(03-22-2025, 12:47 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: I think Scott Peters has a plan and it’s not just finding glass eaters. I think between Volson, Patrick, Ford, and an early guard in the draft they will end there. This team has a lot of needs. They can’t address them all in the draft and FA. I’m predicting a much better OL. Jaxon Kirkland is the player to watch.

This is what worries me.

Scott Peters’ plan last year seemed to be to try and get a functional OL by coaching up UDFAs, Practice Squad guys and other replacement level players.

Was that all the Patriots gave him or was that all he told the Patriots he needed?

Agree on Kirkland btw.

(03-21-2025, 07:34 PM)Truck_1_0_1_ Wrote: Mbow is another in round 2 I'd be more than comfortable with: he looks great.

Campbell isn't going to make it to us IMO: if he does, I would race to the podium.

I'd be a little worried about Marcus Mbow in the Bengals system for at least the first year. 

He would probably feel more comfortable in a system that utilizes his athleticism. The Bengals heavy gap/drop back passing system it would test his core power and anchor which aren't his best qualities. 

Agree on Kirkland.

Ford tho is not a starting quality guard. Been there done that. He found his footing at tackle and there’s no reason to go back. He’s the swing tackle so that spot is locked in. We still need to add competition to the guard room. Players that can potentially solidify the spot going forward.

(03-23-2025, 07:43 AM)Essex Johnson Wrote: On a different angle but relevant, we rode the defense to SB in playoffs, and we missed last 2 yrs of playoffs more because of defense, subpar guard play is not the main issue to not getting and winning playoffs, but a subpar defense is, we need to focus on defense over our 2nd guard more.

And even while riding the defense in the playoffs, we BARELY beat a 3 INT Ryan Tannehill, because Burrow got sacked 9 times.

If Burrow isn't kept healthy, nothing else matters. Need to be able to pass protect and probably just as importantly, run the ball, for that.

I fully agree they need a better defense, but that doesn't mean you neglect the OL. Trenches on both sides should always be a priority if it's not currently good. Waaaay too many mentions of Kirkland, Ford, Volson, Lee. A sea of backups and PS players is not a solution unless the question is "how do we get Joe Burrow his 3rd Comeback Player of the Year award". (The DL at least theoretically have the higher round draft status to be some sort of reasonable-ish false hope of suddenly improving to be quality starters.)

(03-23-2025, 01:17 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: And even while riding the defense in the playoffs, we BARELY beat a 3 INT Ryan Tannehill, because Burrow got sacked 9 times.

If Burrow isn't kept healthy, nothing else matters. Need to be able to pass protect and probably just as importantly, run the ball, for that.

I fully agree they need a better defense, but that doesn't mean you neglect the OL. Trenches on both sides should always be a priority if it's not currently good. Waaaay too many mentions of Kirkland, Ford, Volson, Lee. A sea of backups and PS players is not a solution. (The DL at least theoretically have the higher round draft status to be some sort of reasonable-ish false hope.)

I agree, teams who build the trenches on both sides of the ball are more likely to have post season success.

I am hopeful we add a starting guard either Scherff or if healthy Hernandez (first choice if he is ready by TC). My 2nd choice is Risner. I am not sure why he is not on Bengal's or other guard needy team's radar.

(03-23-2025, 01:17 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: And even while riding the defense in the playoffs, we BARELY beat a 3 INT Ryan Tannehill, because Burrow got sacked 9 times.

If Burrow isn't kept healthy, nothing else matters. Need to be able to pass protect and probably just as importantly, run the ball, for that.

