(04-27-2019, 09:20 AM)BengalsRocker Wrote: [ -> ]I don't even know if this guy will work out.
I do have to say it makes me feel like when they picked Margus Hunt a while back(Margus was more of a project player so no I'm not comparing it in those terms).
He may have talent, he may contribute, but... 2nd round... WTF?
I'm not gonna bash him or defend the pick now.
It's just a really left field pick.
To deny that would be kind of silly by anyone.
The funny thing is I would have been okay with Hockenson in the 1st(maybe not at high as he went or even at 11)and an O-Lineman, LB, or BPA in the 2nd.
There's no denying that our TE group might be sketchy with just Eifert and UZ.
I just would have preferred a more pass catching skilled TE.
I agree, at first I was like who is he. We never scout the blocking TE's, we want the flashy TE who is like a WR (Eifert). But we have 2 very good pass catching TE's, so why get a 3rd when we have no blocking TE. He is rated the best blocking TE, that changes our running game and max protection passing game.
After some review and listening to logic from Casey abd Callahan, I have no oriblem with the pick now.
(04-27-2019, 08:21 AM)yang Wrote: [ -> ]Final thoughts on the TE pick. Things that add value when you evaluate the players and grade them are production and age because both strongly correlate with future success. Junior Sample lacks both as he was unproductive in college and he is 23. And you might knock the age but that just means you haven’t looked at it. It’s why Will Grier is still on the board, he’s 24. It means he probably doesn't have more room to grow. At least a 21 year old with a lack of production has room to grow and get better. With Sample he is what he is. He will be a decent blocking TE that catches 15 balls a year. He’s Kroft. Players rarely outdo their college production. He is a player you can get in the 4th round.
It is such a Bengal move reaching for a want over taking talent.
My guess is they dropped down 10 spots and thought they could still get Irv Smith...then he was gone and they took Sample.
I look at it like this: IF Eifert gets hurt, neither Uzomah or Sample are really receiving threats. The offense was way worse last year with Eifert injured and Uzomah in there. And they signed Uzomah, but still felt the need to draft a TE high so they obviously aren't sold on him as a TE1.
The hope is that this kid was way underutilized as a receiver in college. I doubt anyone really knows this. Had we taken him in the 4th Round, I think people would like the pick a lot more.
(04-27-2019, 09:43 AM)Wyche Wrote: [ -> ]Oh.....it's way out in left field....like cheap seats left field. LOL.
I may have missed something but I don't recall anyone anywhere talking about Sample as our 2nd round pick.
I could be wrong though.
(04-27-2019, 09:47 AM)THE PISTONS Wrote: [ -> ]
My guess is they dropped down 10 spots and thought they could still get Irv Smith...then he was gone and they took Sample.
I look at it like this: IF Eifert gets hurt, neither Uzomah or Sample are really receiving threats. The offense was way worse last year with Eifert injured and Uzomah in there. And they signed Uzomah, but still felt the need to draft a TE high so they obviously aren't sold on him as a TE1.
The hope is that this kid was way underutilized as a receiver in college. I doubt anyone really knows this. Had we taken him in the 4th Round, I think people would like the pick a lot more.
I strongly disagree. I think they hate Sample rated higher or the same as Irv Smith. Otherwise, they draft Smith and don't trade back if he was their man.
(04-27-2019, 09:47 AM)THE PISTONS Wrote: [ -> ]My guess is they dropped down 10 spots and thought they could still get Irv Smith...then he was gone and they took Sample.
I look at it like this: IF Eifert gets hurt, neither Uzomah or Sample are really receiving threats. The offense was way worse last year with Eifert injured and Uzomah in there. And they signed Uzomah, but still felt the need to draft a TE high so they obviously aren't sold on him as a TE1.
The hope is that this kid was way underutilized as a receiver in college. I doubt anyone really knows this. Had we taken him in the 4th Round, I think people would like the pick a lot more.
Exactly.
There are some on here that will go balls to the wall defending on Bengals picks.
Even though most are saying that the draft position of Sample is the issue.
Can't tell what he brings till he brings it.
This crap of waiting to judge him for 2 years is just damn silly though.
Our team needs to hit on plug and play type players NOW.
They didn't blow the team up and want to win with Dalton and the core so they'd better hit home runs on some of these top picks!
(04-27-2019, 09:48 AM)BengalsRocker Wrote: [ -> ]I may have missed something but I don't recall anyone anywhere talking about Sample as our 2nd round pick.
I could be wrong though.
I saw no one including experts talking about Ferrell being a top 20 pick, but Raiders took him at number 4. A top 5 to me is can't miss and no one had him as a can't miss other than the Raiders.
My point is teams do not look at opinion heads boards, they do homework and create their own board. Obviously Sample was on our board as top 3 or 4 TE option after the 2 Iowa TE's and on par with Irv Smith in their evaluation.
Give me Burr-Kiven with one of the 4th round picks today.
(04-27-2019, 09:46 AM)Luvnit2 Wrote: [ -> ]I agree, at first I was like who is he. We never scout the blocking TE's, we want the flashy TE who is like a WR (Eifert). But we have 2 very good pass catching TE's, so why get a 3rd when we have no blocking TE. He is rated the best blocking TE, that changes our running game and max protection passing game.
After some review and listening to logic from Casey abd Callahan, I have no oriblem with the pick now.
Like I said in another post/thread.
If he adds day one for dimensional blocking and a check-down option that would be a success.
Now if he gets loose downfield(it's shown he can do this on tape)every now and then or even be an option busted plays/PA fakes that's even better.
We don't know what we got until he shows it.
This team doesn't have a luxury to pick a 2nd rounder as depth or wait and see years from now if he'll pan out.
He needs to bring something immediately to the Bengals as a 2nd round pick.
No excuses. He will be scrutinized and be subjected to criticism just for that fact. Hope you understand this.
People need to relax a little bit. Watch some tape the guy is an excellent blocker and thats what this line needs. We have our pass catching TE in Eifert. Sample can catch too in fact he had no drops last year, he was just in a system that didn’t utilize TE as a receiving threat much.
I’m excited to see what this line will do this year and I’m excited for a lot of double TE sets, which it sounds like we utilize quite a bit.
(04-27-2019, 10:00 AM)thompson19osu Wrote: [ -> ]People need to relax a little bit. Watch some tape the guy is an excellent blocker and thats what this line needs. We have our pass catching TE in Eifert. Sample can catch too in fact he had no drops last year, he was just in a system that didn’t utilize TE as a receiving threat much.
I’m excited to see what this line will do this year and I’m excited for a lot of double TE sets, which it sounds like we utilize quite a bit.
That's just it...Eifert is fragile. We can't look at TE's as pass catching or blocking...and you certainly don't draft blocking only in the 2nd Round.
The Bengals HAVE to feel like this guy was underutilized in the passing game and that he will develop in that aspect here to use a 2nd Round pick on him. IF they don't...then it's an absolute reach.
And lets face it, they seem to be drafting for need more than a BAP strategy. That is typically when teams reach.