Storming Of The Capitol Building

[BigPapaKain]

(01-11-2021, 08:26 PM)GMDino Wrote: NG people I know are being called up to "active duty" because of the threats.  These right wingers are crazy and dangerous.

I wonder how dangerous that fine red mist they'll be reduced to will be...

[Au165]

FBI has stated there are now planned armed protests at all 50 state capitols. I’m sure nothing else bad will happen.

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(01-11-2021, 08:50 PM)Au165 Wrote: FBI has stated there are now planned armed protests at all 50 state capitols. I’m sure nothing else bad will happen.

As long as they are legal and peaceful I have zero issue with that.

[Belsnickel]

(01-11-2021, 08:19 PM)samhain Wrote: He may not but his followers will.  I expect violence at the inauguration for sure, or at least n DC when it takes place.  I also expect it in states.  The rhetoric is not being toned down in any way.  They are now cocooned on makeshift social media startups hyperventilating and being exposed to even more extreme right propaganda.  I'm talking Q types and actual unapologetic white separatists.  

This country, I'm afraid, is getting ready to deal with a true facist movement that has no inclination to pretend it's part of any party other than the cult of MAGA.  

It's going to get ugly(er).  Act accordingly.

There is a plan in the works for them to do it, again, on the 17th. Though with so many of them already facing consequences, I don't know how likely it will be.

[Belsnickel]

2 Capitol Officers suspended

https://news.yahoo.com/2-capitol-police-officers-suspended-232057662.html?guccounter=1&guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly90LmNvLw&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAAGn3jScxHleKaWIN5FvRP6LRGIW7M8AhzIr38jB_z-8BIrqcQZskJTqHI1CT4DHcerzhqaH7AA9Oz8KxZqlBF8BCPU7jXWIBg-nfychNpXC3_5PDDWoJGuwDw1niF89pheuKH6RoI7Qm7UeSRxn-STgrTKHaRIu04CQ7pJcYLSQy

Quote:Two U.S. Capitol Police officers were suspended and at least 10 more are under investigation over the deadly pro-Trump insurrection last week, a congressman said Monday.

Rep. Tim Ryan, D-Ohio, who chairs one of the committees that oversees the federal law enforcement agency, told reporters that one of the officers was suspended immediately for appearing to take a selfie with members of the mob.

Another officer was suspended after he was seen with a Make American Great Again hat on and directing people inside the building, Ryan said.

Ryan did not identify the officers. During the Zoom call, Ryan said he believed that one officer had been arrested but a spokesman later clarified that the congressman misspoke. There have been no arrests, the spokesman said.

Ryan said another 10-15 officers were being investigated, though he couldn't provide details on the extent of those investigations.

“The main point is the Capitol police are looking at everybody involved that could have potentially facilitated at a big level or a small level,” he said.

A spokeswoman for the department did not immediately respond to a request for comment.

The apparent arrest and suspensions come days after the department’s chief, Steven Sund, announced his resignation over the events of Jan. 6, and amid intense scrutiny over the department’s response to the mob’s assault on the Capitol.

Five people died during the assault, including Capitol police officer Brian Sicknick, who was reportedly bludgeoned with a fire extinguisher.

I do have to wonder about any of the officers that may have been complicit. How are they handling knowing their actions may have resulted in the deaths of two of their co-workers?

[Au165]

(01-11-2021, 09:14 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: 2 Capitol Officers suspended

I do have to wonder about any of the officers that may have been complicit. How are they handling knowing their actions may have resulted in the deaths of two of their co-workers?

10-15 more under investigation I just saw.

[Arturo Bandini]

(01-11-2021, 09:02 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: As long as they are legal and peaceful I have zero issue with that.

Sure they will be.

Always look like decent mobs wearing Maga Hats ...

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(01-11-2021, 09:24 PM)Au165 Wrote: 10-15 more under investigation I just saw.

That could easily be as simple as not following procedure to the letter during the incident.  After any incident like this they will inevitably look to scapegoat people.  I'm sure some people did some improper things and some just made mistakes.  They'll all likely be lumped together in a huge bloodletting due to how huge the incident was.

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(01-11-2021, 09:43 PM)Arturo Bandini Wrote: Sure they will be.

Always look like decent mobs wearing Maga Hats ...

There's been at least as much violence and criminal conduct at BLM and Antifa demonstrations and riots.  That doesn't mean either group should be prohibited from protesting peacefully or any other group.  I know in Europe you have a much looser sense of speech rights, but in the US every group has the right to protest peacefully.

[samhain]

(01-11-2021, 09:13 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: There is a plan in the works for them to do it, again, on the 17th. Though with so many of them already facing consequences, I don't know how likely it will be.

I think there will be violence.  It's just a matter of scale.  The crazies have been shunned by and separated from the traditional conservatives.  The old party line Republicans are going to go right next to the commie liberals on the enemies list in short order.  These people do not give one shit about Dem vs Republican.  They are a cult and only one outcome is acceptable to them.  