I fully agree they need a better defense, but that doesn't mean you neglect the OL. Trenches on both sides should always be a priority if it's not currently good. Waaaay too many mentions of Kirkland, Ford, Volson, Lee. A sea of backups and PS players is not a solution unless the question is "how do we get Joe Burrow his 3rd Comeback Player of the Year award". (The DL at least theoretically have the higher round draft status to be some sort of reasonable-ish false hope of suddenly improving to be quality starters.)

it is very difficult to keep any QB healthy and it seems those that do are able to play through it or just don;t get hurt as much as Burrow, i will still stand my the statement that we have had  a great offense last year with Burrow playing all year and missed playoffs not because of a average oline but because of a very bad Dline, now maybe the young players which you do need to give more time on Dline, as for ignoring guards, part of the problem is how much $$$ we have in skilled players on oline, but i like the one year signing of Patrick he will be an improvement at guard, with our solid tackles and steady centers, this line is better right now than the line we had in playoffs... focus on defense and we will get back into the hunt

(03-23-2025, 08:30 AM)TJHoushmandzadeh Wrote: This is what worries me.

Scott Peters’ plan last year seemed to be to try and get a functional OL by coaching up UDFAs, Practice Squad guys and other replacement level players.

Was that all the Patriots gave him or was that all he told the Patriots he needed?

Agree on Kirkland btw.

pretty simple as an assistant you coach with the hand they give you, i would not overthink that

I'm becoming more open to drafting OL early. The in-house options at guard are not good enough. If Booker or Banks are around, it needs to be a conversation.

At the very least, I think loading up on defense in both 1 and 2 is a bad idea. They will need a day 1 or 2 guard no matter what.

(03-23-2025, 08:15 PM)samhain Wrote: I'm becoming more open to drafting OL early.  The in-house options at guard are not good enough.  If Booker or Banks are around, it needs to be a conversation.  

At the very least, I think loading up on defense in both 1 and 2 is a bad idea.  They will need a day 1 or 2 guard no matter what.

This draft class is weak at OG and very strong on the DL and DE so you don't wanna reach for an OL when their will be more talented defensive players on the board. If they really like Ratledge I could see them taking him in the 2nd or 3rd.

Loading up on defense is exactly what we need(ed) to do.

The fact we can’t after not really turning over the defense as needed and adding an unnecessary need at safety by not signing a free agent, only highlight the the bubbling under grade for the team so far.

(03-23-2025, 08:15 PM)samhain Wrote: I'm becoming more open to drafting OL early.  The in-house options at guard are not good enough.  If Booker or Banks are around, it needs to be a conversation.  

At the very least, I think loading up on defense in both 1 and 2 is a bad idea.  They will need a day 1 or 2 guard no matter what.

Can't believe they haven't brought Risner in for a visit yet. He shouldn't cost that much,, and could be offset some by cutting Volson. He would automatically be an improvement in pass pro. I would also look at someone like Tristan Colon as a depth piece. 

On Guard they resigned Ford and signed Patrick. That would seem to be the reserves. So one more OG Free Agent and a draft pick would round out the room.

DL wise they already have 4 IDL (Slaton, Hill, Jackson and Jenkins) so I would expect them to be looking for EDGE, FS and LB. A lot depends on Golden's system.

(03-23-2025, 09:17 PM)jj22 Wrote: Loading up on defense is exactly what we need(ed) to do.

The fact we can’t after not really turning over the defense as needed and adding an unnecessary need at safety by not signing a free agent, only highlight the the bubbling under grade for the team so far.

For me it depends on who is available. 

I could easily draft offense the first two rounds: 

RD1: Warren/Loveland or Membou/W. Campbell 
RD2: Jackson/Zabel/Conerly

Then circle back for Edge & DT later. 

Rd3: Burch/Gillotte or Farmer
Rd4: Ivey or Robinson

Granted, except for Loveland, having one of those offensive guys available is unlikely. I'd only take Jackson on a trade back if none of the guys I really like are there (Walker, Warren, W. Campbell, Membou, Johnson, J. Campbell, Emmanwori). 

Starks & Loveland would be next on my board, but would not stop me from a good trade back deal. Nolen/Harmon/Grant or Jackson/Zabel pkus an extea Day 2 pick is a deal I'd make there. Plus, either guy could drop given their positions.