It's probably a good time for both parties to recognize this and come together to find a way to stop them before they metasasize beyond what they already are.  The Beer Hall Putsch resulted in the imprisonment of the would be leader post-revolt.  He came back stronger with even more support from a wider base.  This can't be allowed to happen here.

As I said before, be aware of what's about to happen to this country, and avoid repeating history.

[GMDino]

(01-11-2021, 09:14 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: 2 Capitol Officers suspended

https://news.yahoo.com/2-capitol-police-officers-suspended-232057662.html?guccounter=1&guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly90LmNvLw&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAAGn3jScxHleKaWIN5FvRP6LRGIW7M8AhzIr38jB_z-8BIrqcQZskJTqHI1CT4DHcerzhqaH7AA9Oz8KxZqlBF8BCPU7jXWIBg-nfychNpXC3_5PDDWoJGuwDw1niF89pheuKH6RoI7Qm7UeSRxn-STgrTKHaRIu04CQ7pJcYLSQy


I do have to wonder about any of the officers that may have been complicit. How are they handling knowing their actions may have resulted in the deaths of two of their co-workers?

I'm not too surprised that a couple (or 10-15) were compromised.  A cult is indiscriminate in who it can bring in to the fold.

Probably a few more "I was caught up in the moment" defenses coming.

But again this feeds into the optics of an overwhelmingly white mob breaking down doors and windows and stealing and the police, not matter how few, guiding them in and taking photos with them vs say the gassing of people so Trump could have a photo op because it was  one minute until curfew.

Bad look.

[GMDino]

(01-11-2021, 09:54 PM)samhain Wrote: I think there will be violence.  It's just a matter of scale.  The crazies have been shunned by and separated from the traditional conservatives.  The old party line Republicans are going to go right next to the commie liberals on the enemies list in short order.  These people do not give one shit about Dem vs Republican.  They are a cult and only one outcome is acceptable to them.  

It's probably a good time for both parties to recognize this and come together to find a way to stop them before they metasasize beyond what they already are.  The Beer Hall Putsch resulted in the imprisonment of the would be leader post-revolt.  He came back stronger with even more support from a wider base.  This can't be allowed to happen here.

As I said before, be aware of what's about to happen to this country, and avoid repeating history.

Gonna be hard when they were already "fringe" and they found the golden idol in Trump and will only believe what he says

[GMDino]

I'd like to see some these GOPPOS charged too...

Never forget that a member of Congress tweeted this on the day there was a violent insurrection at the US Capitol and he tagged a criminal grifter who helped to lead this traitorous conspiracy. https://t.co/8HJBp9am4j

— Yashar Ali ? (@yashar) January 11, 2021

 

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(01-11-2021, 10:25 PM)GMDino Wrote: I'm not too surprised that a couple (or 10-15) were compromised.  A cult is indiscriminate in who it can bring in to the fold.

Probably a few more "I was caught up in the moment" defenses coming.

But again this feeds into the optics of an overwhelmingly white mob breaking down doors and windows and stealing and the police, not matter how few, guiding them in and taking photos with them vs say the gassing of people so Trump could have a photo op because it was  one minute until curfew.

Bad look.

Well, it didn't take long from "we feel bad for the LEO's who were injured/killed" to, "they were complicit!" from the far left.  GM is a good weathervane in this regard.  I'm sure the strain of pretending was getting to them. 

[Benton]

(01-11-2021, 10:43 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: Well, it didn't take long from "we feel bad for the LEO's who were injured/killed" to, "they were complicit!" from the far left.  GM is a good weathervane in this regard.  I'm sure the strain of pretending was getting to them. 

I dunno, ssf. The last several days my social media has been flooded from my right leaning friends with "it's the leos fault" or "the leos are part of the conspiracy." 

The far right has turned on the thin blue line quickly and ugly. 

[GMDino]

(01-11-2021, 10:50 PM)Benton Wrote: I dunno, ssf. The last several days my social media has been flooded from my right leaning friends with "it's the leos fault" or "the leos are part of the conspiracy." 

The far right has turned on the thin blue line quickly and ugly. 

Is pointing out that cults attract everyone no matter who they are or what they do turning on LEO's by the left?

Weird.

However I do think the "bad apples" should be removed and the good apples praised.

And FTR my conservative friends have said zero about the police that day other than to remark on the ones that died. Everything else is "it was really Antifa" and "democrats don't want unity".

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(01-11-2021, 10:50 PM)Benton Wrote: I dunno, ssf. The last several days my social media has been flooded from my right leaning friends with "it's the leos fault" or "the leos are part of the conspiracy." 

The far right has turned on the thin blue line quickly and ugly. 

Oh, to be sure.  It's almost like advocating for us is a tool.  It's great being shit on by everyone. 

[Benton]

(01-11-2021, 11:19 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: Oh, to be sure.  It's almost like advocating for us is a tool.  It's great being shit on by everyone. 

Agreed, unfortunately.

My brother is a deputy and part of a militia, as he felt there was a nasty liberal essence in government. Hes having a hard time wrapping his head around the last few days. 