Just imagine what the O would be like with a decent FA guard (Hernandez, Scherff, Risner) + Warren/Loveland + a Day 2 guard. 

I think fixing the D is gonna be a multi-year process. No matter how we draft. Some slight improvement we already have baked in with L. Wilson, D. Hill, and Turner healthy. Slaton & Burks should help some. Continued improvement from Ossai, Jenkins, Jackson, D. Hill, Turner, and Battle is possible. Stone and Pratt should bounce back some from poor years. And Golden should help some. And even if we don't load up early, there is decent help to be found R3-R5. 

Marginal to substantial improvements on D plus an O that can deliver the coup de gras when given a chance late and our record looks a lot different last year. 

(03-23-2025, 09:14 PM)pulses Wrote: This draft class is weak at OG and very strong on the DL and DE so you don't wanna reach for an OL when their will be more talented defensive players on the board. If they really like Ratledge I could see them taking him in the 2nd or 3rd.

Yeah I'm fine with taking DL back to back if the talent is there.  They can get on the horn and shop a mid to late round pick to fit a need at guard if needed or possibly sign a leftover.  I have seen a few tackles that say they are better off at guard though so there may be more than it seems. Just have to pencil them in as depth for the learning curve. 

(03-23-2025, 10:14 PM)Eraserhead Wrote: Can't believe they haven't brought Risner in for a visit yet. He shouldn't cost that much,, and could be offset some by cutting Volson. He would automatically be an improvement in pass pro. I would also look at someone like Tristan Colon as a depth piece. 

At this point, we're talking almost 2 weeks since FA began, I would bet they will wait until after that draft, so that it lowers the price AND doesn't count towards compensatory formula.

I'm still not worried, we've made changes and I think we will make hay in the draft.

That's just me though 

(03-23-2025, 09:14 PM)pulses Wrote: This draft class is weak at OG and very strong on the DL and DE so you don't wanna reach for an OL when their will be more talented defensive players on the board. If they really like Ratledge I could see them taking him in the 2nd or 3rd.

Why I  thought it was a bit odd to sign 2 DT and no starting guards. 

(03-23-2025, 02:57 PM)Essex Johnson Wrote: it is very difficult to keep any QB healthy and it seems those that do are able to play through it or just don;t get hurt as much as Burrow, i will still stand my the statement that we have had  a great offense last year with Burrow playing all year and missed playoffs not because of a average oline but because of a very bad Dline, now maybe the young players which you do need to give more time on Dline, as for ignoring guards, part of the problem is how much $$$ we have in skilled players on oline, but i like the one year signing of Patrick he will be an improvement at guard, with our solid tackles and steady centers, this line is better right now than the line we had in playoffs... focus on defense and we will get back into the hunt

I think generally speaking we can trust a good defense than we can trust a good offense, i.e. this team pretty much should have been constructed with an above average D and let Burrow cook with whatever he's got on the other side.

If we could trust the Defense would give Burrow enough chances, I like that metric better than Burrow having to score every possession every game.

(Yesterday, 07:23 AM)reuben.ahmed Wrote: I think generally speaking we can trust a good defense than we can trust a good offense, i.e. this team pretty much should have been constructed with an above average D and let Burrow cook with whatever he's got on the other side.

If we could trust the Defense would give Burrow enough chances, I like that metric better than Burrow having to score every possession every game.

good point, KC is a good guide, Mahomes is great but their defense keeps them in the games and allow the 4th quarter comebacks that we see from KC... and our window is shorter now with the maga contracts we have given, probably a 3 year window before the bills start to come due. 

welcome to the jungle

(03-23-2025, 10:14 PM)Eraserhead Wrote: Can't believe they haven't brought Risner in for a visit yet. He shouldn't cost that much,, and could be offset some by cutting Volson. He would automatically be an improvement in pass pro. I would also look at someone like Tristan Colon as a depth piece. 

there will be another wave of FA after the draft when veterans that were just replaced get released as well