[Bengalzona]

(01-11-2021, 10:43 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: Well, it didn't take long from "we feel bad for the LEO's who were injured/killed" to, "they were complicit!" from the far left.  GM is a good weathervane in this regard.  I'm sure the strain of pretending was getting to them. 

There were a lot of people on the Left really hounding the Capitol Police just as soon as the pictures came out showing a couple of them not pounding people in the heads with billy clubs. As I stated at that time (on FB), I think the Capitol Police did a reasonably good job considering the circumstances. A lot of people do not want to hear that. But then again, most of those people have never faced a mob or a riot, particularly when the numbers are so massively against you.

The number one job of the Capitol Police is to protect the lives of the Congresspeople (and the VP if he is there, as well). They accomplished that. They held the mob outside for ninety minutes without reinforcements. Protecting the property is a secondary mission. Obviously, they had some problems there. Considering the situation, I don't blame them for concentrating on their primary mission. It is what you do.

I watched a few of the videos of the confrontations this weekend, especially the one at the West Entrance and the one where the woman was shot. Those cops were not doning MAGA caps and throwing open their arms. They were doing their best to maintain a secure perimeter without drawing their weapons (for the most part). They acted very professionally. The ones at the West Entrance held, despite being battered by a human battering ram. In the situation where the woman was shot, they had three officers without body armor forming a human shield in front of the glass doors where Congress had retreated and facing a hallway crowded with mob members. Behind the door were other officers with their weapons drawn. The three were ordered to stand aside once the officers behind them were in position, primarily because they did not have body armor and were seriously outnumbered and in close contact. They did not stand aside to "let people in". When the mob battered the glass and the woman tried to climb through, the officers behind them opened fire. Afterwards,  those three officers knelt over the woman and tried to give first aid.

The death of officer Sidnick is a true tragedy. Apparently, he was beaten with fire extinguisher. I hope they hunt down the thugs who did this and bring them to justice. Moreover, I think most of the members of the mob would also agree with this sentiment. Therefore, I have high hopes that they will find them.

I'm a bit more judgmental about Trump refusing to fly the White House flag at half staff in honor of the fallen officers until he was finally pressured into it on Sunday. The reluctance tells me everything I ever needed to know about that guy.

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(01-11-2021, 11:24 PM)Benton Wrote: Agreed, unfortunately.

My brother is a deputy and part of a militia, as he felt there was a nasty liberal essence in government. Hes having a hard time wrapping his head around the last few days. 

Understandably so.  Being shit on by the left for the past nine months and then being "betrayed" by the right in this instance, it's a tough pill to swallow.  I think at the end of the day we're all just looking for people to understand that this is a tough job that we won't always get 100% correct.  Understanding that, and allowing for it, is all we really ask for.  There are people who suck at their job in every single profession, it just bothers me that the media and other detractors have been allowed to paint our entire profession with that brush.

(01-11-2021, 11:29 PM)Bengalzona Wrote: There were a lot of people on the Left really hounding the Capitol Police just as soon as the pictures came out showing a couple of them not pounding people in the heads with billy clubs. As I stated at that time (on FB), I think the Capitol Police did a reasonably good job considering the circumstances. A lot of people do not want to hear that. But then again, most of those people have never faced a mob or a riot, particularly when the numbers are so massively against you.

The number one job of the Capitol Police is to protect the lives of the Congresspeople (and the VP if he is there, as well). They accomplished that. They held the mob outside for ninety minutes without reinforcements. Protecting the property is a secondary mission. Obviously, they had some problems there. Considering the situation, I don't blame them for concentrating on their primary mission. It is what you do.

I watched a few of the videos of the confrontations this weekend, especially the one at the West Entrance and the one where the woman was shot. Those cops were not doning MAGA caps and throwing open their arms. They were doing their best to maintain a secure perimeter without drawing their weapons (for the most part). They acted very professionally. The ones at the West Entrance held, despite being battered by a human battering ram. In the situation where the woman was shot, they had three officers without body armor forming a human shield in front of the glass doors where Congress had retreated and facing a hallway crowded with mob members. Behind the door were other officers with their weapons drawn. The three were ordered to stand aside once the officers behind them were in position, primarily because they did not have body armor and were seriously outnumbered and in close contact. They did not stand aside to "let people in". When the mob battered the glass and the woman tried to climb through, the officers behind them opened fire. Afterwards,  those three officers knelt over the woman and tried to give first aid.

The death of officer Sidnick is a true tragedy. Apparently, he was beaten with fire extinguisher. I hope they hunt down the thugs who did this and bring them to justice. Moreover, I think most of the members of the mob would also agree with this sentiment. Therefore, I have high hopes that they will find them.

I'm a bit more judgmental about Trump refusing to fly the White House flag at half staff in honor of the fallen officers until he was finally pressured into it on Sunday. The reluctance tells me everything I ever needed to know about that guy.

I agree with literally everything you said here.  Kudos to you both.